The SIG P320 Has Problems, and We Have Questions

The following is the opinion of the author, and his alone. It does not represent the views of The Firearm Blog or any other TFB staff member. But I bet it represents the views of many of our readers.

I think SIG owes the gun world some answers. We’ve seen behavior from them over the past nine days that is not only unbecoming of a major manufacturer (such as lying to a major police department), but bizarre and inexplicable (such as saying drop safeties “legitimize mishandling”). And so, we have questions.

SIG chose to design the P320 as a striker-fired handgun with a relatively high mass metal trigger with no trigger safety – despite the fact that this safety feature has been included on almost every striker-fired handgun since the 1970s. Why? Trigger safeties are ugly, but functional and if designed properly do not interfere with the trigger’s feel. Did SIG leave this off the firearm for aesthetic, or maybe cost reasons? Did they believe the gun would sell better with a trigger that looked more “SIG” than “Glock”? Why was such an obvious safety feature omitted from a firearm that clearly needed it?

When the decision was made to omit this feature – and this decision was consciously made at some point, as SIG initially advertised a trigger safety as an option for the P320 – was any testing involved? Did SIG make this decision sight unseen without even determining its impact to the pistol’s safety characteristics, or – worse – did they make the decision in spite of evidence that it would reduce the gun’s safety?

At what point during the Modular Handgun System program did the drop safety issue resurface? Was it before or after their pistol was selected by the Army to be the M17? Did the US Army request the changes to the trigger’s design, or did SIG make these changes on their own? Why didn’t SIG begin rolling out P320s with safety triggers – which they had already designed – at this point in time, instead of waiting for it to blow up in their face?

How long has SIG known about Vincent Sheperis’ injury, which occurred eight months ago? It seems difficult to believe that SIG would not be promptly notified about this incident, so have they known their pistol’s defect had already caused someone injury for that entire time, without notifying the public? If so, why didn’t they speak up then?

When the Dallas Police Department rescinded authorization to use the P320, why didn’t SIG take that opportunity to admit the issue and make the changes they already had in the pipeline? Why convince the Dallas PD they were mistaken about an issue that SIG was obviously fully aware of at the time? Why lie, especially when the issue is so easy for third parties to independently verify? If anything, the Dallas PD’s announcement would seem to me to be the ideal time for SIG to come clean: A prompt, honest response would throw light on SIG as a company that takes user concerns seriously and acts quickly to fix them, and it doesn’t hurt that the recall occurred after Glock’s MHS protest had been rejected, either. It’s not like doing this would have been more expensive or difficult for SIG. The company appears to have had already arranged the media event announcing the MHS trigger upgrade, around or even before the time of the Dallas PD’s decision. So why not then?

SIG’s actual behavior has had the opposite effect, though. It makes one wonder: If SIG will dismiss the complaints of one of the largest police departments in the country – complaints about a problem they have known is real for months, possibly since before the pistol was even released –  then how will the company treat the average Joe who has a problem? What does it say about a company whose CEO not only believes safety features just encourage negligence, but will say that publicly during a media event as part of damage control for a drop safety scandal?

I am not SIG’s enemy. I stood up for SIG and called out Glock’s narrative about MHS, even though I personally prefer Glock handguns. However, SIG’s practices and behavior – not just over the past few days but since even before the P320’s release – compel me to ask the question: What the heck are you guys thinking, SIG?



Nathaniel F

Nathaniel is a history enthusiast and firearms hobbyist whose primary interest lies in military small arms technological developments beginning with the smokeless powder era. In addition to contributing to The Firearm Blog, he runs 196,800 Revolutions Per Minute, a blog devoted to modern small arms design and theory. He is also the author of the original web serial Heartblood, which is being updated and edited regularly. He can be reached via email at nathaniel.f@staff.thefirearmblog.com.


Advertisement

  • BravoSeven

    What? There’s a problem with the Sig P320? When did this happen? Why are we just now hearing about it?

    • Bill

      You haven’t heard that the probability of getting accidentally shot by a falling SIG P320 is far less than being struck by lightning or being killed by an elephant? My god man, you’re missing a great panic. Take some extra umbrage pills to make up for it.

      • DC

        I hope u don’t ever drop lightening at your feet or have an elephant in your house then lol cuz it’s a real thing if u don’t believe it go ahead and drop your P320 at your feet and see if it happens just please don’t have anyone else in the house when u do so, so they don’t get struck by lightening along with u lol

        • Bill

          LOL i’d have to drop it at precisely the right angle and it would have to be pointed at precisely the right direction fro me to get hit LOL and the fact that it happened to one guy (maybe LOL) doesn’t meant that the 499,000 others of us are about to lol die lol.

          I’m going to the zoo today hope I don’t get trampled lol.

          • DC

            One guy lol there have been how many independent tests that prove u don’t have to drop it at “precisely” the rite angle for it to go off calm down dude u must b one of those people that just because u have it it’s the best there ever was and cannot possibly anything wrong with it, then go ahead with your bad self carry on I don’t have time for stupidity. End Transmission

          • Bill

            Apparently you don’t have time for punctuation, either.

            Yes, I have a P320. It was purchased as a training gun due to their popularity and prevalence. I carry a P226 on duty and a GLOCK as a backup and occasionally off duty.

            Many, many guns, including GLOCKS, Berettas, Rugers, S&Ws and yes, SIGs have had issues. This too shall pass.

          • DC

            No i don’t have time sorry I have a real job and busy working it to pay for your lousy one so you can “train” all the time to get ready to push us all around but one question if u get rid of all us hard working folks that have real jobs whos gonna pay for yours. Sorry bout all police are bad I do believe most want too help just some like this guy have nothing better to do than troll around

          • Robcart944

            DC, you trolled him first.

          • DC

            Who’s trolling now lol that was days ago dude plz just let it go! I have. I’m over this whole conversation how on earth is this still going

          • Bill

            Yes, they have. What they didn’t have was the thick headed policy of waiting until the entire forest was burning to look for an extinguisher.

          • Jim Kiser

            Hi DC, I believe the guy got shot in the leg about 8 months ago. I’ve been hearing stories about the drop and fires for maybe the last 5 months. My stepdad owns one so I keep my ear open. It’s really a shame about them arguing with the police station when they had more than one incident themselves. I really like SIG. I hope they get their act together soon.

          • DC

            And thanks for caring for others as long as u don’t get hit it’s all good lmao wow! Now End Transmission

      • William Grubel

        Better hope that elephant isn’t loaded when you drop it.

    • Zebra Dun

      Folks went to hitting them with hammers for some foolish reason!

  • xebat

    So guys, does this mean the US Armed Forces will now decide not to arm their servicemen with the P320 ?

    • Unlikely – nor do I think they should do so. A bird in the hand and all that…

      • Joshua Graham

        A bird in the hand and a bullet in the knee.

        • I used to be a soldier like you, until…

          • Evan

            You carried a Glock?

            Sorry, couldn’t resist.

  • James Ivy

    I had the thought that keeping quiet about the officer being accidentally shot by there inefficient firearm that they were letting the ink dry a little more with the mhs program and get more guns to us military making its roots deeper before resolving the issue and therefore harder to be pulled out of the ground roots and all

    • Letting the ink dry on MHS is a little scummy, but it at least makes sense – but why cover up the thing in Dallas!?

      • Flash Gordon

        What was covered up in Dallas?

        • It’s in the article.

          • Flash Gordon

            The 6th paragraph makes an assumption that Sig was aware of the -30 degree drop issue at the time of the DPD issue. Do we know this for a fact? “That had to know” won’t cut it for this exercise. If so please point to a source and outline. DPD did not rescind on an actual physical drop test of their own. It was a new LT reading and older version of an owners manual. When sig cleared that up DPD was good. DPD had not even issued the P320 yet. Then Omaha tested. As a result Sig tested and came out with statement in full detail about the issue, what they could have done better and what their plan is going forward with more to come. This is hardly a Sig cover up. The DPD issue and -30 drop are two different issues.

          • We can deduce they knew, since they had already created the fix for it by then.

          • Flash Gordon

            Deduction still is not known or admitted fact. During Sigs -30 degree drop testing the changed out FCUs with that of an M17 and the drop failure stopped. The M17 FCU updates were result feedback from users on trigger pulls and the double click issues and not to solve a drop isssue.

          • There are many reasons to believe they already knew, which is why I ask in the post whether they did or not – and if not, why not? Since the issue was so trivial to discover, evidently.

          • Kivaari

            SIG had to know. They had reports of guns discharging when dropped. They had a fix ready the day the Omaha video hit the internet. I’ll never buy another SIG and I used to like them 30 years ago.

          • Juanito Ibañez

            “DPD had not even issued the P320 yet.”

            Dallas PD doesn’t “issue” Sig P320s – only authorize individual officer purchase and use…after qualification with the weapon. The “issue” sidearm is the P226R DAK in 9mm or, for the “small-handed,” the Sig P239 DAK in 9mm. In addition to individual purchase/use of the P320, the P226R DAK in .357 SIG is authorized – but not issued.

      • RealitiCzech

        You admit fault, you pretty much automatically lose the lawsuit, the only question is how much do you have to pay out.

  • wetcorps

    BREAKING : corporate leaders put short term profit above everything else.
    More at 11.

    • Trotro

      Well MY favorite gun company wouldn’t do such a thing….

    • no skin in the game

      no less that TFB “screw the poltics of this, milk it for clicks”

      especially when they post old unedited versions of articles to FB 5 days later

  • Madison J Coleman

    I love TFB but I am going to have to stop coming here for a couple weeks until you guys get this crap out of your system. It’s like watching political coverage of the last presidential election, non stop and SUPER annoying. The dead horse has been beaten, the bones are now dust, the dust is now sprouting grass… For the love of Sig move on.

    • Flash Gordon

      ^This

    • Probably a hazard of the format, what with a bunch of different writers here and all. This is just the second article I’ve written on it, and I don’t plan to do any more.

      • There are quite a few sites like that, except they have an EIC that will say “We’ve already done enough posts on this topic, this doesn’t add anything new.” and reject the article.

        • Ours evidently does not feel that way this time.

          • Well perhaps you should look into one, because TFB’s coverage of this story is way past the “this is interesting phase” and well into the “beating a dead horse into the ground” phase.

          • We have an EIC. He’s pretty hands-off though. Advantages and disadvantages to that.

          • no skin in the game

            it comes across as milking the clickbait and algorithms when 5 day old un-updated articles are being posted to Facebook – that’s not a hands off EIC, that’s ludicrous

            Hands off is one thing but that last part comes across as integrity be damned, go for clicks

          • I understand how it comes off. Not anything I can do about it.

          • txJM

            Of course not. Clicks rule. Ethics suck.

      • Tom Currie

        The biggest “hazard of the format” at TFB is your total reliance of clickbait to get any readers.

        In number two position would be asinine crap like “Why was such an obvious safety feature omitted from a firearm that clearly needed it?” Did it ever occur to you that there might NOT have been any “obvious” need during the design stage of the P320? Remember that this pistol 100% passed the standard drop tests specified by the military, which are the same tests used by other agencies such as PDs (if they do ANY testing), and yes, the same tests used my every major firearms manufacturer.

        The DPD part of this story is a complete red herring – although it got a lot more publicity over nothing more than a lack of reading comprehension at DPD upper echelons, compared to the one instance of a P320 that apparently did fire when dropped (yes, the drop was really stupid operator error, but the point is that the gun DID fire)

        But please – let’s not spend the next six months whining about What Did He Know And When Did He Know It and searching for the infamous missing 18 minutes of tape from the Nixon Whitehouse.

        • You make it sound like we’re desperate for readers, when in reality we’re the number 1 gun blog in the world by a good margin.

          There are a lot of readers who call “clickbait” anything they don’t like. Whatever. There’s nothing clickbait about this article, or really anything else I write. I don’t mislead readers, I don’t put out empty content, and if you’re so sensitive to SEO-optimized titles that you can’t handle it, then don’t read stuff written for publications that check their Alexa rankings.

          • Mystick

            I don’t see you “clickbaiting”… the headlines are usually pretty succinct and on-point… and there’s not the volume of articles where it would necessitate competition, and most aren’t linked from external aggregators where competition with other publications exist – It’s a single page linear progression of articles that most readers look at until they come upon something new.

            I do wish there were viable alternatives to WordPress – is sucks in so many ways(sometimes toxic ad scripts, multiple postings of the same article, etc…)

          • Tom Currie

            It’s not a matter of articles I like or don’t like — it’s a matter of articles that 1) Have headlines that are NOT accurate for the story; or 2) Have headlines and stories that are NOT accurate to the facts. TFB is hardly alone in this – we have all seen how mainstream media jumped in on the Back To School sign that was supposedly on a Walmart gun display, when in fact no one has confirmed that the photo was real – and, of course, the false claims that it was at an Evansville Indiana Walmart.

            Among the MANY clickbait techniques that TFB uses regularly (and with increasing frequency lately) are the constant overuse of the word BREAKING, when at best you mean half-assed incomplete speculation.

            It’s bad enough when you use “BREAKING” the first time you publish such nonsense, but a week or a month later you are still sending out emails pushing the same article, still of course with the same “BREAKING” headline, even when TFB has already published follow-up stories that proved (but never admitted) that the original article was incorrect.

      • Mystick

        Thank you.

    • ro

      oh, Madison (said with a low, breathy voice) we will miss you so…..NOT….maybe go to ENDO for real good coverage of firearm issues (he says laughing)….

    • Mark Timney

      TFB is providing important coverage and varied opinion on a real news story. I don’t understand how you could ask them to “move on” when people’s lives are at risk and when it may be Sig lied about the safety of this gun. ?????

      • Bill

        A zillion more people are going to die from infections they get while hospitalized than are going to get hurt by falling SIGs, at the rate these incidents are occurring. Definitely don’t drive your car.

      • Ebby123

        People’s live are not at risk any more than the hundreds of thousands of current production guns that can be made to fire if their hit/dropped hard enough in the right manner.

        Sig pistol is very safe, but because its very high profile people hold it to a higher standard. Makes sense, but lets not get carried away here.

        • Kivaari

          SIG is not being held to a higher standard. I expect every pistol to be drop afe. SIG is being held to that standard. Don’t fire if dropped, like my Glocks.

      • Sliced Veggie

        Lives really aren’t at risk. Not anymore than any other negligent discharge. No need to be hyperbolic about it. The gun is safe and has passed every regulated drop safety test. I’ll bet you can find some more guns that will go off if you smack them with a hammer and I’ll bet they come from brands other than sig.

        Point is, it’s a RARE occurrence to drop a gun. And even more rare for this type of discharge to happen. If you think otherwise, then I question your handling skills. I’ve never, not once, dropped a firearm in my over 30+ years of handling them. Now accidents happen, I get it, but this type of accident shouldn’t happen if handled correctly, especially with the specific manner in which this must happen to occur.

      • Dan

        There has been very little new information in all of their posts. Gun goes off when dropped. Well gee lets whack it with a hammer see what happens…..oh golly it fires. That isn’t a surprise. If my gun fires when i drop it, im probably going to refrain from whacking it on the back. This was a 3 post story tops.

    • JeffL

      I have no problem with their coverage about this at all. If you do not like it. Exercise your freedom and just don’t click to view the article. Problem solved after all It is a free country and no one is forcing you to read all the articles. I know I do not do so since I pick and choose the topics I want to read.

      • Ebby123

        He can also exercise his freedom to publicly disagree in the hopes that someone will change their ways. =)

  • Major Tom

    Sure is a lot of fake news hyperventilating over an “issue” that has yet to actually cause either an AD or ND, has been offered a solution and doesn’t exist in their military option the M17 MHS.

    • You miss the guy who got shot 8 months ago? Cuz his SIG didn’t.

      • Major Tom

        To be honest that case sounds suspect. The P320 has been around for a while and we’ve (allegedly) had only one instance? Either the failure in question is borderline impossible to cause under normal circumstances or this guy is trying to cover his own stupidity.

        • Seems like you’ve got your blinders on, buddy.

          • Pseudo

            I’ve found a useful rule of thumb is that anyone spouting “fake news” is using it to express their personal dissatisfaction with the content of something rather than its the objective value of that content and is thus probably not worth arguing with. YMMV.

        • Anon

          Read the Soldier Systems article, and it refers to 3 law enforcement incidents and one not officially reported civilian incident.

          • Bill

            And it puts it in the context of a half million guns in the field, which is a failure rate of 0.000006%, if I counted my zeros correctly. I think that’s 6 millionth of one percent.

          • That’s actually an incident rate, not a failure rate. If all guns have this problem, then that’s a failure rate of 100%, not 0.000006%.

          • Bill

            I respectfully disagree, though we are probably arguing about semantics. Subpopulation n of Pintos burst into flames, but not all of N Pintos did so, so arguing, in the statistical sense, that all N Pintos failed exaggerates the number of Pintos that actually burned.

            I suppose you could say that all V22 Ospreys are barely flying deathtraps, though more have successfully taken off and landed without incident than have fallen out of the sky. There’s a known risk, just as there may be now with the 320. Whether that risk is statistically significant is a whole different story. I’d be a lot more nervous in an Osprey than I’d be carrying a 320.

            Obviously, carrying a 320 actually IN an Osprey is the kiss of death.

          • Grey Beard

            Especially when taking off or landing behind a Pinto.

          • Sliced Veggie

            And look who didn’t respond to your rebuttal.

          • Mystick

            Failure mode and failure rate are two different beasts.

        • Paul Rain

          Or manufacturing tolerances are real.

      • txJM

        Allegedly.

      • Bill

        A filed lawsuit proves nothing, except in the end, and even then it is mainly which side had the better lawyer.

        The most common shotgun in police work, the Remington 870 isn’t drop safe and has accounted for many discharges, at least one resulting in a shot cop when a gun was dropped. Good agencies train around that, and utilize the strengths of the gun while figuring out ways to minimize risk. Yet no one crys out for Remington’s head over it.

        • Royce Williams

          Which is why all LE agencies with officers that still carry the 870 require by policy that the shotgun is carried with an empty chamber, trigger pulled, safety off.

          There’s a reason that on page 25 of the P320 owners manual (until recently revised by Sig) printed in black & white was the following legal disclaimer for the P320:

          “If dropped, the pistol may fire. Keep the chamber empty unless actually firing.”

          See there, Sig had solved the problem long before the rest of us became aware of it, simply carry your P320 Israeli style with an empty chamber to reduce risk of a dropped gun bullet wound.

          • Bill

            No thanks, given the infinitesimally small chance of the P320 firing if dropped, I’m content to carry it fully loaded.

            The chances of me being injured by a dropped P320 are less than of me being struck by lightning. I’ll take those odds.

          • Sliced Veggie

            Absolutely. People are being irrationally hyperbolic at this point. It’s insane how people are freaking out over a precisely dropped gun and a gun that fires when you smack it with a hammer.

            I’ll eat my words if a dropped firearm injures me, but I’ll guarantee you the drop won’t be my fault or caused by me.

          • Kivaari

            That’s silly.

      • Paul Rain

        He should’ve had a red dot sight on it, then the shot might’ve gone lower.

    • Friend of Tibet

      Are you that kind of guy that sees a P320 fire when dropped then your brain simply turns off and wipe that memory?

      • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

        I think that depends on whether not the bullet hits the brain.

  • flight27

    According to gun broker, in August the #1 selling new handgun was the p320 compact and the #5 was the p320 full size. I predict that they will fall off the top five list like Springfield did earlier this year. They missed so many opportunities to make this right and they didn’t. I think Marge Gunderson said it best about the Sig executives, “There’s more to life than a little money, you know. Don’tcha know that? And here ya are, and it’s a beautiful day. Well. I just don’t understand it.”

  • Phillip Cooper

    Drama, drama, drama. It’s getting like a soap opera in here…

  • Why do people keep complaining about the coverage on this topic? If you don’t like a topic, then don’t click on it, simple as that. TFB has never forced me to read any of their articles. But as a P320 owner, I greatly appreciate this coverage, because it will finally force the issue with Sig, one way or another.

    • Blumpkin

      I’m enjoying seeing sig get roasted ever since they created the whole cornball legion marketing thing.

      • Bill

        My qual scores and the felons I’ve pointed it at don’t think my Legion is very cornball. Granted, my challenge coin and free case went immediately into my Useless Junk drawer, but it’s a nice set of cost effective upgrades to a stock P226.

    • Ernul

      Rick. Wake up! This should never have happened in the first place. Stop drinking the Kool Aid.

    • TomB

      Force what issue? This is not an unknow. It’s written right in the P320 manual, page 23.

  • Ryan L

    Sig has shown in their responses – today’s communications are often full of weasel words or qualifiers. The reason for that is some failed concept of risk protection. Protection from liability, protection of corporate brand equity. Unfortunately what we’ve seen here is that it’s false protection. Transparency and honesty are the only surefire communication strategy’s for building and repairing trust, but they come with risk.

    • Stan Darsh

      As long as Ron Cohen is first and foremost cut loose followed by all of his personal yes-men, then Sig will indeed weather this. Since the transfer of Sig Gmbh to Sig USA, all of the shadiness and obfuscation stems from him.

    • Ebby123

      Unfortunately the weasel words are a necessity because lawyers don’t care what you’re actually trying to say, and frivolous lawsuits are a very real thing.

    • Stephen Paraski

      Remington Trigger Lawsuits.

  • Blumpkin

    Huzzah! Huzzah! Huzzah!

  • Sid

    Thank you.

  • Cole

    Whether true or not, Sig claims they did not know about this specific issue until Omaha released their video. They claim the changes they made were to improve the trigger pull and some stuff like the disconnector were requirements for MHS. These changes resulted in a better trigger pull and by chance solved this drop safety issue. We can debate if they should have known about the issue earlier but stop talking about them knowing about the issue and ignoring it as if it was fact. After it is verifiable that they learned of the issue they have dealt with it very well even bringing in many people from the media and being transparent about whats going on.

    As to the issue of adding a trigger safety, why in the world would you want that? That is how you ruin what could be a good safety. What gun is known for its great trigger and has a trigger safety? NONE. I do not own any sigs but would consider buying a 320. If they add a trigger safety, my chances of buying one would drop significantly unless there was an aftermarket option to get rid of it.

    • Mark Horning

      Nathaniel is a “Glock Guy”, he doesn’t know any better. The main selling point of the Sig is the lack of a “trigger dingus”

    • TomB

      SIG has it written right in the P320 manual, page 23, “if dropped, the pistol may fire. Keep the chamber empty unless actually firing”.

      • Grey Beard

        I just read my H&K P2000 manual and found nothing to indicate that the grip may snap off if you fall off an ATV and land on your holster or don’t leave your P2000 in the oven and turn it on because parts of it will melt and it could go boom. I have seen both of those occur so I am thinking they may need a redo on their owner’s manual.

        • TomB

          What does the grip breaking or putting your pistol in the oven have to do with an AD from dropping the pistol?

          Neither of your scenarios have any pertinent affiliation with firearm safety.

          • Grey Beard

            I do know of somebody’s oven that would disagree with you about safety since they had one cook off and the guy with the snapped grip probably would disagree as well since the trigger guard was severely compromised. The point was that lawyers put disclaimers on just about every product for every scenario imaginable. The problem is they cannot account for them all.

          • Sliced Veggie

            You missed the point about putting stuff in manuals.

          • TomB

            No I didn’t; I found it irrelevant. Why would SIG care or be liable if you put a firearm in the oven? Thats your negligence, not theirs. And, as long as you read and followed the manual, falling of an ATV has no impact on them, because the chamber shouldn’t have had a round in it.

            The majority of these replies is the reason we’re plagued with frivolous lawsuits.

          • Sliced Veggie

            Well, that guys comment was sort of a satirical joke.

            Now don’t get me wrong, I’m with you, it’s pathetic for sure and I think this whole Sig thing is a load of crap. Who in their right mind is going to whack their gun with a hammer and further, drop it repeatedly on concrete.

            People need to take responsibility for their own stupidity and not try and shove it off onto others to “protect” them and get a quick paycheck for being idiotic.

        • Mystick

          Careful! That coffee is HOT!

          • Grey Beard

            And if you were the attorney for McDonalds that had the foresight to include that warning you would have gotten a pretty healthy bonus for saving them from the judgement they lost. Welcome to a litigious society. Nothing is 100% safe from Police Interceptor a Crown Victoria gas tanks to Sig pistols to a myriad of other products. Although people strive for perfection reaching it, outside of advertising slogans is pretty much a work in progress.

          • Mystick

            Nothing, NO THING is 100% safe, error-free, or perfect.

  • Melanie Van De Graaff

    He is completely right, sick has been very dishonest and misleading about this whole thing. I will never buy another Sig gun.

    • Sliced Veggie

      I’m sure they will miss your massive impact to their bottom line. That $600 second hand is going to hurt them for decades.

      • Melanie Van De Graaff

        And my five kids, and my three brothers, and all the people that I talk to while I’m shooting USPSA, and IDPA, and I am at the range at least once a week so. Not much of a difference at all.

        • Sliced Veggie

          Look how important you are. Sig should be ashamed that they failed you, Mrs. “I’m at the range once a week”. The fact you have that many people you talk to is astounding. I’m sure you’re going to walk up to every person you see and make sure they know how disappointed you are.

    • Paul Rain

      But see below, Sig PR refutes your allegations. What do you have to say for yourself?

    • Mystick

      I guess that’s why they put the disclaimers in the manual about possible unwanted discharges when dropped.

  • Mrninjatoes

    It is amazing how many Sig fan boys are okay with owning an inferior pistol.

  • Cisco

    Step 1: Place the bait: “They could have avoided all of this by sticking with the 1911, because why fix what ain’t broken.”

    Step 2: Sit back and enjoy the show…..

    • Indianasteve

      Step 3. Rebuttle. 1911 is 100 yr old technology. They have been replaced with the improved stricker fire polymer pistol.

      • Juanito Ibañez

        No, steve: the 1911 was replaced by the 1911A1 in 1926 – which was replaced by the 66-year-old technology of the Beretta 92/M9 in 1985 – which is now being replaced by the 37-year-old “striker-fired” technology of the SIG P320/XM17.

        🙂

        • Indianasteve

          I realize the xm17 didn’t immediately replace the 1911. I guess I didn’t word it as well as I could have. The point I was trying to convey is that the new duty pistol is a newer technilogical piece of equipment.

    • Mystick

      I concur. The 1911’s continuing relevance attests to the fact that it is a superior design over all of the derivative, lesser firearms such as the Glock, Beretta, and SIG.

  • Risto Kantonen

    I think it comes down to greed. The bigger the company, the more they will lie, cheat and use just about every possible dirty trick in the bag just to increase profits. At the end of the day, business does not know honesty. Yes, there are businesses that behave rather honestly, but that’s due to the values of the people that operate said business, not due to business as an idea itself.

    I said it in another article that was about this P320 debacle; At the end of the day there’s only two objectives in business: 1) To minimise costs. and 2) To maximise profits. And even in the case of minimising costs, that is done in order to maximise profits. The bigger the company, the more ruthless they are in their pursuit of achieving those two goals. And this is pretty much a universal thing across businesses, based on my own observations.

    Hell, the fact that they seem to be doing everything they can through PR and damage control to try and weasel out of this with minimal costs.

    And it’s so sad that it is like this, because i know from experience that if something is done correctly the first time – even if it costs significantly more than doing it poorly – the cost of fixing a poorly done job after the fact is almost always far more costly. And even if it wasn’t, it’s a sign of unprofessional work if it has to be fixed after the fact.

    “Either do it properly or don’t do it at all.” Is my motto.

    • Bill

      Part of minimizing costs is a stringent QA program to reduce the costs of returns, recalls, liability claims and bad PR, knowing up front that nothing is 100% guaranteed. SIG has indicated that they’ll make it right. Culturally, our CEOs don’t commit seppuku when things don’t go right.

      SIG has made stupid guns; see the bright chrome tread and rainbow finishes, but they don’t make bad guns. They are smarter than that.

      • Risto Kantonen

        True, but stringent QA programs cost money, time and tie technical staff to the task. So it’s also a factor that cuts into profits, while also being a risk management factor that can help minimise costs.

        Whether it was a question of time to market or some other variable, i don’t know, nor do i care. What matters to me is that they screwed up and are trying to weasel out of it by first covering it up and playing dumb as if they didn’t know about it. When they no longer could cover it up they announce that they just conveniently happen to have a solution right in their back pocket.

        Mistakes happen, sometimes things are overlooked and so on, i get that, but what i have absolutely no tolerance for is dishonesty. The only appropriate course of action for them was to be honest, but that ship has long since sailed. What they are now left with is a reputation of being dishonest and untrustworthy, people don’t forget this kind of behaviour so easily.

        • Bill

          I’m not getting a “dishonest” vibe after reading about the media event they had just for this, see Soldier Systems Daily. What I do get is the typically response to American litigiousness, of a VERY guarded response. If any company, including SIG, were to immediately claim fault and responsibility for some form of error, in these United States, lawyers would be interbreeding to get enough lawsuits filed, regardless of their merits. In the US, admitting ANYTHING is a good way to get your words twisted and used against you.

          NO ONE who has done any of these so called “tests” has the background, equipment or resources to apply rigorous and valid testing processes to these pistols. We aren’t talking SAAMI/NIST/Natick level testing here, we are talking about amateurs with internet access and hammers, so I’ll wait and see what SIG does Monday, and what REAL testing reveals.

          • Kivaari

            A mallet test is part of the SAAMI test. Repeated blows to the back (and all sides) of the pistol in increasing strength blows finally getting to a force equal to driving a nail.

  • JohnnyCuredents

    I’ve begun dismissing this kind of stuff out of hand; it reminds me of the Democrat Party’s crap about the fantasy “Russian collusion.” I can’t help thinking we wouldn’t see much about this if Sig hadn’t beaten Glock out in the military pistol competition. Same way we’d never hear “Russia” if Trump hadn’t skunked the Grifter from Chappaqua.

  • Rogertc1

    Nathaniel F is a history enthusiast and firearms hobbyist whose primary interest lies in military small arms technological developments beginning with the smokeless powder era. He can be reached via email at nathaniel.f@staff.thefirearmblog.com. But the disclaimer said The following is the opinion of the author, and his alone. It does not represent the views of The Firearm Blog or any other TFB staff member. But I bet it represents the views of many of our readers.

  • Steyr is probably going to end up losing that lawsuit, by the way.

  • FlackOps

    I’ve been a PR flack for 30 years and a Glock owner for just a few months. In fact, my Glock 19 is the first firearm I’ve ever purchased. But after witnessing firsthand the potential public relations crisis surrounding the Sig Sauer P320 semi-automatic pistol, I’ve decided that I’m going to become a Sig owner.
    I didn’t make this decision lightly. (I understand from reading countless firearms forums that allegiance to a firearm brand can rival allegiance to a beloved sports franchise.) But I’ve read enough to know that Sig Sauer firearms in general and the P320 specifically are among the safest handguns on the market today. And Sig’s handling of this situation tells me that they care as much about the safety and integrity of their products as they do about their sterling reputation. And they are willing to do whatever it takes to preserve both.

  • Ebby123

    “The SIG P320 Has Problems, and We Have Questions an Agenda”

    Fixed it for you.

    • Care to elaborate on what my agenda is? I want to hear it.

      • Ebby123

        Clicks and self promotion.
        Tearing down a well-known figure is a time-honored way for journalists to gain traffic and notoriety, no?

        Just look at how personally invested you are in the comments section.
        Sounds like you can’t take the same level of criticism and speculation that you so freely dish out on others..

  • Kivaari

    Exactly. It is that history that makes me question the SIG apologists.

  • Dude

    First of all I have to admit up front that I’m a bit of a fan boy. I carry a P320 and this issue doesn’t make me feel any different about my gun. It does, however, make me feel different about the company that manufactures it. How many times have we seen this…big corporation is aware of a problem but does nothing until the public becomes aware then makes like it’s not a big deal until it is a big deal. Then the PR people go into full spin mode until the company does what it should have done in the very beginning. I love my gun but I’m very disappointed in the company that makes it

  • Joe

    Great article! Congrats! Let’s hear what does Sig comes with on Monday 14!

  • john ziegler

    please help me find the end of the line of the people that are willing to shoot themselves in the leg with a sig P320 for $7 seven million dollars. Seven million what kind of world are we living in. Why not make it a 100 million. This lawyer probably owns a Glock.

  • VINCENT SMITH

    320 supposed sig is not a real sig inside, Its a walther .compare the inside to any real sig like the following models 225,226 228 229 they are real sigs inside and out. the 320 is a walther with the exterior of a sig ,the inside is walther,several other models of sig are also really walthers with the sig exterior and name

  • Ernul

    It’s obvious the gun wasn’t tested and it was simply Sigs turn up to bat so compliancy took over. Another government welfare program.

  • TomB

    Why all the drama?

    Page 23 of the P320’s manual states “if dropped, the pistol may fire. Keep the chamber empty unless actually firing!”

    SIG states this forthright.

    Isn’t part of firearm safety reading the manual and warnings?

  • jack daugherty

    Nathanial, your saying you prefer Glock over SIG makes my day. That is all.

  • Brian

    Many of your questions have already been answered.

    The already designed Enhanced Trigger was not originally intended to fix the drop issue. It was to fix the “double click” issue and was initiated at the Military’s request. It just so happened to fix the drop issue at the same time.

    You are willfully spreading misinformation claiming Sig knew about the drop issue when there is no hard evidence – just speculation.

    And you are spreading misinformation claiming the Enhanced Trigger was originally intended to fix the drop issue when it was to fix a different issue – which is why it was already designed and had a scheduled announcement date.

    This post is some shoddy journalism since you have included many sources and done research, but then didn’t bother to research into the details of the Enhanced Trigger you have so many questions about – questions that have already been answered.

    This is a terrible article.

  • jonp

    Funny this crap started up right when Glock lost the trials.

  • transmaster

    This is getting ridiculous. I heard a breathless report….oh my God….a P320 went off when….gasp!!! It was hit…wait for it…..with a hammer. I don’t see what SIG has done wrong in their response. So if you want to post a YouTube of a SIG blasting when pommeled with a jackhammer go ahead, I’m not watching it.

  • David Conner

    Id say if you’re clumsy enough to drop your gun you should be shot, but realistically if you are carrying a P320 God forbid it gets hit somehow while strapped to you! That extra safty is key and a gun company NEEDS to address such issues asap. I own one P320 and 6 other sigs so a show of respect for us is wanted in this case. Especially since I carry my P320.

  • Mystick

    I hear there’s other things going on than the SIG P320. A machine has a failure mode? My God… alert the Media… mountains and molehills.

  • LCON

    “At what point during the Modular Handgun System program did the drop safety issue resurface? Was it before or after their pistol was selected by the Army to be the M17? Did the US Army request the changes to the trigger’s design, or did SIG make these changes on their own? Why didn’t SIG begin rolling out P320s with safety triggers – which they had already designed – at this point in time, instead of waiting for it to blow up in their face?”

    We know that the M17/M18 has differences from the Off the Shelf Sig P320. The manual safety being one of those changes… Yes Yes I can hear the Cries of A manual Safety on a modern Combat pistol… Cry me a River. My point is That although the XM17 was derived from the P320 it’s undergone changes. And The -30 drop may not be an issue for M17 pistols due to the changes.

  • jlarson41

    I find it amusing that all of you “Operators” out there (the ones that get your panties in a bunch about how dangerous a manual safety is on a striker fired handgun), can get so worked up about this issue. Glocks (and many other brands I’m sure) fire when dropped all of the time and I haven’t heard a word about that. How does this happen? someone tries to catch them and inadvertently activates the trigger. I keep hearing that “I don’t need a safety, my trigger finger is all the safety I need”. Well why doesn’t the same apply to dropping? I don’t need a drop safety my hand gripping the handgun is all I need.

  • Kivaari

    SAAMI spec has a drop test that includes dropping the gun muzzle up like OO did. They also have a mallet test like Patrick R. did. The P320 fails those SAAMI tests.

  • kcshooter

    They should fix them all for free!!!
    Oh, wait, they already offered to do that.
    OK then. Problem solved.

    Just like when the new 17M Glock slides just fell off when dry fired, and were recalled.
    You fanboys acted like that was a design feature.

    How about you “writers” all get together and find a different dead horse to beat now?
    Maybe rehash the issues you have with MHS selection?
    Or maybe a real story!

  • Aries144

    This behavior is symptomatic of a project or organization that has been taken over by aggressive, ambitious, competitive, personalities. It is very common to encounter these types in corporations, government, military, and any place there exists a ladder to be climbed and power to be gained. More than anything else, they seek fame, recognition, and respect. Their reputations and lists of accomplishments mean more to them than anything else. They strive to never, NEVER, show weakness. To them, accepting blame is weakness. Admitting guilt is weakness. Admitting to making an error is weakness. They will lie, deny, and blame others, but never willingly admit to making a mistake unless they can see a way to leverage it into future success. It is far better to them to cover up and deny making a mistake, even if it means others are hurt or killed.

    You can’t make them correct a mistake by holding their feet to the fire. They will deny wrongdoing, seek to cast doubt on even the most damning evidence, and seek out sycophants to help add the appearance of legitimacy to their denials. The only solution is to laser focus on them, blame them squarely for the mistake they’ve made, and do whatever is necessary to drive them from the project or organization they’re damaging.

    They can be useful if tightly controlled and consistently denied positions of leadership, but as they crave the very power and control that makes them so harmful, it makes managing them a constant chore.

  • really.really!really?

    Hey TFB – this is the third article (that I’ve seen) you have published in the last few days on this problem. I do not recall reading that this potential hazard dates back to the introduction of the gun or whether it is a problem in older guns or newer guns, etc. That information is very important and given how SIG has handled it to this point, I’m leery of anything they have to say on the matter. How about some details like that, please.

  • Steve Kosovich

    Enough is Enough, nuff said!

  • Ernul

    I’m not a Sig fan but this situation sounds EXACTLY like the Remington 700 rifle safety that came off when it, not the shooter wanted it to! Was this BLOG all over Remington asking for a explanation at first incidents as you are here as Remington him-hawed around for years and only a death caused them to fess up. I personally wouldn’t buy even a Remington bumper sticker now and I’m hoping you folks will do the same regarding Sig. (Love your BLOG!)

  • David Douglass

    As a “Numbers Cruncher” I tend to approach a subject such as this one with questions. Such as. “How many sig P320 have been sold overall and how many of them have fired when dropped?”
    .
    I have seen a video on this issue and a person lined up all the popular striker fired pistols to test them with a mallet strike so see which ones would fire. The result was all the pistols with trigger-safety system did not fire when struck, and the sig was the only one which did.
    .
    So of the known cases of a Sig P320 firing without pulling the trigger, that’s three–the guy did achieve a discharge several times off camera so it’s a valid finding.
    .
    BUT…..when it comes to striker fired pistols, the idea of a safety, I believe is all up to the individual and his pistol. Some do not need a safety—their brain is enough. Some need one to have CC confidence—no problem choose one and buy it accordingly. And some need more safeties than there are invented on a pistol.
    .
    I believe the ‘take-away’ truth here on the SIg P320 is…..it’s a testament as to just how responsible and safe the overwhelming majority of all pistol owner are. And the Sig owners are probably, if I had the real sales numbers on this pistol, would be, in the 99.95% safe responsible handling category. .
    .
    I’ve been handling guns for many years in public range areas and never, not one time, seen a person drop their pistol. So in my areas of the world, it’s more rare than…..everything I’ve ever crunched the numbers on.
    .
    Do I think Sig should do what ever it takes to eliminate this from happening no matter who drops it, at what angle, at any force, be it with a hammer, mallet, or God forbid, using the pistol as a hammer to stop an attack—-essentially shooting yourself in the chest as you strike the guys head with the striker end of the slide portion of the pistol. YES, absolutely fix it so it can never fire until the trigger is squeezed.

  • James Wegman

    You have questions, I have the answer. RON COHEN!

  • Tom

    SIG has a documented history of being confronted with a problem with a handgun and blaming it on the shooter. Besides, the bore-axis on these uber pistols is way too high.

  • Logan

    Anyone who dismisses the drop safety problem is crazy. I want to gun that is safe and not partially safe. Sig Sauer should issue a recall.

  • Bill

    Thinking? If they are thinking, which I doubt, they are most probably thinking that they are too big to fail. Did someone from Colt get hired by SIG to bring the former’s business model to a new company?

  • richard kluesek

    Ruger had an agressive recall and retrofit trigger with their SR9 early after its release. SiG seems reluctantly conducting a damage control scenario to maintain credibility with the military contract.

  • Bobby McKellar

    Geez…another article about the P320. I’ll say it again though, back during the 80’s when the Army decided to drop the 1911 for the Beretta M9, the articles about how horrible the Beretta was were RAMPANT. Still…no matter how many articles were written and how many alternatives were presented, the M9 won out and served well.
    The M9 had SEVERAL issues as well…I mean WHOLE SLIDES were going ballistic and hammering dudes in the forehead. Beretta fixed the issues and life continued. So…no matter how many answers are demanded from Sig and how butthurt the Glock fans are that Sig won the MHS, the new Army pistol is gonna be a modified Sig P320.
    THIS DEAD HORSE HAS BEEN BEATEN INTO DUST.

  • margot aspen

    I love SIGs, for a multitude of reasons, performance topping the list. Being a small, older female w/arthritic hands, The SIG p238 was the gun recommended as my first gun purchase and the only one I was able to comfortably rack. I’ve since upgraded to 938. As my skills & knowledge have improved, I have tried & purchased other brands and eventually traded them in for another SIG. Even the Mosquito & I have resolved our differences, and our relationship continues. I certainly am appreciative about the info & knowledge I acquire from TFB, this latest included, particularly in light of the fact that I have two P320s, both in 9mm–the Carry & the sub compact. I am disappointed in the way this issue has been handled by SIG; it just doesn’t seem like the SIG way of doing business. I have always had such good customer service w/them on any questions or concerns. I expect it will be resolved and await a recall notice for a trigger upgrade. In the meantime, I will continue to be mindful of the proper safe handling of firearms.

  • Yarbles

    I have personally heard the renown pistol smith Teddy Jacobson call SIG triggers ‘junk’ for years. He sayes they are ‘under engineered’ and the springs on the SA/DA models will weaken and wear out in a few years. He should know. He works on hundreds of them a year for Police, DHS, and FBI. The best SIG triggers I have fired were his trigger jobs.

    I’ll take a Glock or 1911 any day.

  • Zebra Dun

    I had the pleasure (Misfortune?) to shoot a weapon in the Marines, The M-40 Recoilless rifle.
    It was a sweet rifle, firing it was the exact same as being on the receiving end of an artillery strike or so it was said.
    It had this nasty habit, if the loader did not close the breech solidly and fully the gun would not fire, resulting in a hang fire, wait a minute, fire the 106, hang fire, elevate the barrel, wait a minute, fire the 106, hang fire.
    Now you can do one of two things, slam the breech home or open the breech and remove the round.
    Slamming it home sometimes resulted in an un planned firing, opening the breech caused the cocked firing pin to strike every time and you got a fine display of explosive power with the perforated case often leaving the breech at speed and a short round out of the barrel.
    Weapons have quirks and these quirks can kill you.
    Sometimes a manufacturer just screws the pooch and denial sets in.
    The next version of the SiG P-320 will be improved for sure.
    The company should recall all of them.

  • kenbay2020

    I never had any problems with my German made Sig’s back in the day. They were built like tanks. I’ve had issues with every one of my New Hampshire made Sig’s such that I’ve become skeptical of Sig’s firearms. IMO this is not the same company from back in the day. Sig needs to make some serious improvements to their firearm design and production.

  • CanineCo

    I’ve personally seen this failure mode demonstrated in several reliable videos, usually replicated by striking the back of the Sig 320 slide with a plastic-faced mallet. Seems like a legitimate problem to me as a consumer, worth evaluating and addressing if required.

  • Hendo337

    My friend was shot by his P320 yesterday. It was in the holster, a Sig holster, he was wearing the weapon on the small off his back. He reached to adjust it. He touched it while holstered. It shot directly through his left butt cheek, a fully mushroomed hollow point defense round. He didn’t drop it. He reached to adjust it and touched it. These weapons are seriously dangerous. That weapon could have been killed someone, be could have been falsey charged with a crime, possibly murder, that wasn’t his fault, if not just ending up dead himself. All these SIG nutswinger and trolls need to wake up. This P320 dangerous, was designed improperly. Why else would the Dallas PD remove it from service. I am encouraging him get legal consultion on this matter, he is ruluctant because he is a good American who doesn’t like legal crap
    Well I am a self confessed “gun nut” myself, however when holstered weapons can’t be trusted not to discharge we’ve got some serious problems.

  • Nat Calverley

    I own a sig p320 and am not a happy camper at the way sig is treating us owners. I have found the weapon to be reliable and accurate but upon hearing about it failing drop tests I did my own and found that it will fire in the manner claimed. My 17 year old daughter and I use this gun for target shooting. We follow all standard saftey precautions when handling our weapons however when I purchased this gun I expected it to be drop safe. Accidents can happen and it is not to much to expect that a modern quality weapon such as the sig p320 should be drop safe. As a Canadian sig owner I am expected to wait until sig figures out how to handle the recall for Canadian owners . In the email they sent to me they said U.S. owners could expect a wait of 4 to 6 weeks to correct the problem and that Canadian owners will have to wait until they figure out a process to handle our guns. I would kindly suggest that sig should offer us an option for a refund of our purchase price and they can have the defective weapon back.