Fast & Furious Fifty-Cal Recovered In El Chapo Raid

El-Chapo-guns-02

A Barrett .50 caliber M82-series semiautomatic anti-materiel rifle, transferred to criminal elements through the BATFE’s Operation Fast & Furious, found its way into the hands of notorious Sinaloa drug cartel lead Joaquín “El Chapo” Guzmán, report news outlets during the week of SHOT Show. The large-caliber rifle, erroneously described as being designed to “shoot down helicopters”, is nonetheless an extremely capable weapon which can defeat a large number of lightly armored vehicles and virtually all personal body armor. Fox News reports:

A .50-caliber rifle found at Joaquin “El Chapo” Guzman’s hideout in Mexico was funneled through the gun-smuggling investigation known as Fast and Furious, sources confirmed Tuesday to Fox News.

A .50-caliber is a massive rifle that can stop a car or, as it was intended, take down a helicopter.

After the raid on Jan. 8 in the city of Los Mochis that killed five of his men and wounded one Mexican marine, officials found a number of weapons inside the house where Guzman was staying, including the rifle, officials said.

When agents from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives checked serial numbers of the eight weapons found in his possession, they found one of the two .50-caliber weapons traced back to the ATF program, sources said.

Federal officials told Fox News they are not sure how many of the weapons seized from Guzman’s house actually originated in the U.S. and where they were purchased, but are investigating.

Out of the roughly 2,000 weapons sold through Fast and Furious, 34 were .50-caliber rifles that can take down a helicopter, according to officials.

Federal law enforcement sources told Fox News that ‘El Chapo’ would put his guardsmen on hilltops to be on guard for Mexican police helicopters that would fly through valleys conducting raids. The sole purpose of the guardsmen would be to shoot down those helicopters, sources said.

The Fast and Furious operation involved federal agents allowing criminals to buy guns with the intention of tracking them.

Instead, agents from the ATF lost track of 1,400 of the 2,000 guns involved in the sting operation.

The operation allowed criminals to buy guns in Phoenix-area shops with the intention of tracking them once they made their way into Mexico.

While the idea of .50 caliber anti-materiel rifles being used by guardsmen to shoot down snooping helicopters is not terribly far-fetched, as Hognose points out in this article, the Barretts don’t seem to have actually seen much use. Instead, the Mexican drug lords probably had more banal motives for acquiring the rifles: They just wanted them, and they typically get what they want.

El-Chapo-guns-01

A screencap of some of the weapons discovered during the raid. Image source: WeaponsMan.com

 

The raid on Guzmán’s house was conducted on the 8th of January, 2016, by Mexican Marines, during which the Barrett rifle and other weapons were captured. Why a gunwalking operation ostensibly intended to track the flow of weapons from the United States into Mexico needed to transfer Barrett anti-materiel rifles to criminals is something I doubt anyone has a good answer for.


Nathaniel F

Nathaniel is a history enthusiast and firearms hobbyist whose primary interest lies in military small arms technological developments beginning with the smokeless powder era. In addition to contributing to The Firearm Blog, he runs 196,800 Revolutions Per Minute, a blog devoted to modern small arms design and theory. He can be reached via email at nathaniel.f@staff.thefirearmblog.com.


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  • Some Dude

    ¡Gracias Obama!

    • G0rdon_Fr33man

      The sting-op started under Bush…

      • DaveP.

        Completely different op, that was ended when it was feared that guns could escape tracking. Gunwalker/ Fast and Furious started under Holder with the intent of creating “American guns committing crimes In Mexico!” headlines to use as excuses to enact new gun control. All this is available through the most cursory of Google searches.
        Thanks for the lies, though.

        • RealitiCzech

          The intent was to arm the Sinaloa cartel against its opponents, gun control was a nice bonus.

        • G0rdon_Fr33man

          “Gunwalker/ Fast and Furious started under Holder with the intent of creating “American guns committing crimes In Mexico!” headlines to use as excuses to enact new gun control!

          Thanks for todays conspiracy laugh.

          • Cymond

            You’re right, their stated goal of tracking the guns after they crossed the border makes far more sense, considering how ATF totally has that kind of reach (and jurisdiction).

          • Kivaari

            There are ATF agents stationed in Mexico. It was those agents that saw the trend, that they were not part of. That was a crime by Holder’s thugs.

      • Hensley Beuron Garlington

        No, a different program was started under Bush and the program. The program was changed to Fast & Furious and that’s when the weapons started going across the boarder.

      • Gambler X

        you are partially correct. The guns were given RFID tags and other tracking devices, once the cartels realized the guns were tagged they started removing them and the op was canceled. Under Obama and Fast & Furious there were no tags and really no way to track them until they were confiscated. So its pretty much what DaveP said. Create headlines.

      • Kivaari

        Under Bush the Mexican government was an active partner. The ATF had transmitters installed in some. Even with those they could not keep tabs on them. The buyers were very adept a trade craft and eluded ground and aerial trails. After several loses they called it off. In F&F the Mexicans were not included. Mexico City ATF agents detected the guns, and were told to stand down an not inform the Mexican government. Bushes team wanted to make arrests. Obama wanted new gun laws.

  • Mcameron

    supplying a known drug dealer/ terrorist with weapons…….how is that not aiding and abetting?

    hrmmm….yet Holder walks free today…..

  • C. Her

    A long range rifle is only as good as it’s optic. Luckily this thing wasn’t equipped with a S&B or Hensoldt.

  • Michael Hardy

    So, do you think the people who are going to talk gun control because of the 50 cal from the US are even going to notice THE RPG7 RIGHT NEXT TO IT????

    • Jeebus

      #banassaultRPGs

    • Bill

      That would be the RPG that wasn’t part of F&F? It’s really inconvenient for both sides of the argument.

      • mig1nc

        They probably bought that from corrupt Mexican mililtary officers.

        • john huscio

          Or from the huge 30-40 year old stockpiles in Guatemala/el Salvador/Honduras…

          • Tassiebush

            That would have to be the most under reported side to it.

          • Bill

            Absolutely. And many of the countries in Central and South America are just as deep in dope as the Mexicans, and a big percentage of border crossers are coming from those same countries. About the only place down there that might not be totally contaminated are the Falkland Islands.

          • jcitizen

            Yep, and it is just as much our fault for giving them a market to sell to. I wished someone could appeal to folks that think it is cute to do dope – if they knew the consequences of what it did to people they’d never start.

          • Francisco Machado

            “We” give them the market? The market is global – as is the supply. People have used them since prehistoric times. U.S. (and other countries) laws drive the market underground, enrich the violent criminals and insure our government can collect no taxes on the drugs or, despite claimed efforts, control them. And anyone who wants them can get them anyway. I have no connection to drugs at all, but I live near a college town. Want to place a bet I can’t go to a bar in town, strike up some conversations, buy a few beers and make a purchase?

          • jcitizen

            Your last sentence sums it up pretty well.

          • Josh Rothman

            jcitizen – You’re right, but for the fact that most young folks are sure they’re an exception, that it won’t happen to them, it’s only for fun, no harm, no foul, etc. Have you ever met a teen with long-term vision? They’re about as rare as, well, a journalist who actually knows something about firearms.

          • jcitizen

            I must have been rare, ’cause kids all over were smoking pot when I was young, and I told them to keep that crap away from me. I didn’t want the legal hassle, and I knew I’d gain a thousand pounds from all the munchy attacks I witnessed!

          • Kivaari

            The users don’t care about any thing except getting the next hit.

          • jcitizen

            Studies have shown that the cartels primarily get their guns from the black market with sources from Israel, Venezuela, Iran, China, and a plethora of bad actors in between. It is much cheaper to buy wholesale that way, instead of relying on theft or retail shops in the US. Which is ridiculous – the only reason they bought them in the FF sting was because they were duped into it.

            The news media doesn’t like to report that a whole ship of full auto AK-47s got away with offloading them and the produce disappeared into the US blackmarket before they were able to catch them. A consequent shipment was held up and confiscated later. The Chinese just shrugged their shoulders and claimed they didn’t think it was illegal to ship full auto rifles to the US – Yeah right!

          • albaby2

            Got a link to that story?

          • CJ Klekar

            Thank you for this comment. I’ve often wondered where the Cartels appropriated their weapons from; I have serious doubts that these Cartels depend on weapons purchased on this side of the border. A person like Chapo with his money and connections, should be able to purchase any type of weapon in the world.

          • Kivaari

            The gun buyers in the US F&F were not duped into doing it. The ATF and FBI allowed the transactions by not stopping the NICS check. Worse is the dealers that tipped off the ATF, and allowed cameras and agents to work as sales people are getting blamed for helping the feds pull off the sting. Except the stinging part of the sting never came. Holder shipped thousands of guns into Mexico and only couple strawmen ever saw a courtroom. The penalties were essentially nothing.

          • jcitizen

            Technicality. Thanks for the drill down.

          • Kivaari

            The Chinese AKs were not fitted with machinegun parts, Just like the Galil ACE recall, the hole for the auto sear was drilled and pinned. The Chinese simply put SA parts in the guns and a pin in the auto sear holes.

          • jcitizen

            Wrong incident – I’m not talking about that one.

          • Kivaari

            Obama will never repeat that bit of truth.

    • Hensley Beuron Garlington

      Nope, even worse, they will automatically assume that those are easy to get here as well. Like fully automatics can be ordered online and delivered to homes through Amazon without a background check.

      • Rooftop Voter

        Wait a minute, you can’t get them thru Amazon? That guy from Nigeria said it would be easy, I just sent him 8K! I wonder if I can get my money back?

        • jcitizen

          /s

        • Hensley Beuron Garlington

          That’s probably just Bill working operation 2 Fast 2 Furious.

    • Jwedel1231

      I must admit, I didn’t notice the RPG either until you said something. Something about that sweet FDE finish I only have eyes for…

    • John Henry Bicycle Lucas

      Good point, Michael. But a lot of those idiots won’t even know what that is.

    • Grey Beard

      Lest they forget about the M-203 slung under the barrel of the M-16 next to it.

  • Maro Vlasic

    ahahaha…only us state agency would sell weapons to rebelz/_criminals and then lost track of it!! AVE el CHAPO!!!

  • DaveP.

    In b4 “firearms not politics” whining.

    • hydepark

      You mean the whining editors and writers? Yeah, me too. Because anyone with half a brain realizes firearms and politics are inseparable.

  • Bill

    People just don’t get how complex criminal investigations can get. If you want to see where a river goes, you have to float a boat. Some also might want to study up on who we have provided stuff like Stinger missiles to in the past.

    • Spencerhut

      That is just lazy, and very dangerous, police work. Beyond stupid. And you sir are brain washed if you think letting any gun get into criminal hands to see where it goes is a good idea.

      • Bill

        And your knowledge of how to manage a complex case comes from where, exactly? It’s easy to politicize something you don’t like, but you don’t know the technicalities of what you are complaining about. Blaming the .gov for a death involving one of these guns is like blaming a car dealer when one of the cars they sold is involved in a fatal accident, which, coincidentally, is the same sort of logic antis use.

        Frequently diagnostic radiological tests involve the injection of a dye or nuclear tracer that makes visible circulatory or physical anomalies like cancers. This is no different, and no different than using a bait car to trace an auto theft ring. If you think people wouldn’t have been murdered without these guns going into circulation, you are incredibly naive, and have no idea of how vicious mex cartels can be.

        • Jeebus

          I get what you’re saying, and all these conspiracy theories/false flag memes are kind of hilarious. Still, the fact that no one was really held accountable when they *lost* the weapons blows my mind.

          • Bill

            It’s the government; the bigger the bureaucracy and more complex the operation, the higher the probability of something going sideways. Radical problems often require radical approaches. Some cases turn out better than others. Claiming that Holder and Obama are directly responsible for deaths or screwups is political histrionics. Yeah, captain of the ship and all that, but let’s try to be realistic.

            People really get wrapped around the axle on Southwest Border issues, conveniently forgetting that it’s been an open battleground since the 1600s. It’s the political football de jour, just like when Black Jack Pershing had to go after Pancho Villa, or the Alamo, or raids on settlers before then. Folks also forget that a big chunk of the Southwest used to BE Mexico. As large as we have an appetite for drugs, cheap labor, and a higher standard of living that other people want to be a part of, there will ALWAYS be problems.

          • mosinman

            that’s a fancy way of saying corruption.

          • Bill

            No it isn’t. Something with 1,000 moving parts is more likely to break than something with 10. Corruption exists, but where is it in this case? Did Obama and Holder knowingly and intentionally sell guns to the Sinaloa Cartel?

          • mosinman

            i was talking about the lack of consequences for those responsible for the screw up

          • Bill

            When a case literally goes south, that’s not a screwup, that’s policing. Life isn’t an episode of CSI.

          • mosinman

            i don’t need you to tell me that. the whole Op went south, that’s a screw up to me

          • Bill

            How do you know “the whole Op went south?” Do you have access to the case files? Do you understand that not all investigations pan out, or goes as planned? Do you live in a zero-screw-up environment?

          • john huscio

            Well my screw ups don’t generally result in dead bodies, nor do they get used as a cover to attack the rights of my fellow citizens.

          • Bill

            Ah yes, time to trot out the conspiracy theory. How well has it worked out, or does the government screw up every thing, even their own nefarious plots?

          • Cymond

            They lost track of about 70% of the guns they claim they were tracking. From that point forward, they could only be found when they show up at crime scenes such as this one.

            If that isn’t a major F up, I don’t know what is.

        • Hensley Beuron Garlington

          The “Stinger” missiles you refer to, I’m guessing your talking about us supplying weapons to “freedom fighters” like Osama Bin Laden to fight the Soviets in the 80s?
          Supplying guys who later became our enemies is way different then letting guns go into criminal hands to supposedly track them.
          There were no tracking devices in the weapons that were allowed to be taken across the border. There was absolutely no way they could of tracked those weapons and they knew it. They let them go with the HOPES of busting them with them later.
          It was a horrible idea that’s had lasting affects. We haven’t even found them all and we never will. There will be many more people harmed from Fast & Furious.

          • Bill

            Many more people harmed? How so? You think a handful of guns in a sea of guns is going to make any difference? Again, the same logic path used by the antis.

            The guns could be tracked by make, model, descriptors and serial numbers – how do you think they caught this Barrett?

            UBL was our enemy in the 80’s, but then so were the Soviets, so it was the classic “enemy of my enemy is my friend” scenario. You’ll notice a fair number of ISIS fighters armed with Coalition weapons. Where did they come from? If one of those guns is captured, you don’t think the intelligence community will back-track it to it’s source, to see if it was stolen/recovered from the battlefield/given away by one of our “allies?’ Don’t forget Iran/Contra, and arms to the Shah of Iran, whose regime gave birth to the Muslim Brotherhood. There’s dozens more examples, but none support the prevailing belief that Obama is Satan. I’m surprised he hasn’t been blamed for the blizzard.

          • iksnilol

            2000 rifles isn’t a handful IMO.

          • Bill

            In Mexico it’s a drop in the bucket.

          • Hensley Beuron Garlington

            No joke! I’d gladly take one if 2000 is nothing.
            Interesting how a US Marine making a wrong turn can get caught with just three guns and these guy walked across the boarder with thousands of weapons, including .50 Barretts and we only recover the weapons if South American law enforcement reports they find any of them while conducting regular police work.

          • Bryan Brah

            Actually the Muslim Brotherhood was founded by Hasan al-Banna in Egypt in 1928.

          • Bill

            Correct, but many believe that they hit the big-time, so to speak, with the Qutbs in the mid 60’s, causing a spread in their influence throughout the Mid East beyond Egypt.

          • Bryan Brah

            Also an Egyptian.

          • Bill

            Yes, both Sayyid and his brother, and when Sayyid was executed in Egypt it is perceived as the start of the Islamic Botherhood spreading radicalism beyond Egypt, one of the first targets being the overthrow of Iran’s secular government, the assassination of Nasser, and heavily influencing bin Laden and al Zawahiri. See Lawrence Wright, The Looming Tower, but I bet you’re familiar with it. Most of the analysts I’ve talked to trace most all anti-secular movements in the latter day Mid-East, particularly in countries under Western influence such as Egypt and Iran (at that time) as stemming from Qtub’s influence

        • Spencerhut

          You’re right, just one guy died and it’s not like he was your brother right? So no big deal . . .
          Besides, turning over a .50BMG to a rabid bunch of killers is -just like- cancer screening.
          It’s also exactly like running a bait car sting . . .

          Like I said, brainwashed . . . .

          • Bill

            I’m betting large that I’ve been to more cop funerals than you have, so don’t play the drama queen card with me. “Turning over,” and it is a little bit more complicated than that, a gun to guys who already have more guns than they could possibly use is how cases are made. Guess you’d rather let the cartels run wild, while we just sit back and do nothing.

            You hate Obama. We get it. The only reason you play the “pity the dead cop” card is because …you hate Obama and it fits your political worldview. Who’s really the brainwashed one?

          • FarmerB

            Bill, no matter what others say about your robust defense of the program, it’s clear to me that the main shortcoming to your posts is political naivety. Are Holder and Obama personally responsible for walking guns south? No, of course not. Even if they were, there would be no tracks back to them. But I understand why we should try and sheet the blame home to them – because it’s politics. Exactly the same politics that Holder would have keenly exploited by showing the “epidemic of violence/guns” across the border was due to ‘gun culture’, rogue dealers, lack of background checks, 2nd Amendment “fanatics”, and the availability of military style weapons – solely designed for the purpose of killing people. Etc etc. Back at the time, there were stories all over the media that played to that tune. So, I’m not crying that we are trying to ram this fiasco right up his clacker.

          • hydepark

            Bill, your stupid is showing.

            Also, I love when TFB gets real (political). It makes me feel like that guy from Pineapple Express!

      • May

        You do know that F&F was Bush’s idea right?

        • Sulaco

          The Bush program was terminated immediately when it was found that the radio trackers in the guns sold could not be followed. NO such tech was attempted in FF.

    • iksnilol

      I’d buy that if they actually did something with the info they got.

      I mean, this rifle got to the top of a cartel, yet no arrests were made.

      • Bill

        Uh, you may want to double-check the context in which the photo was taken. Yeah, an arrest was made, and a couple bad guys were croaked, IIRC. It remains to be seen how far back they’ll try to trace the gun, but it went exactly where they thought it might.

        • iksnilol

          Do you really think he was arrested because of that “traced” rifle?

          • Bill

            Of course not. Why would anyone be arrested on a simple weapons charge when you’ve got racketeering, multiple murders, about a million different drug charges, or whatever the equivalent charges in Napoleonic Mexico are. The other side is that if LE catches some low-level street hood with an illegally-possessed firearm they can use that to flip him. To use the bait car analogy, I WANT it to be stolen so I can follow it to the chop shop and get the guy who ordered it, cars being stolen on a by-order basis now. That little stolen Honda or Toyota lets me make a case for much bigger charges. Barring that, I can stop it and press the thief for his connections, or find out it’s just a joyrider and toss him back, in a manner of speaking. Or to use the IV dye analogy, the dye doesn’t do anything therapeutic itself, other than to lead the examining doctor to a more accurate diagnosis.

            Don’t forget that Al Capone was nailed on tax charges. Creative police work with extra style points. If the BATFE wants to do the legwork, they know where the rifle started, they know where it ended up, they can sweep up the people in between.

          • nadnerbus

            So….we supplied the cartels with illegal guns, so the authorities would have legal leverage on them when they were caught? In a country already awash in illegal guns, because almost all guns are already illegal…

            You are trying really hard to put this in a context that doesn’t make the whole thing criminal, but I am still not seeing it. I get that sting operations, especially of that magnitude, are complex and secretive. But I have yet to see a single rational articulated that makes any real sense for FF.

          • iksnilol

            Uh, bait car and truck shipment of guns isn’t really comparable.

          • Bill

            There are identical; the only difference here is one of scale.

          • iksnilol

            No they aren’t.

            Criminals use guns primarily to kill people. They sure as hell don’t buy a thousand cars with the intent of running down their enemies.

          • Bill

            They steal thousands of cars to part out or sell overseas. They buy or steal thousands of them to use for transporting drugs or committing other crimes. They can both be used as criminal instruments. Or are you saying that guns are “special” because they can be used to commit violent crimes? That’s what antis say, particularly when it’s pointed out that many more people are killed in auto accidents or by drunk drivers than by gunshot.

            You’re taking the narrow political/emotional view. The operational tactics for running a bait car sting and a gun sting or a drug sting or a counterfeit bond sting or kiddy porn sting or an illegal RFID reader sting are all essentially the same. You’re bent out of shape because it’s guns instead of credit card blanks. You want another reason to hate the government. You don’t care that the screamingly vast majority of people killed by cartel violence are members of other cartels, or Mexicans caught in the crossfire, nor do you want those Mexicans caught in the crossfire scrambling across the border to get away from it. Nor do you want ALL drugs legalized, which would kick out the legs of the cartels because there wouldn’t be nearly enough money in it. Go ahead, hate the government, but when people toss around words like “treason” it’s just ridiculous.

          • iksnilol

            F…U…C…K…Y…O…U.

            Simply because you put words into my mouth, and plenty of them at that.

            Personally, I want drugs legalized and I am a foreigner myself so I see no problem with immigrants. And yes, I will hate irresponsible people that are indirectly responsible for the deaths of plenty of innocents.

          • Bill

            Obscenity and name calling, Good show, hit a little close to home apparently. So you want all drugs legalized? Doesn’t that make you indirectly responsible for the deaths of anyone who OD’d?

            You’re driven by emotions and politics. Fine. Have it your way.

          • iksnilol

            No, what people do with their drugs is their responsibility.

            Selling guns to people you know will use them for nefarious purposes is being an accomplice.

          • hydepark

            Oh where, oh where
            has my little Phil gone?
            Oh where, oh where can he be?
            I think he missed out
            on this vile-est post!
            To censor you like he censored me!

          • Cymond

            From what I’ve seen on TV, bait cars usually have surveillance and GPS tracking attached. They don’t just leave a car on a random street and look the other way while it disappears.

    • MikeF

      Can you explain to me Bill, what exactly the BATFE was trying to accomplish and what the end game was for this operation?
      I have researched it and cant seem to come up with a reasonable answer on how it was supposed to work and who was supposed to get arrested on the Mexican side of the border?

      • DwnRange

        They were supposed to have ended up being used in crimes here in the US by cartel members, so that the government could claim a need for more Second Amendment restrictive legislation and laws – just another back-door false flag – which is why their own agents were forced to wave bye to them in the first place instead of prosecuting them as they normally would have done. Gun shop owners did their part in reporting this practice, but the government had it’s own agenda and that was to use it as a ploy to get rid of guns in America.

        • Cymond

          Yeah, that’s pretty much my view, too.

          I’d like to hear a detailed explanation from the other side, the side that argues this was a legit investigation.

  • Darhar M.

    Yet Holders BMF Obama covered for him so Holder retires into private practice & big money lectures rather then “Go directly to jail.”

  • TheNotoriousIUD

    Doubt they caused much damage with no scope.

    • phuzz

      Everything there looks pretty dusty and beat up, possibly the scope was damaged or detached during the raid?

      • Bill

        Everything down there is dusty and beat up ;). If there was a decent scope, it probably wound up on a Marina Barrett.

    • Wandering Spleen

      Don’t these come with folding irons?

      • TheNotoriousIUD

        Dont believe so.

        • Wandering Spleen

          Ok. I’ll write this a s a statement then.

          The M82 comes with emergency folding iron sights.

          • Wandering Spleen

            The front sight is part of the rail, and you can also see the rear sight in the picture provided in the article.

          • TheNotoriousIUD

            OK, and im sure the Mexican Davy Crockett ventilated mucho gringos with them.

          • mosinman

            He’s actually called Xxx_S1N@l0A_MEX_9161821_xxX and he specializes in Noscopes.

    • skusmc

      The deal was he gets the scope once Hillary is in.

      • Hilly in where? the big house.

      • albaby2

        Corrupt Mexican Military probably stole it before they could get a picture of it.

    • Tassiebush

      Yeah I was thinking that unless it got removed post raid it looks like they weren’t so serious about using it.

    • John

      Shows what you know, noob. #xXx420bLaZeUrMoMxxx

  • john huscio

    I often wonder why el chapo never just went to norinco in China (or DIO in Iran) and just placed an order for 5-10,000 type 56s, have them shipped to Acapulco or whatever his choice of port was, pay the port authority to look the other way while a couple container loads of AKs got trucked into Sinaloa and voila! You now have everyone in your organization with standardized arms and ammo. Streamlines everything and Cuts down on the cost of getting shitloads of multiple calibers for the hodgepodge of weaponry they had before….

    • dannye

      Probably because Norinco is less corrupt than the Obama administration.

      • MichaelZWilliamson

        Yeah, the Chinese likely care about End User Certificates, given their interest in “developing” Africa.

        • dannye

          Hey, the Chinese have done more to develop African infrastructure than the US ever has. All the US has done recently is give them ISIS to handle.

    • n0truscotsman

      Because they probably know where they will end up, and that the western media will place them under a outrage microscope (while simultaneously ignoring the US government doing the same thing, because, ‘interests’ and stuff like that).

  • MPWS

    Probably something as easy as Saudi – Nusra – ISIS connection. It’s a worldwide market. Any surprise?

  • TheSmellofNapalm

    Just did some reading on recent ATF gunwalking scandals, what a perfect example of organized incompetence. I’d love to see an interview of whoever thought it was a good idea to let them walk out. The next time someone proposes something like this, they should also be required to bust down the door of the jefes in Mexico who received the guns. Then we’ll see if there are any heroes in the ATF.

  • Bill

    If you worked undercover, and don’t see how this is supposed work, and aren’t more qualified than the average blog reader to describe how complex cases are developed, you must have really sucked at your job.

    • Hensley Beuron Garlington

      So disagreeing with your bs means I must of really sucked at my job?!
      Bill, you’re really showcasing your authority on the subject. And mostly what a jackass you are.

      So you still insist we don’t know what we are talking about and yet you ignore that law enforcement and even ATF agents directly involved with the operation questioned the integrity and the purpose of the program. ATF agents are even recorded getting stand down orders and were forced to let the guns walk right across the border, literally! You also ignore the fact that surveillance of the weapons was lost. The only way to recover the weapons now is to get them after they turn up in the “lost and found” evidence lockers of South American law enforcement.

      You’d have to be a moron not to see how stupid you sound.
      But I guess assuming we suck will helps you sleep at night. This operation needlessly has led to several deaths and more to come.
      At least, Operation Wide Receiver would intercept the guns before crossing the boarder. Catching the straw purchaser and the actual gun buyers. That was real police work. Not this crap.

      • Bill

        You need to hate this operation because anything else would conflict with your political and emotional worldview.

        You claim to have experience, and also claim that experience doesn’t make your opinion more valuable (or relevant, or accurate) than someone who does not. Now, that’s stupid. If you really had experience you’d know that there’s a large gulf between the operational, tactical and strategic elements of an operation, and the political and optical elements. I’m paid to catch bad guys, and it isn’t always pretty. Sucking up to the cameras and voters is above my pay grade.

        • Hensley Beuron Garlington

          Like I said, whatever helps you sleep at night.
          Keep earning that pay, Bub. Hopefully you and other boys in blue will not be killed because of this.
          In the meantime, I’m agreeing with everyone else that believes the operation was at best, recklessly FUBAR’ed, and at worst, tyrannical treason.

  • Edeco

    Thank you, seriously. There’s this idea that only LE are qualified to opine on LE work; it’s alienating. Conversely it’s nice to hear it refuted.

    • Hensley Beuron Garlington

      Educated thinking isn’t exclusive to members of or formally of law enforcement. Protect and serve. Not punish and rule.
      I can’t tell if Bill is just some TV cop show junkie know-it-all or one of those officers that would let the guns walk away and be used to kill fellow officers and others. “Just following orders”

    • Bill

      So you’re qualified to speak to how a doctor works, or a plumber, or an air traffic controller? What do you do? Maybe I can find something to criticize about it, even without and education, training, knowledge or experience in the field.

      • Edeco

        Yawn, denigration and anti-logic: Occupations are mystery-boxes incomprehensible to outsiders. No, there’s this thing called being informed and a stakeholder.

        I’m just glad some, most probably, LE embrace their role as part of society, rather than wanting to be insulated. It’s heartening.

        • Bill

          So, what do you do?

          • Edeco

            Hmmm, nope, not a chance. You can denigrate and claim esoteric knowledge without knowing my business.

          • Bill

            I now know that you have no ‘nads. There’s your daily dose of denigration.

    • Bill

      You can opine all you want, but that doesn’t mean that your opinion is valid, reliable or based in fact. In my opinion cauliflower is gross, but a dietician might disagree. Opinions and anuses….

      • Edeco

        …and the only way my opinion on LE could be valid is if I were in the field and agreed with you. Yeah, that’s not self-serving nonsense at all.

        • Bill

          Cops disagree with each other all the time, but at least we’ve all coming with the same knowledge base.

          • Edeco

            …unless they disagree with you. Then you can tell the other ones must have really sucked at their jobs right?

          • Bill

            Still haven’t heard what you do. Don’t be ashamed of it, there’s honor in my professions. Well, most. C’mon, jock up and walk it like you talk it.

            Not every cop is good at their job. Hopefully, what’s his name found something more to his talents, whatever they are.

  • jerry young

    obama says we aren’t responsible enough to own semi auto weapons but yet arms drug cartels with 50 cal rifles, will obama face prosecution for this? I’m sure el chapo having a 50 will really light a fire under the butts of American anti gun nuts even though this wasn’t even in America and their leader is the gun runner

  • Tor

    Where are the indictments? I thought gun trafficking was illegal. What? You mean the government has different rules from us normal folk?

  • Mike Lashewitz

    “Lost Track” no surprises there. Stings are not supposed to get good people killed.

  • What kind of personal body armor can stop a .50 650 grain bullet with over 12,000 FPE at the muzzle or even at 300 yards?

  • dltaylor51

    The only body armor i know of that will stop a 50BMG is an Abrams tank.

  • AmericanRemnant

    Indictments of Eric ‘The Red’ Holder and Co. in 3, 2, 1,……

    • Doom

      thats a great joke. no one is ever going down for this, or for all the murders caused by these guns knowingly sold to criminals.

      • AmericanRemnant

        Actually, the joke is that we have a lawful representative government conducting itself for the benefit of the people.

  • Paniolo Pete

    My thought as well!

  • 1inidaho

    I find it a little bit ironic that no one is talking about the RPG sitting right next to it in the photo. If this photo was taken at the firefight where El Chapo was captured, this should blow the whole shady argument about gun control right out of the water. If they can get their hands on an anti-tank weapon, buying guns out of the US from Texas gun stores is the least of anyone’s problems. As we have said in the past, the cartels have access to any arms they want. There are global arms sellers who will do business with them.

  • Djs588

    A major factor of ships loaded with AK’s coming to the docks in the western States can be linked to the President at the time. After all, Hillary wasn’t going to let Bill do anything to upset the Chinese.

    • Indiana Mike

      You’re correct. I think it’s somewhere in Chairman Mao’s Little Red Book that Hillary has been disseminating and following slavishly her whole damned, worthless life.

  • albaby2

    Thanks. Good link. If they paid 2 gs for a Norinco, they are desperate. Funny that more Media didn’t post that story. I guess “more than the media admits” helps explain it. They could have had illegals carry them over the US-Mexico border

  • Josh Rothman

    Three mentions of shooting down helicopters in one short Fox article tells me they were given a script by someone (the Obama admin? nah, couldn’t be…) , that they know nothing about firearms in general, .50 cals in particular, and much of anything else of value. What’s so special or dire about a rifle that could potentially take down a helicopter? At four feet long and 25 or 30 puunds or so, it’s not like anyone will be “skeet shooting” at Hueys with that rifle, and yet the RPGs in the photo, designed for targets like helicopters and definitely unavailable thru your local gunshop, go unmentioned. This shows that they’re interested in promoting an agenda, not news. Color me unsurprised…

    • Cymond

      I’m pretty sure Antis have used the helicopter rhetoric before, so maybe Fox was trying to turn it against the current administration? Logically, if these guns are so super bad & dangerous, why were they allowed to walk?

  • Doom

    To be honest I am less worried about a .50 and more worried about the freaking RPG and M16 with a grenade launcher lol… Not like this is going to stick to Obama, he is the new teflon don with hillary right behind on how they can slip through anything.

    Maybe I should become a drug lord so I can have cool guns since they are all Banned or may as well be banned in the US.

  • Indiana Mike

    So Fast and Furious did what it was designed to do; put illegal weapons into the hands of drug cartels at direct Obama Regime order. What it DIDN’T do was turn American Citizens against guns. Epic fail. But Obama and Holder are above the Law……. It’s GOOD to be de King!!!

  • Kivaari

    The normally ignorant US news reader will not explain the RPG7 and M16 with M203 as being military weapons likely coming from central American users of Soviet and Chinese RPGs, while the M203 set-up likely was stolen from the Mexican Army, by a deserting soldier. Our public, including lawmakers (and breakers) will focus on the military gear without thinking, blaming it on the gun show loophole.