BREAKING: US Army Selects Sig To Replace M9 Original Post Updated at 11pm With SIG Press Release and Photos of the Pistol

In a move that will define Army small arm procurement for decades, the Department of Defense has just announced that they have selected Sig Sauer to produce a “Modular Handgun System” for Army warfighters. The new handgun will replace the current M9 sidearm and is the culmination of over five years of testing and trials between several manufacturers.

The new Army pistol. I just got this from SIG. This is the actual pistol.

Obviously, we are awaiting information from Sig to fill in all the blanks, but the big questions remain. Is the P320 the “Modular Handgun System” and what frame sizes are included with the guns? How many pistols will Sig end up supplying the Army?

And will we see lawsuits from the other “losing” manufacturers who submitted pistols for consideration?

By the way, at $300 a piece, $580M buys roughly 1.93M pistols over 10 years. That’s a lot of hardware.

Watch our video review of the SIG P320

From the Department of Defense Press Operations:

Sig Sauer Inc., Newington, New Hampshire, was awarded a $580,217,000 firm-fixed-price contract for the Modular Handgun System including handgun, accessories and ammunition to replace the current M9 handgun. Bids were solicited via the Internet with nine received. Work locations and funding will be determined with each order, with an estimated completion date of Jan. 19, 2027. Army Contracting Command, Picatinny Arsenal, New Jersey, is the contracting activity (W15QKN-17-D-0016).


From the Army Times Article:

Half a decade into its search for a new handgun, the Army has chosen Sig Sauer’s version of the Modular Handgun System, according to a Thursday announcement from the Army.

The new sidearm will replace the M9 Beretta, the Army’s pistol of choice for more than 30 years.

“I am tremendously proud of the Modular Handgun System team,” said Army acquisition executive Steffanie Easter in the release. “By maximizing full and open competition across our industry partners, we have optimized private sector advancements in handguns, ammunition and magazines and the end result will ensure a decidedly superior weapon system for our warfighters.”

The Army first announced the competition for the MHS back in 2011, but multiple delays left the most recent solicitation deadline at February of 2016.

 

UPDATE:

TFB has been after SIG today to get a statement on the contract. Of course we got nothing but now that TFB announced it I just got the press release with photo. Read the press release and check the photo also. I don’t think they intended to release it this soon but since we had the information. Phil

SIG SAUER, Inc. Awarded the U.S. Army Contract for its New Modular Handgun System (MHS)

Newington, NH (January 19, 2017) – SIG SAUER, Inc. announced today that the U.S. Army has selected the SIG SAUER Model P320 to replace the M9 service pistol currently in use since the mid-1980’s. Released in 2014, the P320 is a polymer striker-fired pistol that has proven itself in both the United States and worldwide markets. The P320 is the first modular pistol with interchangeable grip modules that can also be adjusted in frame size and caliber by the operator. All pistols will be produced at the SIG SAUER facilities in New Hampshire.

The MHS Program provides for the delivery of both full size and compact P320’s, over a period of ten (10) years. All pistols will be configurable to receive silencers and will also include both standard and extended capacity magazines.

“I am tremendously proud of the Modular Handgun System Team,” said Army Acquisition Executive, Steffanie Easter in the release. “By maximizing full and open competition across our industry partners, we truly have optimized the private sector advancements in handguns, ammunition and magazines and the end result will ensure a decidedly superior weapon system for our warfighters.”

Ron Cohen, President and CEO of SIG SAUER, said “We are both humbled and proud that the P320 was selected by the U.S. Army as its weapon of choice. Securing this contract is a testimony to SIG SAUER employees and their commitment to innovation, quality and manufacturing the most reliable firearms in the world.”

The new Army pistol



Pete

LE – Science – OSINT.
On a mission to make all of my guns as quiet as possible.
Pete.M@staff.thefirearmblog.com
Twitter: @gunboxready
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https://www.instagram.com/tfb_pete/


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  • Alex Fehrman

    Whoa. First comment. Boom.

  • Anonymoose
    • Gary Kirk

      We have lift off in 5 4 3.. Glock boys have officially detonated..

      • john huscio

        60% of state/local LE departments/agencies, FBI, pretty much all spec ops in every branch of the military……Glocks doing pretty well without servicewide adoption…..

        • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

          Absolutely.

          I attended a Fed-sponsored LEO terrorist-related series of training sessions last fall at a local college…. over 450 attendees. Everyone from local law enforcement to FBI to Secret Service & BATFE in attendance.

          Did a quick assessment of what was being carried (that I could see) by the attendees – I saw ONE fellow carrying what appeared to be a H&K, but the rest?

          Glock World.

          • valorius

            Tons of cops in my neck of the woods carry S&Ws.

          • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

            Depends upon what the state/city/municipality decides to buy on performance, or mostly cost.

            My nephew is a cop in the People’s Republic of Maryland… they replaced their H&Ks ten years ago with something ‘cheaper’ (forgotten what the replacement was). VERY unhappy cops as a result, thanks to a clueless bureaucrat and a fast talking gun manufacturer saleman – huge contract.

          • Kivaari

            Not taking the job because the department issues Glocks seems extreme. You can learn how to use the pistol safely. Would you have joined if they used S&W M&Ps? SA-XDs?

          • valorius

            I don’t like Glocks Mr. White.

            I do not like the idea of a perp who gets his hands on my weapon having exactly zero impediments to making it fire (A huge % of cops killed in the line of duty are killed by their own weapon). I also have seen enough reholstering ND madness caused by something as simple as a drawstring draped over the holster to know that it’s not a gun i want on or near my person in high stress situations.

          • Bill

            Rule of life: you may love a gun, until you are required to carry it and it alone. Then it becomes the worst gun in the world.

            It’s a lot like marriage.

          • Kivaari

            Learn to love it. I was not a big Glock fan until I was issued one and spent 10 years with it. At the time it was the best service pistol I had ever been issued or had to buy. If you want the job, take the job. If your gun has issues, report it.

          • retfed

            Agreed. I was an Old Revolver Cop (still am) when I started carrying an authorized, personally-owned Glock 17 in 1989. (I’d carried 1911s in the past, in addition to K-frames.) The Glock became my favorite duty and off-duty weapon. It’s been superseded since I no longer go looking for trouble, but it’s still my go-to if things get ugly.

          • Bill

            My first issued gun was a S&W M&P – not THAT M&P, but a .38 Special Model 10 M&P, and I thought I was doomed, though it did have a HSLD heavy barrel. 30+ years later I’d love to have it back, and if I was rich I’d collect Model 10 variants.

          • Kivaari

            One of my first duty guns was a M10 Heavy Barrel. It was a great service gun.

          • retfed

            Ha! You whippersnappers! The first gun I was issued (in 1976) was an old pre-Model 10 M&P, with the round top grips. I forget how many screws it had, but it was made before I was born.
            It had been in service for so long and fired so many times that its action was like glass. If it had had decent sights, you could have shot it at the Olympics.

          • Bill

            A: Feds a state guys rarely have the opportunity to step outside the agency box and carry whatever they want, though many can carry personally owned copies of the agency guns.
            B: Its hard to beat the GLOCK on price and packaging.
            C: Every holster and mag pouch maker on the planet makes stuff for GLOCKs.
            D: Small departments may be a lot more liberal about what can be carried, but non-gun guys and gals recognize the GLOCK name, and frequently get them based on name recognition alone.
            E: If your training was 10 or 20 years ago it would have been SIG P-World.

            GLOCKs are fine pistols, but we live in a time when there are relatively few bad pistols, and agencies are replacing and/or changing guns more frequently.

          • Baggy270

            Glocks in Canada are now running just over $1000 but M&P’s, p320’s, FN’s, Canik’s etc are all in the $600-$800 range. Glock’s are over priced up here. Guns are so much more in general here cause our dollar is only worth 75 cents.

        • iksnilol

          Found the fanboy!

          😀

          • Kivaari

            I am a Glock fanboy. But, I’d sure like to get my hands on a duplicate of the army issue pistol. Even though it has an un-needed thumb safety, it should be an excellent pistol. One can ignore the safety.

          • valorius

            does the safety allow for cocked and locked carry?

          • Bill

            Snerk

          • Kivaari

            The SIG is always cocked when a round is chambered. Unlike the Glock where the striker is partially retracted the SIG has it fully to the rear. So, yes, it allows cocked and locked. I prefer the Glock as it is like packing a revolver, always at rest and safe until the trigger is pulled to the rear. I don’t like guns that have the striker fully to the rear. Like the SA-XD and HK-VP9.

          • valorius

            I don’t like striker fired guns in general. The only exception for me is the HK P7.

          • Kivaari

            I owned an liked the P7. With a little use it became natural to squeeze the grip. I liked how it returned to safe when holstered or simply relaxing the grip. I didn’t like the complexity. So far of all the striker fired pistols I’ve used or simply looked at I prefer the Glock.

          • spydersniper

            The problem with glock striker fires is that if it doesn’t fire on the first shot you have to eject the round. On hammer fires you jusy pull the trigger again, and90% of the time it fires on the second pull.

          • Kivaari

            I put over 30,000 rounds through my G17 without a misfire.

          • valorius

            You’re a sample of one. I have had many centerfire cartridges fail to fire on me over the decades. At least a dozen.

          • Robert Kalani Foxworthy

            Kivaari probably swaps out the striker spring or at least does not leave it under tension for long periods of time.

          • valorius

            Centerfire ignition failures are certainly very rare- but they absolutely do happen. I once had a whole magazine of Remington 100gr .380acp Golden Sabers fizzle when i fired them. While not technically a primer failure, they hit my target with all the force of a spit wad.

            The really disconcerting part about it was that i had them in my carry gun for a good couple months. o.O

          • Robert Kalani Foxworthy

            I was referring to light strikes which are common in Glocks when striker is under tensions for long times.

          • valorius

            I know, i’m just sayin’.

          • spydersniper

            ny

          • priest2

            Bingo and Bingo again!

          • valorius

            I hate the trigger on the glock, and it’s “any 2 year old child can make it discharge with ease” operating system.

          • Kivaari

            Don’t let 2 year olds have access to your Glock or other handguns. I don’t leave loaded guns out for kids to handle.

          • valorius

            My point is that it is insanely easy to unintentionally discharge. Even a monkey (or PCP juiced felon who just wrestled your duty gun away) could fire a glock with ease with a 100% success rate. I like a good long DAO trigger with a manual safety for a service weapon. The HK P7 is in many ways the epitome of the perfect pistol, but sadly it’s outdated in materials and capacity nowadays.

            I’ve let dozens of people try my P7 at the range. If i don’t specifically tell them how the squeeze cocker works, i have yet to see a single person be able to fire it without fumbling around looking for a safety for several seconds before looking back over their shoulder at me with a confused look on their face.

            A modern P7 type pistol with a polymer frame and double stack mag would to me be the perfect duty weapon. The P7 also has probably the 2nd best factory trigger pull of any pistol ever made too, behind only the legendary Sig P210.

          • Kivaari

            What about all those DA revolvers cops carried for a century before auto loaders became popular. It is a non-issue. What has saved cops, and fewer are shot with their own gun today than 40 years ago, are holsters and training and body armor.

          • valorius

            A whole lot of cops got shot to death with those DA revolvers.

            “According to the FBI, of the 616 police officers killed between 1994 and 2003, 64 were killed with their own weapon.”

            64 dead cops over a period of 9 years is hardly what i’d call a “non issue.”

            Then we have this:

            “From 2000 to 2010 51 officers were killed with their own weapons.”

            51 is likewise not a “non issue.”

            (google the quoted text for sources)

          • Kivaari

            It is under 10% anymore. When I started it was hitting upwards of 25%. 10% are beaten to death with bare hands and feet. 10% by environmental weapons. It’s always an issue, that we are doing better at.

          • valorius

            The last years i found stats for, it was exactly 10%. Surely retention holsters are a big part of the reason the number has gone down, but i have no doubt manual safeties also drive the number down as well. Lots of dep’ts still mandate a manual safety on their sidearms.

          • Kivaari

            I don’t know of many departments that carry a pistol with a manual safety option. When I was working no one in the county carried anything but Glocks. I think a few places still carry Gen 3 S&W but they are rare. The M92/96 is rare. Rugers are even rarer. Many of those that did have those had models with decock only features. I used a Rguer P95 for awhile and the decock only feature was better than the M92 standard safety.

          • valorius

            Several depts in my neck of the woods carry M&Ps with manual safeties and at least one still even carries 3rd generation smiths with manual safeties (at least as recently as 2 years ago when i last got my permit renewed).

          • retfed

            Shooting at a range is different from shooting in a fight. Your hypothetical bad guy is much more likely to deactivate the squeeze cocker safety on a P7 with an adrenaline-induced crush grip than someone you’ve handed a new gun on the range, who doesn’t want to hurt it. I love the P7, but not as a street gun.
            I also don’t believe the “manual safety is better” mantra. I worked LE for 30 years in a large city whose PD allowed its officers to carry personally-owned guns off a large “approved” list. The only two fatal NDs I know of were done with 1911s. And I personally found myself in the same situations as those 1911-armed officers did, only I didn’t have manual safeties on my guns, and no loud noises ensued. It’s a matter of training, and saying one system is “safer” than another ignores a lot of variables.

          • valorius

            If you’ve never handled a P7 i can see why you’d think so, but activating the squeeze cocker on a P7 is a very deliberate action. There are a few documented incidents where P7’s were in fact secured by criminals and they were unable to kill the person they took them from. Massaad Ayoob has written about a few of them.

            Even if 1 crook in 100 figured out how to shoot you with your own P7, your still better off than if he wrestled a Glock off you, where the chance of him making it go boom is 100%.

            The 1911 is a ND prone design, I agree (As is the Glock), but it’s not because of the manual safety. This is why the US military mandated condition 3 carry when it was a general issue weapon.

            There is a happy medium. To me that happy medium is a quality DAO pistol with an easily manipulated well placed ambidextrious manual safety, an LCI, and a training regimen that instills muscle memory where the individual swipes off the safety as the weapon is drawn.

          • retfed

            I’ve handled and shot quite a few P7s, both the M8 (which I really liked) and the M13 (which I didn’t; it was too fat). I love shooting them on the range. Shooting a P7 is like pointing your finger. I had a chance to carry one on duty, but I declined, both because I didn’t like the squeeze cocker and because I didn’t like the light trigger. But if it works for you, have at it.
            I see your point regarding the disarming issue. Ayoob has also written the same thing about 1911s.
            I’m sure you know that when NJSP issued P7M8s back in the 70s or 80s, they had quite a few NDs because troopers were taping down the squeeze cockers. (I’ve seen 1911 carriers do the same thing with the grip safety. Never underestimate the ability of people to be stupid.)
            And I agree with you about the DAO pistol (my favorite design), but again, I’m not a fan of the manual safety.

            You like the P7 for carry, and I don’t. I like the Glock and you don’t. Different strokes.

            But I think we can both agree on the Type 94 Nambu.

          • valorius

            One NJ cop shot himself twice with a P7. Taping down the squeezecocker on a P7 is an invitation to meet darwin personally. Those cops did us all a favor by removing themselves from the force (hopefully).

            I like manual safeties on duty weapons because in many cases they prevent you from being killed by your own gun, which is well documented.

            For concealed carriers i think a manual safety is a lot less important.

          • retfed

            Not arguing with you, but a point about built-in safety devices:
            As you know, the metal-framed Smith autos (39/59/etc.) all had magazine disconnectors. When the Illinois State Police went to the Model 39 in 1967, they started teaching troopers that, if they were in a fight for their weapon and felt they were losing, they should dump the magazine. This technique actually saved the lives of over 20 troopers during the 30 or so years they carried Smith autos (39, 59, 459, etc.). Then in the late 90s, ISP went to the Glock.
            Don’t ask me to explain it.

          • valorius

            I love S&W 3rd gen autos with the magazine disconnect. I had a hybrid-custom 5903 frame/6906 slide that was my carry/work gun for about 15 years. I still regret selling it.

          • Dr Duke (not David)

            Those metal S&W semi autos were great.
            I wish they still made them but I guess the market has spoken and Tupperware is in and metal is out.

          • pismopal

            I also own and carry Glock, at work and I also own an interesting P7. I shoot the P7 occasionally and I find the squeeze system counterintuitive and in my opinion, unsafe as hell. Maybe with extensive training it could become safe to use to go along with accuracy and quality but damn you had better remember to ease up when you don’t want to AD in somebody.

          • spydersniper

            The gun is designed to be fired by cocking the grip and squeezing the trigger. It is also designed to fire by holding the trigger and squeezing the handle in case the trigger finger is disabled and last but not least you can fire it by pressing and holding the handle against a flat surface and just pulling the trigger. It has only 11 moving parts and has yet to have an Officer killed by being shot with his own pistol by any body that has gotten it away from its carrier

          • spydersniper

            Incorrect. No safety on DHS guns. Rounds load hammer down. Initial pull on trigger 8 lbs. If you pull to fire and decide not to it returns the hammer. If you decide to fire it is only a 5 lb pull. I can assure you it is closer to a revolver. As you know from military service the M-9 is also carried hammer down like a revolver. The Coast Guard is the only military service allowed to carry it that way as we are a civilian law enforcement agency on CONUS an on foreign national ships

          • Raguel A’septem

            It’s striker-fired… the Army requested the manual safety because… well… soldiers.

          • valorius

            The Army knows what a 18yo private is capable of. Hence, safeties on virtually every weapon system in the military.

          • SirOliverHumperdink

            Just get a Cominolli thumb safety.

          • Kivaari

            I don’t want an un-needed safety. Glocks are not cocked until the trigger is pulled. They are like packing a DA revolver, safe while at rest.

          • Bob Atom

            It is not the “at rest” that makes striker fire pistols less than the best choice for the average shooter. It is ALL the other times a person is handling the weapon. What happens to fine motor skills when confronted with a highly stressful situation? Yeah, I want my fellow American to have that light trigger pull right away. Goes for LEOs also.

          • Kivaari

            I packed a Glock for over 10 years for duty, and put over 30,000 rounds through it. No one on the department had NDs with the Glock because of a light trigger. We even installed the 3.5# connectors. Just like a revolver the Glock is at rest and on safe when holstered. I used the gun under high stress situations and never came close to having a ND. We had one gun do a kaboom with a double charge. The gun kept on functioning but received a cracked frame. We fixed that with a new frame at $75. It all comes down to training. Keep the finger off the trigger unless you intend to shoot.

          • valorius

            Lots and lots of cops shoot themselves with glocks.

          • n0truscotsman

            Thats a training issue, not a ‘stress issue’ otherwise traiend people wouldn’t be able to operate combat vehicles and aircraft effectively.

          • valorius

            I absolutely agree here. I had a female cop point her glock at me with her finger on the trigger once many years ago, and i was sure i was going to be accidentally shot the way her hand was shaking and her voice was quaking. (I was repossessing a car and the owner called the cops and said i was stealing it, a common occurrence repossessors have to deal with).

          • SirOliverHumperdink

            So when you carry a G26 -holsterless- w/ a clipdraw in your front pants pocket (as I do) you would trust that gun with one in the pipe next to your junk? Un- needed? Hardly.

          • Kivaari

            One doesn’t carry a G26 in a pants pocket without a proper holster. The Glocks are holster guns. If you want a pocket pistol, pack a Centennial, like I do. I found the G26 to be too block-like to carry in a pocket. It “prints”. I have a belt holsters for my Glocks.

          • SirOliverHumperdink

            This ‘one’ does and no, it doesn’t ‘print’ on my 6’2″ 230 frame with carharts or dickies. Belt holsters require jackets. I rarely wear one and the sloppy in the pants, un-tucked shirt carry looks goofy on me.

          • Kivaari

            We tried them in uniform pants pockets and they were just obvious.
            If you carry one in a pocket do you use a pocket liner/holster? Or do you pack it with a dry chamber? I owned a couple G26 and G27 and always got rid of them since they were just too big for my pockets and required a holster. So, if I needed a holster, I felt I may as well pack a G19 or G23.

          • valorius

            To me a glock is a competition or fun range gun. I would never carry a glock with a chambered round, i’ve just read too many stories of cops doing absolutely nothing wrong and still having the gun go off from something like a jacket flap or drawstring blowing into their holster while the gun was drawn, and discharging on re-holstering.

            That is simply not a feature i’m looking for in a firearm.

            I would likewise not use one for a middle of the night nightstand gun, when i have to grope for it in the dark or handle it while half asleep. I have a Ruger SP101 .357 magnum DA revolver with night sights that i use for that sort of thing.

          • valorius

            I would suggest you carry something else that will allow you to safely carry with a round in the chamber while in pocket carry mode. I carry my Ruger LCP with pocket clip and know a ND is virtually impossible with that long, relatively heavy trigger pull.

          • valorius

            They are like packing a cocked revolver. No safety at all, and a short light hair trigger pull.

          • Kivaari

            Not at all, since the Glock is not cocked. General issue the gun comes with a 5.5# trigger (more like 7#) and as long as the finger is indexed alongside the frame there is not risk of it going bang. When cops make the Glock go bang, it is due to the trigger being pulled to the rear.

          • valorius

            Just as long as your finger doesnt touch the trigger a cocked revolver won’t fire either. For all practical purposes, a Glock is a cocked revolver.

          • Kivaari

            NO! A Glock is not cocked. It is like a DA revolver at rest. The striker is not held at full-stroke until the trigger is shoved to the rear at about 7 pounds for a “5.5” pound factory trigger. It is not like a revolver on SA where a 2.5 pound press will fire the gun. If dropped a good revolver will not fire even if the hammer were to fall. The Glock can’t go to full stroke and depress the firing pin safety unless the trigger is shoved full stroke. There is no comparison between the two, except they carry the same. Hammer down on a revolver and at rest with a Glock. The Glock is unlike most striker fired pistols. Most keep the striker fully to the rear. Some show the firing pin is fully retracted because the tip sticks out the slide to give a tactile and visual indicator that it is cocked. When worn with the correct holster there is no access to the trigger on any of these guns.

          • valorius

            For all intents and purposes it’s like carrying a cocked gun, the fact that the ATF designated it as a DAO is a total joke.

          • Kivaari

            It’s getting silly. Perhaps it is considered a DAO because it is a DAO.
            With people complaining that a Glock has TOO HEAVY OF A TRIGGER PULL your worries fly in the face of reality. My department even replaced the 5.5# connectors with 3.5# connectors, and we never had issues with a certified officer. ALL proper holsters cover the trigger, so it is not getting depressed while holstered. Every officer is trained to index properly, just like we did with revolvers and DA/SA semi-auto pistols. You’ve carried your prejudices too far beyond common sense and the real world.

          • valorius

            No it’s not. The take up and pressure to fire are similar to that of a 1911. It’s the same as carrying a 1911 with the safety off, or a cocked revolver.

            So what if the firing pin isnt cocked when the trigger pull is that short and light. It’s a meaningless distinction.

          • Kivaari

            No, it’s is not. It is nothing like a M1911 trigger pull. The take up alone is longer than the entire sweep of a M1911. Then the stacking at the end approaches 7 pounds. If you are so worried about it being too light you can always instal a NY trigger or NY #2 trigger and it is heavier than most DA revolvers. If you have a M1911 with a trigger pull as bad as a standard Glock, you need to get the thing tuned. You are getting silly now.

          • valorius

            Ok bud. Carry your glock with pride. When i owned one it sat in my safe.

          • Kivaari

            I carried mine for work, at least 10 years and 30,000 rounds. Right before retiring they issued my a new G34, with that 3.5# trigger. Great police pistol. I am sure the M17 will be an excellent service pistol for our troops. It makes more sense than the M9, but it should have been a Glock without an extra safety.

          • valorius

            Having witnessed the stupidity of privates on many occasions, I like the manual safety.

          • Kivaari

            Fear all ranks.

          • valorius

            2nd lieutenants are actually worse than privates in many respects. They’re like E-1s with command authority.

          • iksnilol

            Trust me, buddy, you ain’t no Glock fanboy.

            Fanboys are the ones who complain if something isn’t a Glock, and then complain if something has anything similar to a Glock (because it is a copy, but if it don’t have Glock features then it is outdated).

            You’re just a sane, rational individual who likes Glocks.

          • nighthawk9983

            I believe the official title for ‘glock fanboy’ is a Glocksucker and they are so salty right now not even tenifer finish can handle it

          • Robert Kalani Foxworthy

            point out nothing is unique about a glock. that it borrowed every thing from other guns even is square slide.

          • Bob Atom

            Why re people so down on the safety? As with ALL answers to shortcomings on their favorite firearm, simple training will make it automatic that a person disengages the safety, right? I like to think that disengaging the safety is between the ears…have you heard similar line before?

          • Kivaari

            I just liked how the Glock was so safe and so fast to use without the need for an external safety lever. It was like going from a DA revolver with 6 rounds to having 17 rounds. Dirt simple to use and no extra movement. I do think you can learn to use a safety. The one on the SIG looks good.

          • Juanito Ibañez

            “Even though it has an un-needed thumb safety…”

            Few people are aware that the only reason the Colt M1911 pistol had/has a thumb-operated safety was that the US Army demanded one be installed.

            Colt’s original submission for the Army handgun trials was their prototype M1910¹, which was virtually identical to the 1911 – sans the thumb safety.

            The 1910 was intended to be carried in a version of what’s come to be known as “Condition 0”: round is in the chamber and the hammer cocked (safety OFF), depending on the grip safety to prevent the trigger from being activated unless it was pulled by the firer.

            The Army, not trusting that method, and looking to “idiot-proof” the pistol, demanded the addition of the thumb-activated safety.

            Despite Colt’s complying with the Army’s demands, in their “infinite wisdom”, the Army mandated their soldiers carry the piston in “Condition 3” – chamber is empty and hammer down with a charged magazine in the gun: same as they do with the M9 Beretta today (AFAIK).

            We Air Force airmen, OTOH, being more “intelligent” than the average soldier, carried our M9 pistols “charged” (loaded magazine/round chambered) with the safety OFF: Draw, Aim, FIRE. 🙂

            1. Colt M1910 prototype

            http://www.coltautos.com/images/1910_5.jpg

          • Kivaari

            That would be like packing a Glock fully stuffed and ready for use. I kind of like that.

        • n0truscotsman

          Yeah its like people are forgetting about Glock selling to pretty much *everybody else* both inside and outside the US. Police officers, special operations, military, and any other organization that needs handguns.

          The ball is in the Armys court now. They adopted the P320, they have to iron out any issues that arise. the experience and support have been available for Glock for nearly 30 years now.

      • Rick Kirkpatrick

        “My Glock is so much better than a P230! All I did was replace the sights, trigger and barrel. That’s comparing apples to apples, right? RIGHT?”

    • Konflict7993

      Are we going to see a great glockeppuku soon?

    • kyle893

      People don’t realize how thoroughly corrupt the Army is in matters like this so I bet Sig knew to try and grease some palms before submitting the 320 in there. Which is cool because it’s a good gun and all the idiots who can’t think for themselves will argue about which is better between the glock and sig for the foreseeable future.

      • pun&gun

        Yep. I’m tempted to lose respect for any company that actually wins a large contract like this, because we all know they had to bribe people.

      • iksnilol

        I dunno, Glock might have won if they had manufactured a product that the Army wanted.

        • Jared Vynn

          They just tried to copy Berretta’s strategy, they got the loss of slide part down at least.

        • valorius

          Exactly.

      • Steve_7

        It’s not that they’ve greased palms, SIG-Sauer are already manufacturing the P320 in the US whereas the Glock 17 and 19 are manufactured in Austria and only assembled in the US. Plus Glock is neck deep in lawsuits, some of which look likely to stick at some point, so that no doubt a factor as well. Admittedly SIG-Sauer is currently facing criminal investigation in Germany but that has no real impact on the US operation.

      • nighthawk9983

        More Glocksucker propaganda. The Air Force doesn’t want Cessnas for the same reason the army doesn’t want glocks.

      • TeaPartyPagan

        No, there were several good horses in the race, but if you look at all the options, the Sig got to the finish line fair and square. It was everything the military wanted and the whole system was already in production. FN and S&W were close (IMO, closer than Glock), but I believe the Sig is a good, honest choice.

    • john huscio

      SIGs found itself a whole new world of beta testers…..

      • Anonymoose

        Speaking of SIGs that were crappy in their first iteration, I think they may have discontinued the 556 line entirely. The XI models aren’t even on their new site, the P232 and P224 are gone, and the P250s are gone except for the .22 model (I assume you could turn a 320 into a 250 with the right replacement parts, as people did that to make P320 .45s before the real .45 version was released).

        • The 556 line was known to be at the end of the line, so it being discontinued in 2017 is hardly a surprise. I’ve got a 556 SBR and a 556R, and I love both… but they’re obsolete compared to other choices.

          • Kivaari

            Not obsolete, just not state of the art.

        • Rodney Jenkins

          What is your point?

        • Chris Miller

          In my experience on both sides of the gun counter at Cabela’s, it will be a year or so before the current stock of yesteryear’s models dry up. Especially the P250 which doesn’t sell well because there are too many people which can’t shoot, or dislike shooting, a DAO handgun. There are still several P224’s as well, and that’s at Grand Junction, CO; small market compared to other places.

        • SirOliverHumperdink

          I have a 551 classic and it’s everything but crappy. Everyone who lusted after them when they were $10k and wanted one, including me, bought one.

          • nighthawk9983

            The $10k ones are made in Switzerland with tight tolerances, a lot of the 551A-1 are made by apes and have sloppy fit and finish. Im just annoyed they discontinued the *magazines* as well, everyone could use those.

    • Gamle Aker

      Navy Seals gonna replace the P226 with Glock 19

      • valorius

        The Seals have all kinds of different handguns.

    • valorius

      I did tell everyone who would listen that the US Army would never select the glock.

    • John

      Ah…another exploding Glock.

      JK

      • Kivaari

        Why do Glocks explode? Overloads, squibs, aftermarket barrels and lead bullet use. When you see a Glock exploded almost every instance is an improperly load round of ammunition.

        • disqus_f62emCdwDh

          Not to put too fine a point on this, but is it “only” the sheer number of them in duty holsters that provide the photos of Glocks that have injured their shooters, while other designs appear to be less susceptible to this issue?

          Or, could it be the reduced barrel cross-section at 4 and 8 o’clock, the deep feed ramp incursion into the chamber, the many reports of out of battery firing, and the path of gasses that go straight through to the trigger slot onto one’s index finger as well as generally blowing out the right side of the plastic receiver?

          The conclusion I’ve come up with is that one should only trust the Glock design in 9X19 as it appears to be the only caliber the design is chambered for that does not experience these episodes of catastrophic destruction.

  • USMC03Vet

    Called it.

    All my predictions in 2016 are happening. Miss Cleo, watch out!

    • Joseph Goins

      Mine didn’t. I said that a particular candidate would croak before the election due to natural causes.

    • LCON

      I don’t think she is too Worried about you… She Died in July

      • Grindstone50k

        Didn’t see that coming.

        • Winston Behle

          Neither did she, apparently.

      • USMC03Vet

        Well, damn. So much material gone now.

  • Herschel Walker

    That was unexpected. They surely are going with a striker right? So…they pick a company that built their first striker last year?

    • Anonymoose

      And Gaston did what? Nothing really has changed with Glock firing mechanisms since 1980, and Gaston Glock was a chemical engineer with no knowledge of firearms until he slapped the 17 together.

      • n0truscotsman

        The Glock also has user experience spanning since the 1980s, civilian and military. The P320? not even close. Thats huge.

        • HollowTs

          Well Sig has been making firearms for a couple of weeks now. So there’s that.

          • n0truscotsman

            SIG’s previous models that predate Glock =/= the P320.

            SIG is also not the same pre-Glock, Cold War era organization.

    • Joseph Goins

      The company that perfected the striker and married it to a chassis frame that is modular (which the Army wanted all along).

  • mike

    But But But, I will see my lawyer.
    I wonder how the FN 5.7 performed in the tests.
    Many people were expecting the Glock 19 to win. I wonder if there are now lots of them in a Glock warehouse now, going cheap.

    • The Five-seveN was not in the tests.

    • Joseph Goins

      Glock is smart enough to know the old saying “don’t count the chickens till all the eggs are hatched.”

    • Geoff Timm

      Locally in North Florida, some Glock 19s have actually been advertised at 499.99 US$. Geoff Who bought a Walther Creed for $339.99…

  • Joshua

    No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

    • demophilus

      “Our chief weapon is fear. And surprise; fear and surprise…our two chief weapons are fear, surprise, and ruthless efficiency…”

      The US military’s sole handgun is the M9. And the M11. And the M45. And the Glock 19…

      The USM’s sole pistol will be the M17 MHS…

    • Major Tom

      “No one expects the Swiss Inquisition!”

      Fixed. This gun is Swiss, not Spanish.

      • Anonymoose

        These contracts continuously fan the flames of sectarian violence…meanwhile I’m over here not swearing allegiance to brand names… https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/d1449f71ea5fee91da38cd0ee014580d3760363a5957323b484de5ea3f8fdc05.jpg

        • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

          ROTFL!

        • Bob Atom

          Good one.

      • Andrew

        The P320 is totally a US designed and built gun. No Swiss influence. Nor is SIG Sauer partly owned by Swiss anymore. The owners are now German and almost all of the manufacturing is in the US. The only remaining Swiss part is the SG 550 rifles.

      • Joshua

        Sig USA is a totally seperate gun from the old Sig.

        This is a 100% USA designed and made gun.

        Of which I’m very happy to see a US designed and built gun selected.

        • valorius

          Same here…Make America Great Again.

  • Lee Attiny

    You can file suit for losing a bid? wtf.

    • John

      Yes you can. In big government acquisitions they actually build in time for the expected lawsuits from the losing companies. You see it all the time in aircraft and ship acquisition projects.

      • Anonymoose

        They’ll probably end up with some kind of screwy work-around like how SIG got the M11 contract so they can give G19s to USASOC, Intelligence, and CID, or something.

      • B-Sabre

        It only costs a postage stamp….

    • Joshua

      Yep, it happens every time to.

    • B-Sabre

      True story – the Army recently competed the first phase of the Improved Turbine Engine program (research and development) and one of the winners protested. Why? Because they didn’t get as much money as their competitor – but did get as much money as they bid. The Army’s response: “STFU and get to work.”

    • Grindstone50k

      Boeing are masters at this.

  • Cap’n Mike

    let the wailing and nashing of teeth begin!!!

  • VanDiemensLand

    Haha we’re still using the Hi-power.

    • John

      Nothing wrong with that. It’s a 1911 trigger and package in 9mm. Recover Tactical is working on making a polymer rail grip for it, if that interests you at all.

      • R H

        1911 trigger? Lmao, not even close!!! Don’t get me wrong, I love the Hi-Power for what it is, but a great trigger is not on that list. I’m not sure why the trigger is designed like it is, but I think it had something to do with JMB having to avoid infringing on patents for his older designs including the 1911.

        • 2805662

          Australian Mk3 Brownings have the magazine safety removed – nothing wrong with the trigger now.

          • Gus Butts

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/94039df1dc1becc832480212eeaa296bb7770ab4ebc6eaaca6a8a7cb599fe307.jpg

            The magazine safety isn’t the problem. The fact that this trigger design even exists is the problem and is why Hi-Power triggers are garbage. Here’s a crude drawing of the different trigger mechanism parts and I even omitted the magazine safety plunger.

            You pull the trigger, your trigger link/lever (1) gets pushed up into the slide, pushes the sear lever (2) and pivots it against the sear (3), thus releasing the hammer. The amount of different parts that gets pushed and pivoted back and forth from the frame into the slide into the frame again is completely retarded. Sorry if my trigger link looks like a male appendage.

            This is coming from a CF armourer who loves and works on old busted Hi-Powers so much I want to die, but their triggers are a complete wreck.

          • disqus_f62emCdwDh

            Depends greatly on the particular “Hi-Power.” Most, as you say, have a rancid pull weight, regardless of the magazine safety plunger. However, many of them are fairly clean, knocking a few coils off the garage door rated mainspring works wonders, or one could do it the “right” way and install a Wolff reduced power unit.

            Crud, I have one of the FEG Hungarian versions and did nothing to it besides a little synthetic grease on the sear/hammer interface. Result: 4.5lbs, crisp, no disassembly required. That said, with its longish press and reset distance, plus its rotation on the usual cross-pin, it is certainly not a 1911 trigger.

          • Gus Butts

            Nighthawk started customizing Hi-Powers, I’m very curious about what they’ve done to the triggers.

        • A Curmudgeon

          Um, infringe on his own 1911 patents??? REeaaallllyyy…. I’m sure the Browning company retained ownership of those patents after JMB died in 1924. And let’s see, 1935 – 1911 = 24 years and I think patents then held for 17 years. . . I don’t think so. And Dieudonné Saive was designing the HP trigger for different user specs anyway. Meh.

          • R H

            Reaaaalllllyyyy. JMB sold the rights to the 1911 design to Colt. The Hi Power was designed for FN beginning in 1914. Per the Wiki “Browning had previously sold the rights to his successful M1911 U.S. Army automatic pistol to Colt’s Patent Firearms, and was therefore forced to design an entirely new pistol while working around the M1911 patents. Browning built two different prototypes for the project in Utah and filed the patent for this pistol in the United States on June 28, 1923, granted on February 22, 1927.”

            The patents for the 1911 did indeed expire in 1928, but I am admittedly ignorant as to why Saive didn’t incorporate the 1911 trigger mechanism into the new design. There’s more than a few reasons that trigger isn’t copied in modern pistols today…

          • A Curmudgeon

            Well, nevermind, JMB had sold the 1911 patents to Colt. Wikipedia says there was need to work around them but what looks to me like a WWI-era slide from Colt lists patents dated 1897, 1902, 1905, 1911 & 1913. Only JMB’s 1923 version had to avoid Gov’t Model patents. . . and the thing was striker fired anyway. Wiki says the patents expired in 1928 but nothing there mentions trigger system components or anything but the switch to hammer-fired.

      • VanDiemensLand

        Nothing wrong at all, thats kinda the point, it performs all the roles a sside arm need to in a military…..not a whole lot of actual combat. Aus SASR use Glocks and USP’s from memory, although I welcome corrections.

        • Bill

          I wouldn’t hesitate to go in harm’s way with a Hi-Power, assuming that it fed modern, other than FMJ ammo.

  • Joseph Smith

    LOOK AT ME

    I’M THE OFFICIAL SIDEARM NOW

  • LGonDISQUS

    First thing I did was look to see whether Sig Sauer was a publicly traded company in America…

  • LazyReader

    I got 99 problems and a SIG ain’t one

    • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

      Nor do I, but this is coming from a Sig owner.

  • idahoguy101

    I could swear the M4 carbine replaced most pistols some years back

    • Anonymoose

      For Marine officers. Most troops who get an M4 are supposed to get an M9 too afaik.

      • Ron

        Not really, Officers and SNCOs only rate a carbine other than O6s and Navy Officers and Chiefs. I still own 60 organizational M9s and I do issue them to dual arm but I could easily also so, no you only rate a carbine.

    • LCON

      Pistols are still around and issued. M4A1 is the Army’s Standard rifle now . but a smaller weapon is always a need for some.

  • Johanne Johanne

    I sure hope they don’t go full steel frame. It’s time for a poly gun. Lighter, easier to carry. Striker or hammer? I don’t give a care. As long as it’s tough and reliable it should be a winner for the U.S. .mil.

    • Anonymoose

      The trial ones they’ve shown were still plastic-framed, but the beauty of the P320 is being able to change frames.

      • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

        I think the easily swapped grip modules is a plus in their book. If one gets damaged the gun is not a total loss.

  • Harry’s Holsters

    So how long and how many more competitions before they decide to go glock?

    I’ve got a P320 and it’s got nothing on a glock with night sights.

    • Gary Kirk

      Except the army contract.. hehe

      • Harry’s Holsters

        I’m still thinking April Fools came early. Or glock didn’t create a Chasis system and just submitted a Gen 4 19.

        • Gary Kirk

          Chassis system?? Glock is perfect..

          • Joseph Goins

            The title of the program was MODULAR HANDGUN SYSTEM. For everything good that it has going for it, Glock is not modular in the way that the military wanted.

          • Badwolf

            but damnit glock has modular backstraps!

          • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

            Ummmm….

            And, so does my XDS….

            And that & a buck will get you a fair cup of coffee at WaWa’s, but whatever… LOL

            Poor Glock.

    • Why does everyone seem baffled when SIG wins a contract? People forget that Glock dethroned SIG, SIG was the big boy in the service pistol market until Glock came around.

      Now SIG has a pistol that can compete with Glock and people act like SIG has no place winning contracts.

      That attitude is why Glock is always resting on their laurels, only releasing upgrades when they are forced to.

      • Harry’s Holsters

        Sig’s trigger is horrible. The grip feels good in the hand when fondling but not when shooting. Higher bore access. The sig isn’t a bad gun it’s just not as good as glock. The reason that glock can rest on it’s laurels is because so many companies fail to make a better gun. No one has come out with a gun that truly competes with the glock 19 in terms of size for capacity. Some do come close but still have a larger size. Glock has a lot of issue but so far most companies are failing miserably at addressing them and creating a better gun. Hudson might do it if they do well enough with the H9 to develop a $500-$600 polymer version of the H9.

        • Haha to paraphrase the late Pat Rogers “Something is wrong in the world when people claim that the Glock trigger is great.” And to quote the Dude “That’s just like your opinion man.”

          Honestly the Army and a lot of P320 users disagrees with you. I’ve shot a ton of both after the Grip Force and later the Gen 4, and I don’t see the Glock on the pedestal as you do because it cut the heck out of me until those came out. Glock users hold the scars up with pride for some reason.

          • Harry’s Holsters

            The same Army that chose the Beretta over the Sig back in the day. P320 compact is my best selling holster so I bought a P320 to see what the hype was about. It cuts my hands to and tears them up but that’s not an issue when I dry fire and shoot regularly keeping my calluses conditioned.

          • The Beretta M9 is a fine pistol. Smooth trigger, accurate, and reliable as long as you don’t use Checkmate mags. I honestly would’ve been just as happy if the whole MHS was canceled and they bought M9A3s as the M9s and M9A1s wore out.

            The M9 passed all the Army trails, unlike the 226 which failed the mud test. The only reason that the 226 advanced to bidding was because the Army needed someone to bid against Beretta. In the end not only did the M9 pass all the tests, it also came down to a cheaper price. This is all well documented, you can even find the GAO report on the M9 program online.

            Typical Glock fanboy, “Getting my hands cut up isn’t an issue.”

          • n0truscotsman

            How are you cutting your hands up!? The Glock slide is one of the most streamlined designs out there.

            And…grow stronger…Cuts happen when one actually trains.

          • iksnilol

            Me and you have different meanings to the word “streamlined”

          • n0truscotsman

            Minimal protrusions, thats what I mean by streamlined, which they are. No external safety, no aggressive machining, minimal items protruding from the slide and frame.

          • I shoot on average 15,000 to 20,000 rounds a year. I spend virtually every weekend practicing on the range, going to matches at least twice a month, or reloading.

            Cuts don’t happen, sure I have callouses on some areas of my hands, and some cracks in my skin from overuse, but rarely cuts from simply firing a gun. All just because the gun was designed by an engineer that likely never shot a gun, and didn’t think to put enough over a beaver tail on the gun so you can get a nice high grip. And of course the engineers are so arrogant that it took them nearly loosing the FBI contract to finally design add on beaver tails with the guns.

          • n0truscotsman

            IMO, the Gen 4 happened because Glock changed what worked before. Or “improved”.

            I agree that no firearm is ‘perfect’ with each design having its own advantages and disdvantages, but again, military handguns should emphasize reliability and functionality over comfort. Something the anti-Glock (not you) crowd doesn’t seem to grasp.

          • The Gen 4 wouldn’t have happened if it wasn’t forced on them by large LE like DHS and the FBI.

            The P320 is reliable, and function. In features a number of function improvements that the Glock doesn’t have. Like being fully ambidextrous, and not requiring the user to pull the trigger to take it down. Military firearms training, particularly on pistols is pretty piss poor. Clearing barrels after often shot more than qualification targets.

            And having a firearm that literally hurts the user isn’t a comfort issue. It inhibits proper firearms training because the user doesn’t want the pain of being shot. Look at the small pocket pistols like J-Frames and LCP/P3ATs no one wants to shoot them because they are painful. Same way with Glock slide bite.

          • n0truscotsman

            Often times, government agencies do not know WTF they are talking about when it comes to firearms. The FBI especially (although their tepid acceptance of 9mm after the whole 10mm debacle gives me a sliver of hope).

            The changes to the extractor (which started with the late gen 3s) and double recoil spring were unneeded and IMO negatively affected what was a good thing. Just needless changes. the grip change is perhaps the most welcome by the users.

            Honestly, I’ve seen grip bite with SIGs, Glocks, and other handguns that didn’t have an obvious beavertail. Its a training issue that is easily overcome by experience.

          • The government agencies know more about shooting that most gun manufacturers. A large part of the people working for gun companies are just normal folks that might shoot once in a blue moon, if at all, outside of company events. And that includes the engineers. At least at government agencies all sworn employees have to shoot at least once a year.

            I notice the reduced recoil with the double spring system, it wasn’t huge but it is a welcome change when I am shooting full power defensive ammo.

            You don’t overcome Glock slide bite with training, unless the training is to do exactly opposite of what you want for best shooting preformance. Getting slide bit with a SIG, M&P, and most other pistols is extremely hard to do if all you do is grip as high as possible on the tang.

          • n0truscotsman

            “The government agencies know more about shooting that most gun manufacturers.”

            Thats a questionable statement, and government agencies dont even hold a candle to civilian consumers, whose viewpoints are valued by companies that actually take quality seriously (and given forums now, companies have reputations tarnished if they dont take it seriously). And Im not talking about the guys that shoot a box of 9mm a year either.

            Slide bite is a training issue. End of story. I’ve trained many people of various experience and seldom have seen slide bite. It belongs to the realm of the ‘pig nosing” level of criticism.

          • Haha consumers. Yes there are some educated consumers whose opinions I value highly, but a vast majority of consumers hold opinions that hold little value.

            Spend a day working a booth at a show open to consumers, like the NRA Annual Meetings. If you some how make it through the day without murdering some idiot making too much noise in a nearby booth, you will have to go to the local urgent care to have your eyes treated for eye sprain due to excessive eye rolling.

            Take SIG for example, if they listened to the so called “experts” SIG would be in bankruptcy five years ago, not winning a government contract. Although I don’t approve of everything that Ron Cohen did as CEO, he took a company that was on the verge of bankruptcy, they barely were making payroll month to month. And turned them into a gun manufacturing power house. And not just guns, but now a diverse array of gun related products too like ammo, silencers, and optics.

            As far as the “end of story” on slide bite. I disagree, and think very negatively of people that think it is a training issue (ie I completely dismiss anything and everything gun related that the person says). The only way to not get is to put a beavertail on the gun, or grip the gun so low that it isn’t a repeatable grip, and the gun doesn’t properly recoil as the tang isn’t firming in the palm of the hand.

          • n0truscotsman

            The educated consumers/shooters are the ones who led to the renaissance in small arms evolutionary steps right now, not government agencies. People often forget that, especially manufacturers.

            The evolution in silencers? yep civilian consumer feedback.
            AR15 accessories? ditto
            Magazines? ditto
            Optics? ditto

            One could go on and on.

            So *you* may value their opinions very little, but to simply discredit consumers in general for being instrumental in current small arms trends is staggeringly stupid.

            “Take SIG for example, if they listened to the so called “experts” SIG would be in bankruptcy five years ago”

            What “experts” would those be?
            SIG is what it is today because of consumers. Or else you have another Colt.

            “and think very negatively of people that think it is a training issue”

            I dont GAF if you think negatively of me or not. My experience and training speaks for itself, and tells an entirely different story.

            Most of the issues aren’t Glock (or gun) related. Its lack of user experience, and *coincidentally* enough, when users are trained to a respectable degree, that issue you mention becomes exceptionally rare.

            Note: that Im not arguing Glock is ‘perfection’ . Its anything but and deserves to have competition from other companies getting into the striker game.

          • You confusing consumers handing money over vs actually participating in the developmental process. Though they might take some general feedback, the number of consumers that actually can give substantive feedback is an extremely small segment of the market. If you asked me to put a number of it, it would be less than 5% of the market.

            The so called experts are people in this thread making fun of the rainbow finishes. Or attacking QC issues that came about due to cost cutting measured required for SIG to remain remotely competitive. The iTac collaboration, etc. Again like I said previously I disagree with some of the choices, but as a whole it was what was necessarily to keep SIG afloat.

            As far as the slide bite, I disagree and so do most reputable trainers. Before the grip forces adapters, and the Gen 4 beavertail kit came out the opinion of reputable trainers is that you either had to learn to endure the Glock slide bite or move to a different pistol.

          • n0truscotsman

            “You confusing consumers handing money over vs actually participating in the developmental process”

            Those aren’t necessarily mutually exclusive. Furthermore, the inherent limitations/flaws of designs are rapidly discovered and squashed mostly because of civilian owners.

            Whether companies decide to act on feedback or not is an entirely different issue. Glock is infamous for this. So is FN.

          • retfed

            I carried a Gen 1 (ca. 1989) Glock 17 for 20 years and never had the slide bite me. Now I’m scared.
            The only slide bite I ever got were from a 1911 (not A1) and a PPK/S.
            Maybe I’m doing it wrong.

          • The it doesn’t happen to me, thus it doesn’t happen at all fallacy with sarcasm.

            A quick google search shows 231,000 entries for Glock slide bite. Most of them have the exact same issue as me, large palms that if you get a proper high on the tang grip it flows over the tang into the way of the slide.

            You mention the 1911, yes the original 1911 and the PPK/S had a hammer bite issue. But no one if their right mind would suggest a duty 1911 without an extended beaver tail to address the issue. But hey with the Glock it is all “suck it up butter cup.” Instead of users insisting MUCH earlier on that Glock release a beaver tail grip. Which took years for a big enough Glock user to threaten to move away in order for Glock to finally release the Gen 4 and finally the beaver tail grips.

          • Harry’s Holsters

            My biggest problem with the beretta is the safety. If they had gone with a G safety I’d be saying the beretta is fine.

        • n0truscotsman

          The only way companies have been able to create, at best, a rough equivalent is to copy the design, being latecomers to the striker fired design after being dragged kicking and screaming away from their ‘SA/DA’ safe space.

          I fail to understand why people think Glocks have ‘bad triggers’. They do their job just fine, are bone head easy to replace, and facilitate respectable accuracy. That tells me that those people need to start shooting and training more. And who the f— cares if a gun doesn’t have a custom 1911 or CZ trigger!? A combat handgun doesn’t need it.

          • HollowTs

            So yes let’s give it up to H&k for both the development of strker fired and polymer pistols!

          • Harry’s Holsters

            Agreed. I shoot a stock trigger better than a modified one. Most of the time glock aftermarket connectors trade good characteristics for a lighter trigger.

        • Joseph Goins

          Take it from someone with a little more life experience than you: triggers don’t make a combat handgun. It especially isn’t a feature that you are looking at when you are about to about to select +500,000 guns for your troops.

          • Harry’s Holsters

            When I go shooting with friends and they are all talking about triggers and little intricacies of guns acting like they are deal makers and breakers I take them back to 50 yards and shoot their guns on steel. Model 10s, DA/SA guns, other striker fired guns. I make hits when they have issues hitting at 25 consistently. So I get you point. But the glock Gen 3 does has a better trigger and the Gen4 I thing is a little better due to reset.

      • Rob

        Mostly because Sig Sauer Inc isn’t even close to being the same comapny as SIG, and Sig Sauer Inc doesn’t have a good track record.

        A company that markets rainbow colored pistols and price point rifles w/ Chinese red dots might not be taken seriously by some people. You can’t blame them considering the problems Sig Sauer Inc has had with declining quality, problematic products, recalls, and marketing lies.

    • Rodney Jenkins

      So you prefer the glock trigger and grip angle? Hard to believe….

      • Harry’s Holsters

        Yes. Grip angle isn’t an issue to me. I run with whatever. I do prefer the glock but mostly the grip of the gun. It doesn’t feel the most ergonomic but it does feel the most solid and secure. The Beavertail also annoys me when drawing.

        My sig P320 is a sample of one so it could have a bad trigger. But I’ve heard people compare the trigger to the PPQ and VP9 which are insanely dissimilar from the P320 I own. The Gen 3 triggers I’ve felt have light take up a hard wall with a clean break and reset right to that wall with no creep. The Gen 4 aren’t that good.

      • Kivaari

        There is nothing wrong with a Glock grip angle for those people that actually use the gun. The complaints come from people that have muscle memory for another gun ingrained. After using the Glock the brain and muscles adapt and they become natural pointers. A 1911 points wrong for me. The 1911 pointed so wrong for so many soldiers they created the 1911A1 to correct that defect.

        • retfed

          I never understood the “Glock grip angle” controversy. I can shoot a Glock just fine, lay it down, pick up a 1911, and shoot that just fine too. The human hand is a wonderful thing, if you don’t let your prejudices get in its way.

    • mojo jojo

      I think the Sig P320 is a great gun, but Sig probably won the contract because they either had the best bribe or they agreed to produce them for the lowest cost…or both. I was actually going to buy a Sig P320 in FDE but I bet they will all be out of stock once all the Mall Ninjas hear the news

      • Harry’s Holsters

        Honestly most of what was in the competition from what I have heard is a step up from the current M9. I’ll be surprised if they get that popular that quick.

  • Thomas S

    Why is it assumed that they will be $300 each? Also the price includes “accessories and ammunition” but as always will also include training (armorers and weapons instructors) and spare parts for repairs.

  • DonDrapersAcidTrip

    Does this mean glock is going ever get around to selling their M models to us poor useless jagoff civilians to make up development cost

    • Gary Kirk

      You mean the ones the slide falls off when dry fired?

      • DonDrapersAcidTrip

        Are we literally going to have to hear this every time these guns are brought up for the next 100 years. People still don’t shut up about gen 4 recoil springs either.

        • Joshua

          People still bring up issues the XM16 had over 65 years ago.

        • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

          The only reason it gets brought up is because of the type of people Glock fanboys are.

          I make jokes at the expense of Glock from time to time. Thats not because I think they are bad guns at all. If I had to carry a Glock for whatever reason Id be completely ok with it. I dont prefer them but they are absolutely sufficient.

          I, and it seems a good number of other people, simply make fun of Glocks to get a rise out of the “irrationally loyal department” of their owners.

          • valorius

            I would carry a revolver before i carried a glock, i just don’t trust that short, light trigger with no safety. And yes, i owned a Glock 19 for several years…but would never carry it.

        • Bill

          Seriously. The number of times that has happened is minuscule compared to the bazillions of rounds fired through GLOCKs without incident. And I’m by no means a GLOCK fanboy. I haven’t seen my G19 in a couple of years and my G43 is relegated to puddle duty in an ankle holster while, ahem, other pistols get to ride up top.

          • iksnilol

            You a freak, Bill 😉

            Guurl, you nasty 😛

        • GaryOlson

          Good slapstick humor is always funny regardless of whether your name is Larry, Curly, and Mo or Beretta, Sig, and Glock.

    • Big Daddy

      I hope so.

    • If they follow their usual time line, it will be another year before we see the M models. And only if demand slacks off because people are asking about them constantly.

  • Konflict7993

    Well, SIG owners have the right to troll Glock owners now.

    • Rob

      Sig lost in the 80’s and they still trolled Beretta owners so it was gonna happened either way.

      • nighthawk9983

        ya but what words will you use? ‘Sigophant’? As easily a compliment as it is an insult. Everyone else has ‘Glocksucker’.

  • Big Daddy

    I figured, it makes perfect sense. I only have Glocks now. But all the SIG 320s I shot are really good firearms, no complaints. I just like my Glock better. I think this is an excellent choice and should have been made a while ago.

    • Bill

      Really nice to hear a non-emotional response. I prefer Chargers, but the Ford Utility still manages to get me where I need to go without drama.

  • Just say’n

    Hopefully all those M9s will be available to the public through the CMP (still waiting for my 1911…)

    • Gary Kirk

      You do NOT want a CMP 1911..

      • Rabies

        You are not a Jedi, your mind tricks will not work on me.

      • Anonymoose

        As a wall-hanger or to rebuild, maybe…

      • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

        To me a 1911 is really a range toy only, so if I could have got one for under $350 I just might have.

      • Ark

        Word. 40 years of being drop kicked by 19-year-olds.

        • valorius

          New springs and they’d be good as new again.

      • nighthawk9983

        No 1911, no M1 Garand. Both were obsolete before WWII ended.

    • tiger

      Dream on….

    • Grindstone50k

      Why? I could sell you a $50 Hi-Point that’s more reliable and useful.

  • tsh77769

    SIG? WTF? I just threw up in my mouth. Doesnn’t SIG stand for Su-par Imitation Glock?

    • Konflict7993

      Superior Imitation Glock* now, lol.

    • Gary Kirk

      Superior Intelligence Glock..

    • Keiichi

      (S)omething (I)mmanently (G)onna-happen

    • nighthawk9983

      Glocksucker detected.

  • Bill

    …and the SEALs went from SIG to GLOCK…

    • Don Ward

      And? 99.999 percent of the military have different demands for their weapons than the SEALS.

      • Bill

        Of course you’re right; I’m just struck by how inane all these procurement issues are, particularly in this day and age when there are really no “bad” choices, and in the military where the main use of the pistol is to get from your rack to the shower trailer without being totally unarmed.

    • nighthawk9983

      Because losing a glock in the ocean was no real loss.

  • B-Sabre

    And incoming protest in 5…4…3…2…

  • Don Ward

    I’m assuming the new Sig will have a manual safety? Also the military was never going to pick a handgun where you have to pull the trigger to disassemble. Sorry Glock kids, your weapon had no chance.

  • borekfk

    Glock fanboys on suicide watch.

    • Don Ward

      Should be easy given the triggers and lack of safety on Glocks.

      Hey-Oh!!!

      • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

        How depressing would that be? You go to pull the trigger because the Army said your gun is inferior and the slide just falls off…

    • Threethreeight

      Meanwhile in Syria a few days ago. Delta force with ALG/RMR’ed glocks and HK. Surprising lack of sig products, spooky~

      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/040ec3f873564ae56571865fd880d1f98ff6b8f4ec269a60de27f22158678a0b.jpg

      • Nandor

        “Hey Bob, what’s goin’ on with you?” “Hey Jim, nuthin’ much, just standing around… operating.” *hands in pockets*

      • Phillip Cooper

        What does “ALG” and “RMR” mean?

        Less abbreviations, more communication.

        • Threethreeight

          Glock with a trijicon RMR mounted atop the slide and an ALG flared magwell. Safariland ALS holster.

          • valorius

            RMR’s suck on handguns.

          • Threethreeight

            You’re entitled to your opinion even if it’s wrong

          • valorius

            I had a RMR (Burris Fastfire II) on my HK P7 on a custom mount, the window of the device is far too small to acqure the dot without perfect handgun presentation in low light/total darkness conditions. So my opinion is based on actual experience.

          • Threethreeight

            P7 is a totally suboptimal host. A lot has changed in 7 years friendo. Research some of the modern setups that were made for red dots and utilize great cowitness/indexing setups.

          • valorius

            I don’t have any idea what you’re basing your assessment on, since you’ve never even held a P7 with an RMR friendo.

          • Phillip Cooper

            Thanks for the translation. No comprende mallninja.

      • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

        These guys, along with SEALs, Special Forces, etc., have a noted tendency to obtain & carry the sidearm that THEY believe will support them the best in accomplishing their mission.

        Let’s see how many of these elite groups acquire the Sig as their sidearm. Could be interesting!

        • valorius

          The truth is that handguns on the modern battlefield are nothing but a waste of space. If i was going to carry and handgun at all it’d be something like a Ruger LCP with a crimson trace laserguard, loaded with hard cast flat nose +P rounds.

          Something tiny, reliable, super lightweight and with deep penetrating rounds.

          • Bill

            While I don’t agree with your choice, I agree with your premise.

            When you can call in artillery and airstrikes, pistols are kind of pointless. Soldiers aren’t cops.

          • valorius

            Well my choice is based on the fact that a fully loaded Ruger LCP with crimson trace and 1 extra mag weighs about a grand total of 1 lb, is really small and can be stashed conveniently in my front fatigue pocket. With a round like Buffalo bore 100gr flat nose hard cast lead it gets over 30″ penetration in gel.
            Or a round like Underwood max penetrator +P that will actually punch through .5″ of polycarbonate bulletproof glass (in my own personal testing, the same thickness of polycarbonate will stop .45 acp 230gr FMJ and standard pressure 9mm JHP)

            As an ex infantryman i just place almost zero value in a handgun- especially a rig that weighs in at 5 plus pounds with ammo and which adds more bulk to my web gear.

          • Cannoneer No. 4

            Soldiers, Marines, Sailors, Airmen and Coast Guardsmen should be able to act as First Responders. Tough on friendlies to call in artillery and air strikes on insider threats inside the wire.

          • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

            Can’t say that I know that from my personal experience, but…

            Considering all of the gear/weight that these folks have to carry, if it doesn’t have a true need to your specific mission, why carry it?

            Comments?

          • valorius

            I’d rather carry a few extra magazines for my rifle, or a couple grenades, or an extra belt of ammo for the squad machine gun, or a claymore.
            A pistol with extra mags and holster is about 5 or so lbs of weight you’ll almost never, ever get any use out of whatsoever.

          • Nagurski

            Yeah, a fully size handgun typically weighs about as much as two loaded 30 round AR mags. If I’m getting shot at, I’d rather the extra 60 rounds for my primary.

          • Cannoneer No. 4

            Not when a “trusted” indig yells Allah u Akbar! in the DFAC.
            Arm every service member with an Anti-Terrorism/Force Protection Rape Prevention Pistol Colt Pocket Hammerless

          • valorius

            hehe

      • iksnilol

        That guy to the left has a ton of glowsticks.

        Man, he’ll be the center of attention at the rave.

      • valorius

        SF have far more handgun training than the Army as a whole does. Putting glocks in the avg privates hands would result in an astronomical ND rate.

      • nighthawk9983

        One guy with a Glock suddenly means everyone is carrying them? Maybe he wanted a sidearm he wouldn’t care about dropping in a ditch and losing for good. Glocks are good for that task.

        • Threethreeight

          My point is people that actually shoot people use glocks. MARSOC dropped the 1911 for glocks, seals dropped the p226 for the glock, rangers are using glocks, delta force is using glocks. A bunch of regular army troops training on the p320 and never shooting them again means absolutely nothing.

  • Kivaari

    Finally, they adopted a Glock-like pistol. It’s about time.

  • Gregory

    Why is everyone bashing Glock owners? A gun is a gun and having one is better than having none. Wow, I am a poet and didn’t know it. Anyway, if you do not like a Glock then do not buy one. If you do not like a Sig then do not buy one, who gives a crap. Get what works for you and move on. I prefer a Dan Wesson 1911 over both. Ready, here we go, 1911 haters are drooling and ready to strike out.

    • Joseph Goins

      Glock is like Dave Matthews. I could never hate him as much as I hate his fans.

      • Grindstone50k

        Poetry

    • nighthawk9983

      Because ‘glocksucker’ is hilarious.

  • xebat

    The Walther PPQ is much better. FITE ME IRL !

  • diana pierce

    A $580 Million Dollar Contract should now better enable uber-rich-SIG to share the wealth… and reduce the damn prices for hordes of Sig-O-Philes. The 226, 229, 220, 227 and 2 this and 2 that and so on and on pricing went through the roof in the past ten yrs alone.

    • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

      I sure hope so, but I can also see this pushing the hammer fired Sigs aside and only making them more expensive.

  • Malthrak

    So…if it is the P320 or some variant in 9mm…why didnt they just go with the M9A3? I cant see any logisitical or performance reasons to drop the 9mm M9 for a 9mm P320. Other than “we wanted a new toy, we’re bored with the old one” of course…

    • int19h

      Weight, for example? Beretta weighs 10 oz more.

      • Malthrak

        That would seem to be something of a reash to spend 9 digits on what is fundamentally the least consequential and least utilized infantry weapon in the military. I mean, weight savings is great, but for a backup or backup-to-your-backup weapon that is primarily utilized in roles where 10z is not a gigantic issue, this would seem to be a rather expensive solution.

        • int19h

          If guns basically just worked with zero maintenance required after you bought them, that arithmetic would make sense. But they have to keep maintaining those Berettas, buying replacement parts etc. At some point the cost of continued maintenance exceeds the cost of the gun, and you might as well just get a new one. And if you buy in large batches, as the military usually does, you can replace in batches as well.

          I also wouldn’t call 10 oz insignificant. If I remember correctly, a fully loaded USGI mag is something like 16 oz. These all seem small, but many small things do add up, to the point where it becomes not “Surely I can carry 10 oz more, that’s like nothing!”, but rather “I’m already loaded to capacity, what would be the best use of that 10 oz?”. It doesn’t matter how much you can carry total – there is a limit, and with modern body armor w/plates + standard loadout + extra ammo for the machine gunner + AT tubes + …, you’re starting to push that limit pretty fast.

          So that’s why “a backup or backup-to-your-backup weapon” is exactly where it makes sense to trim weight, possibly even at the expense of some reliability. It’s kinda ridiculous when something that you shouldn’t really need in the first place if everything goes right is over 2 pounds of dead weight.

          • Malthrak

            Most people carrying these weapons in most situations aren’t loaded with AT tubes and extra ammo belts. I can see the point you’re aiming for there, but the vast majority of these people are driving vehicles, sitting at base entrance checkpoints, operating crew served weapons or specialist equipment, sitting in staff rooms, transporting stuff in boxes, etc. For these people, 2/3rds of a single loaded magazine isn’t much of an issue, particularly when handgun usage across the board is being increasingly curtailed and replaced with other options in general.

            And while I understand that guns wear out and have maintenance costs, given the numbers in the article, the US military will be paying about $40 more per unit than they currently are for M9’s, ~$300 vs ~$260. M9A3’s may have been a bit more, I have no idea what Beretta offered on those, but unless it was spectacularly higher, which never appeared to be the case, it would be hard to see where there is any per unit cost advantage to the P320, much less the impact to the larger logistics and training questions.

          • some other joe

            Or you’re like me and have a >60 pistol shortfall downrange right now. All of my pax need pistol and rifle for our mission because different phases of an operation call for different systems. And even an M4 is a bit much in an ANA office.

            The “vast majority of these people” are field grade staff officers (not the Joes and CPTs working in the HQs), tankers, MPs, and dismounted crew-served machinegunners (just the gunner, AGs and AB still have rifles). And not guys “transporting stuff in boxes,” they’re carrying rifles, too. At least two of those categories are carrying the pistol as a backup weapon when they have to worry about weight, and they are carrying extra ammo belts, too.

            Oh, and the M9 unit cost is currently $636 per FMSWeb. It and the M9A3 also fail to meet the specification called for in the MHS, namely modularity. The grip on these weapons is as big as it is, deal with it, and a modular grip size was a requirement for adoption.

          • Malthrak

            A modular grip size is a rather absurd reason to spend 9 digits on new pistols, and while the beretya has a large grip, thats something that likely was put in specifically to exclude the M9, things like that have been done in almost every small arms request when a functional weapon exists but they want a new toy.

            As for cost, is that $600 per unit or including accessories and support? we bought them at $260 per unit and civilian sales can be had for 500/550.

          • Actually, the grip size specification was done based on an analysis of why females flunk pistol qualification in disproportionate rates compared to the rates they flunk carbine qualifications or males flunk pistol quals…

            Berettas are frigging HUGE when compared to many of their competitors. When the M9 was first introduced, it was literally the SECOND (first being caliber) complaint I heard from soldiers transitioning from the 1911…

    • Um, the Beretta didn’t meet *any* of the spec improvements the MHS RFP mandated?

      Which is why even BERETTA didn’t enter the M9A3 into the MHS program…

      • Malthrak

        Which, based on dozens of other previous weapons programs, sounds an awful lot like they wrote them specifically to exclude certain products that may otherwise actually be perfectly functional from reentering because they just want something new for its own sake.

        I mean, they did that with the SCAR program (before they couldnt keep up the charade anymore and couldnt justify the continued expensive 16’s over M4A1’s), the trials that led to the M14, etc.

  • Blake

    Meanwhile, the Marines want 1911s in 45 ACP…

    • CommonSense23

      No they don’t.

    • john huscio

      Last I heard, it was glock 19s

    • DonDrapersAcidTrip

      This guy is trapped in the 90s or something, somebody help him out

      • Blake

        My comment was based on the M45A1:
        http://www.gunsandammo.com/reviews/semper-fi-colt-m45a1-cqbp-marine-pistol-review/

        “The initial delivery order following the announcement specified 4,036 pistols and spares. However, the contract carries with it an indefinite-delivery and indefinite-quantity clause for up to 12,000 M45A1s, spare parts and logistical support. The value of this contract is said to be worth $22.5 million to Colt. Marine Corps Special Operations Command (MARSOC) and Marine Expeditionary Unit Special Operation Command (MEU[SOC]), as well as members of Force Recon, Special Reaction Teams (SRT) and the Marine Corps pistol team are the expected end users for the first new Colt 1911s added to an armory’s inventory since World War II.”

        • The Forty ‘Twa

          They are replacing the 1911s with Glocks now. I think there was an article on here about it.

          • Ron

            Only at MARSOC, base SRTs and Recon units will keep using the M45A1s

        • CommonSense23

          Marsoc has already replaced those with the Glock 19.

        • nighthawk9983

          First new *Colt* 1911s. Colt just updated a Springfield Armory design in use since the 80s. And the Marines have always prided themselves on getting more done with inferior equipment. Only 7 rounds of .45 ACP is as inferior as it gets these days.

        • DonDrapersAcidTrip

          That’s ancient ass information man. They ditched those guns a while back

    • Ron

      The Marine Corps has stated it will probable also adopt the MHS

  • Pandaz3

    I would guess this will be in the expected 40 S&W

    • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

      The two manual safety models that were photographed in Nathaniel F’s SHOT post were 9mms. That doesnt really answer your question though.

    • DonDrapersAcidTrip

      lol why would anyone expect that??

    • Kivaari

      Why, with everyone else abandoning the .40 as it doesn’t perform any better than a 9mm, it makes no sense.

      • iksnilol

        But it’s a doggone fowty! Its what the Texas Rangers used to one shot drop horses at a quarter mile distance.

        • Bill

          They are/were actually using .357 SIG to drop horses at a quarter mile, which might just work. 😉

          • iksnilol

            Buut… they didn’t done not have them dang ‘ol SIGs back in the old west.

          • jcitizen

            Oh! You mean the fowty fo fowty!! (^_^)

          • iksnilol

            Awww yiss, that was like a double fowty.

          • jcitizen

            Ha! Ma faveritt is the fowty five sevinty five WCF All them cowboas love it! (dropping out of character here) – trouble is my mare’s leg is only chambered for .44 magnum. It holds more .44 specials, so that is my next favorite cartridge for “shootn’ arns”.

      • Everyone dumping .40S&W is doing so, based on relative performance with modern JHP bullets. Unless the Army starts issuing modern JHPs for standard use, the FBI tests that recommend 9mm for police simply do not apply for their ammo choices AT ALL.

        But I suspect we will keep them in 9mm, because we have zillions of rounds in stock. Just like the Garand ended up in .30-06…

        • Kivaari

          AGSW from a 9mm fmj or 40 fmj will not be distinguishable unless a bullet is recovered. Except for the bruising around an entrance hole it is hard to tell a .45 from a 9mm. The wound tracks themselves remain pretty equal. A thigh wound will have a small hole with a gelatin-like area of flesh exposed sometimes. A surgeon couldn’t detect that 1mm difference.

      • Pandaz3

        Making sense has little to do with it, they wanted more than 9MM NATO 124 Gr, 40 is the next bigger

        • Kivaari

          I doubt they will use the .40. It makes no ballistic difference when actual gun shot wounds are examined and treated.

          • Pandaz3

            You know I am not a 40 guy as of yet I only have a Walther PPX and a Charter Arms Pitbull in 40. I do like them both, but I’m just reporting what was reported elsewhere. I don’t think the Army cares what we think. They have I’m sure, done their own ballistics tests slanted they way they think is best for them

          • Kivaari

            I had three .40 Glocks. There’s nothing wrong with them. I just see no reason the military would make a change from a satisfactory cartridge that is also NATO standard. Especially in the face of evidence that 9mm and .40 perform the same. It wouldn’t make any sense to add a new caliber.

          • Pandaz3

            Maybe you are right, we don’t know what or why they are thinking what they are thinking. NATO is easy when you are thee senior partner

  • Blake

    Seriously, what the heck is the Army going to do with 2 million pistols?

    For the precious few soldiers that have actually fired their sidearm in combat more than once in the past two decades, they would certainly be better served by a small, light pistol-caliber carbine or .223 PDW than any handgun. & I’d be highly surprised to hear of any officer that has worn out their M9. It’s not like any Army regular forces receive any more than the bare minimum handgun training (& for good reason).

    It’s not like Beretta has any intention of giving up on the 92/M9 platform (& the M9A3 is really quite nice).

    Yes I know, it’s politics, & has nothing to do with the needs of the Army, just like the F35…

    • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

      Ive never served so I will admit my opinion on this matter isnt really credible, but I would think the pistol (insert your choice of reliable pistol here) is quite sufficient for a secondary firearm. I just dont think anybody wants to increase the size and weight of a gun that they never shoot to make it more like a gun that they already carry.

      • Blake

        I agree. I’d say that rather than a full-sized police handgun like the M9, the vast majority of soldiers/officers would be better served by either:

        – for non-frontline solders with a high probability of firing their weapon in combat, a small, light PDW

        – for everyone else that needs to carry an only-in-emergencies sidearm (including frontline troops that will use it as a backup weapon), the primary characteristic should be reducing the burden on & increasing the comfort of the solder carrying it (while still being reliable of course); the same fundamental requirement of a CCW handgun. Just a quick example: the Sig P938 weighs ~half a Beretta M9A2.

        (or why not both)

        • Brent Akin

          Interesting thought, but isn’t the P320 also available in a sub-compact size?

          Also, being a modular design, I imagine it would be entirely possible to make a grip module that incorporated a folding stock attachment. That combined with the optic plate on the slide and a weapon light satisfies 90% of the PDW requirement (select fire being the only part not met). Which if someone is carrying a PDW because they don’t need to carry an M4, then select fire may just be a way to waste ammo faster.

          Which, should the Hearing Protection Act pass, and if we could get SBR’s on the chopping block, it would be cool to see some aftermarket options like that for the modular pistols, where the grip is not the serialized part.

    • Joseph Goins

      The 1911 was around for so long because pistol technology didn’t really advance until the 1970s. That’s the same reason why half the world uses an AK-47 derivative while the other half uses an AR-15 style weapon which are both pre-Vietnam designs. I think that not much is going to change in the next fifty years (materials, designs, cartridges, etc.). Sig hit a home run.

    • Geoff Timm

      I hope the US military has recognized the fact that a compact pistol which can be carried anywhere is a damn good idea in the current war on terror. Now if DJT will give the order to arm our kids at all times. Geoff Who notes in the 1930s military officers in the US of A were expected to carry personal arms at all times (Cross reference General Pattons guns.)

    • B-Sabre

      This is probably an Indefinite Quantity/Indefinite Delivery contract, meaning that the Army can buy up to 2 million pistols in small quantities when it needs them. So add in replacement pistols and Foreign Military Sales, and you can get to 2 million fairly easily.

    • A *LOT* of M9s have been ragged out in service.

  • BeoBear

    Never shot a Sig, they were always just too damn expensive but I admit to really wanting a 320 ever since seeing their modular design. The Swiss have always designed very good guns so I suspect the military made a good choice. I do love my Glock’s (.45acp) and with the except of the lack of a safety and the trigger pulling for disassembly issues I have no doubt it would have been a good choice also. Then again so would the M&P’s (after being gutted and replaced with Apex Tactical innards).

    I absolutely LOVE my Beretta 92A1, it’s extremely accurate and points like a laser, but its grip size, weight and overall length make it a better choice for law enforcement and civilian use than for military. When I served the Beretta was just being integrated and I never had use of one but I love mine now. I would have happily carried it during my time in law enforcement but my first carry gun was a S&W 59 (I’d kill to have it back) and then came the big shootout where 9mm failed miserably and I switched to a Glock 21.

    I think the true modular design of the Sig will allow soldiers of every size the ability to at least have a gun that fits. Whether they can shoot it worth a dang is up to them.

    • Kivaari

      The 9mm did not fail in the ’86 Miami shootout. The suspects were put out of action by a combination of .38 special, 00-buck, and one 9mm bullet. What was amazing is how long the one suspect lasted after taking what was essentially a fatal hit with a 9mm. In the end he was killed by a .38 special (a weak 9mm).

      • Bill

        Massive correctness. The Miami shootout was a mess, but “won” with equipment that would be mercilessly mocked as obsolete today, buy a guy with cajones the size of watermelons.

        Every weapon the FBI had in ’86 could still win fights today, assuming the operator knows what they are doing.

      • iksnilol

        If it was a fo-five ‘stead of a piddly 9 millimetah that perp would’a done gone down.

        *spits out tobacco*

    • nighthawk9983

      Those two bank robbers were Army Infantry and a Ranger, definitely
      outside the bell curve for human stamina. A .45 wouldn’t have stopped
      them any faster than the 9mm did. Their big advantage was having the
      only rifle in the fire fight.

      • BeoBear

        Not true, the reason “The Great Migration” from the 9mm happened after that shootout was because 9mm ammunition technology at the time was pretty bad and the ammo was far less effective than .45 acp. It was thoroughly tested and found lacking by many sources including the FBI. Since that time the 9mm’s effectiveness has improved greatly with new ammunition manufacturing technology, which is why the FBI has switched back. The stamina of the robbers involved had very little to do with their performance. I’d argue adrenaline played a much bigger part.

  • gunsandrockets

    what caliber?

    • B-Sabre

      .500 S&W Mag.

      (sorry, I saw the other story on TFB and couldn’t resist)

  • tiger

    Good pick & smart pick for a serivce pistol of the future.

  • Ark

    $300 a pop sounds unbelievably optimistic for any kind of military procurement contract.

    • Realist

      I think Sig knows Trump wouldn’t put up with price gouging…which is reminiscent of the $700 hammer and the $2,000 dollar coffee pot for the the P3C.

      • Bill

        The guy has gold plate everywhere…

  • It’s ok

  • DonDrapersAcidTrip

    It’s just boring listening to tired old man gun jokes that had like 1 second of thought put into them the 1st time somebody said them a million years ago

    • Phillip Cooper

      You’ll be ok. Should I direct you to where to get a “safety pin”?

      • DonDrapersAcidTrip

        That’s nice of you to take time out of your usual routine of crying and complaing about how everyone else is a “snowflake” and participation trophies etc, and all the classic unimaginative broing old white man routines, which is weird because it’s you obsolete reactionary types that were afraid to drink from the same fountains as black people.

        • Mystick

          Funny, you’re doing precisely that in other threads. Like I said, hypocrite.

          • DonDrapersAcidTrip

            Self-awareness really is not you’re strong suit

        • Phillip Cooper

          How’s that racism tasting over there?

          BTW- I happen to be an old black man.

          Try again?

          • DonDrapersAcidTrip

            Wow, is it really you? The token black guy fox news trots out so they can be like “look this black guy says black lives matter is bad!”?

          • DonDrapersAcidTrip

            Ah yes the “whoever mentions a persons race first is the racist” defintion of racism. Maybe being a grown adult in this world you should work on growing past a kindergarten level understanding of race relations

  • LCON

    For the Army…

    • Grindstone50k

      All other branches soon to follow…

      • LCON

        Maybe the USAF, The Marines already have that 2 a Sidearms unique to them The M45 and the M9A1 of course they also use Glocks. the Navy will just wear out the old M9’s and what every they can snag from the Marines.

        • Martin M

          No way. The USAF will embark on a 20 year search for a space age stealth handgun that uniquely represents their service, all at the modest cost of 125k a copy. Of course, at that price they will constantly cut the order citing budget concerns. The final product will be obsolete 10 years prior to roll out, 10 billion over budget, with only 1500 firearms purchased at 355k each!

        • valorius

          Don’t be surprised if you see Trump’s admin (wisely) mandate 1 universal handgun to save money.

          • Bill

            ANY wise SecDef would do so, along with camo patterns.

            Give that Trump knows big words and more than all the Generals, I’d wager he’d choose to force open a factory here in the States and start cranking out Dardicks.

          • LCON

            Camo patterns maybe, but pistols are all about the same for the DOD, and not as high a priority. The only reason the Pistol competition got on the Radar as Berretta fighting to retain M9 contracts.

          • valorius

            Trump certainly knows business and budgets far more than any General does.

          • Nagurski

            Mad Dog Mattis is the new SecDef. There is no way he is going to let Trump steamroll over him.

          • Eurk Burkell

            My prediction: he mandates they clean the 1911’s and get them out.

          • nighthawk9983

            Old, useless, rattling 1911s that have the capacity than a revolver and less power than modern 9mm NATO without the reliability of either, have no place as a sidearm.

          • valorius

            I’m sure lots of our troops would be fine with that.

        • Grindstone50k

          >The M45 and the M9A1
          >”unique ”

          Congress is getting on the Corps and the Army about their rifle ammo differences, only a matter of time for sidearms as well.

      • TeaPartyPagan

        Not necessarily, The FN system is a really good, and currently in production (in the US). Just my personal opinion, but the FN far outstrips Glock. I am looking to make an FN my new carry. S&W also has a lot to offer, if they can fix the accuracy issues.

  • William May

    Really hope they use a different magazine then the 320, my dept has had lots of problems with the mags

  • Geoff Timm

    Well heck, they were about the only ones left. But the contract includes AMMUNITION? That is a game changer unlike no other. I hope there is a link to the contract soon. Geoff Who is a curious fellow, who wonders if SIG is pricing their over the counter guns so high to support those given under cost to the US Military?

    • Steve H

      Their costs aren’t out of line compared to other quality offerings from their competition.

  • LCON

    Why did Sig win this one? Because there offering a modular pistol. It’s a Kit gun like the M4 You You have the Serial number on the Trigger pack, That’s like the AR Lower Then you add grip( Frame) Slide and barrel ( like an AR upper.)
    . Glock’s offering would have been fine had they dropped the want of a pistol that could be reconfigured for calibers and size. Had they simply wanted a rail The MArines have the M9A1. Polymer frame with Rails they could have gone and altered the M9 TDP for M9A3 or 90Two.

  • Tim

    If DoD gets a new complete sidearm for $300/ copy, it’ll be the best deal the tax payers have ever paid for.

  • Gregory

    I already see an issue that will be a big problem. The safety and slide lock are way too close to each other. Using the slide lock will cause the safety to be moved unintentionally.

    • Steve H

      I’m not very familiar with the P320 but I’d bet if the slide is locked back, the safety isn’t/ can’t be engaged.

    • Brent Akin

      If the safety works like the 1911, you can’t have the safety engaged while the slide is locked back in the first place, so that’s a non-issue

      • Gregory

        We shall see.

  • mig1nc

    Those photos above with the coyote brown frames and bronze slides. They look like they have black optic mount cover plates on them. Is that right?

  • Andrew Benton

    About time they upgraded. The 9mm is sooooo much better than the 9mm.

  • Full Name

    I was rooting for the M&P, but I suppose this is not a BAD choice…

  • Joe Gamer

    Not all that surprising given that the MODULAR handgun requirements were written in such a way as to disqualify everything but the Sig P320. It’s a fine weapon but whoever wrote the bid requirements was either a Sig fanboy or got a Sig check…
    Well if they really are getting them for $300 a piece then they got a good deal regardless IMO

  • RickH

    Great Headline Enjoyed Article Update Press Release 11pm Pictures Sig

  • coyote-hunter

    Everyone wants their turn in the barrel, this is just sigs time, we’ll see how long it lasts?

  • Bambibasher

    Army Rumour service got this to me first, I blame the shot show for the delay, keep up the good work

  • A Fascist Corgi

    I was pretty surprised that they selected the P320 because it doesn’t have a thumb safety. Handguns are backup weapons for the military, and having millions of poorly trained goofballs handling loaded weapons on a daily basis means that more U.S. soldiers will be injured or killed by negligent discharges than enemy fire. Adding a thumb safety simply makes sense from a statistical perspective. You dramatically reduce the number of negligent discharges.

    Hopefully the decision to add a thumb safety will help knock some sense into the idiotic gun community that thinks that thumb safeties on pistols are a terrible idea.

    • lookinoutforu

      From the pic, it looks like it does have a thumb safety.

    • It does have a thumb safety, in the version the Army is buying.

    • n0truscotsman

      I’ve seen your argument tossed out by other posters, and its as wrong as ever.

      Relying on a mechanical safety to address any shortcomings in training is literally putting the cart before the horse. Its the same reason why the NYPD blamed their Glocks when they carried over bad habits from the Smith revolvers to the new striker fired handgun.

      The Army needs to address the training issue, first and foremost. Thats their *job* after all.

  • Mitch

    More power to them. The P-320 can’t possible suck as bad as the P-250. I own a Glock but I am not having a melt down over this. The U.S. Army may find the having is not as great as the wanting in this case.

  • Joseph Smith

    Love it!

  • Interesting that a caliber hasn’t been specified yet. Anyone think they’ll actually switch away from 9mm? If so, what caliber? IMO – If they aren’t switching to .45 they should just stick with 9mm.

    • DIR911911 .

      380 is the new 9mm

      • Jared Vynn

        Nah it’s gonna be the 38 acp that’s the new 9mm.

  • mojo jojo

    Am I the only one that thinks the Beretta 92 is one of the best 9mm pistols ever made? Also I was in the process of selling a few guns I don’t shoot to buy the Sig P320. I hope the price doesn’t skyrocket because we know how everyone reacts when the military issues something..everyone thinks its the best ever and they HAVE to have one…I guess I better hurry up and get one before they are sold out

    • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

      I have a range in my area that rents various pistols. Got to try the 92 with a box of rounds – it was respectable, and I was able to acquire respectable accuracy by the end of the second mag . Wouldn’t mind owning one, but I wouldn’t go nuts to do so.

    • dirtsailor

      Yes, you are.

  • MrBrassporkchop

    Jeez people go bananas when the military announces what guns they’re gonna use.

  • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

    Its quite fun. You should try it sometime.

  • mojo jojo

    Sig P320 out of stock once the Mall Ninjas and neck beards hear its the new army sidearm in 3…2….1……

    • Rob

      It has been out of stock…..

      • mojo jojo

        It’s been in stock at least at Buds for the past several months and still is…but I bet not for long

  • 2War Abn Vet

    They wasted a lot of money, and a lot of time, before making a reasonable decision to replace that POS.

  • J.T.

    Seeing as how the Army pretty much copied the the specifications of the SIG and wrote them down as the requirements for the gun, this isn’t that surprising. The whole thing was clearly set up so that they could say nearly every other gun didn’t meet their requirements.

  • SansDingus

    Well, no one ever confused the US Army of being burdened by an over abundance of intelligence. Smells like a another sweetheart backroom deal to me. Then again, any serious shooter who thinks they need a manual thumb safety should pop their pacifier back in and go back to watching cartoons.

    • John

      Most in the Army are not serious shooters. There are lots of mechanics, nurses, pilots, truck drivers, etc. Maybe it’s better to add one more step between them and an accidental discharge since most of them will never need to fire the weapon at the enemy.

    • iksnilol

      I dunno, if the Army wanted a modular handgun and only SIG offered a truly modular one then I doubt it was a backroom deal.

  • livingonenergydrinks

    Will that same Chasis be usable in various calibers? 9mm, 10mm, 45, 40…. 50ae : ) Does it come with a plastic or metal guide rod? Is the trigger metal, or polymer? I might have to pick one up.

  • Graham2

    ‘Army Warfighter’, are they what we used to call soldiers?

    • Bill

      That or “Peacekeeper.”

    • Ron

      Warfighter is the term of art for those in the operating forces as opposed to the supporting establishment.

      • dirtsailor

        You might want to pass that bit of info on to the rest of the Army.

  • nova3930

    To everyone that told me I had no idea what I was talking about when I put the SIG as the odds on favorite when reviewing the RFP, I #$*&#$ TOLD YOU SO!

    The RFP had a big emphasis on modularity and Human Factors compatibility, 2 things the Glock didn’t have.

    And if you were one of the people saying “But SF PICKED GLOCKS” once again, SF requirements were and are DIFFERENT than big army requirements. The written requirements MATTER.

  • 2ThinkN_Do2

    Why doesn’t the extension mag blend smoothly into the curved back strap shape?

  • iksnilol

    FOUND THE FANBOY!

    😀

    • Jared Vynn

      That’s at least two so far.

      I was a Glock fan till I got a sig 2022, than I got a 1911 and have been a follower of JMB since.

  • Mike Trumbull

    I am waiting for the TRUMP tweet about American options…

    • Jared Vynn

      He’s currently giving his inaugural speech so it might be a bit.

    • Rob

      Sig Sauer Inc is American despite what they might tell you about German engineering.

      • Richard Lutz

        A truly great company that brought us modern classics like the P250 and Mosquito, and I feel confident that the P320 will equal their reputation.

  • valorius

    Great choice, the Sig M11 was and still is a fantastic military sidearm.

  • valorius

    “The best use of the M9 is throwing it,” Senator Joni Ernst, Mad dog “Mattis” confirmation hearing.

    • Hillary: A Voice of Treason

      Yep.

      http://www .cnn.com/videos/poli…

  • John

    We all know that way down deep inside every Sig….there’s a Glock trying to out.

  • machgman

    With all of the quality control problems SIG has been unable to overcome plus how the SIG trigger design uses fragile and tiny springs in very tight tolerance spaces, there will be lots of unhappy soldiers and dead soldiers on the front line.

    Keep in mind the staggering amount of monies being bandied about includes the bribes the Army procurement brass has always demanded to make their “selection” of the “best” weapon out there.

  • Steve Hall

    I think the weight issue is the most important for an infantryman. I remember in the 80s when I was doing an opfor mission and switched from my 1911 to one of the first Glocks imported (my 17 is serial numbered in the first 2000), it was a big difference! And there was the benefit of a gun that didn’t have a uniform coat of rust after days in the field with sweat, rain and mud. Sigs are good and like many have followed the Glock with a polymer lower. The issue has to be highest quality bang for the buck at this point. My faith is in the incoming administration on this. Army procurement sucks.

  • and, just about one hour after you posted this, a 1911 fanboi popped up. LOL

  • Eurk Burkell

    My prediction: Trump almost immediately tells them: No new guns, get the 1911’s out of storage–to the applause of all real men everywhere!

    • nighthawk9983

      Men who want to limit themselves to 7 rounds get a .357 Magnum in a wheel gun, not a .45 biggirlsblouse from 60 years of storage.

    • Alex Yamach

      My prediction:

      Trump will leave it up to the military leaders to determine what they need to accomplish the mission.

      Now – if they want to sell some of those old 1911s, give me a call…

  • nighthawk9983

    They are around, touting 7 rounds of .45 ACP as better than anything else on the planet, when anyone with half a brain would pick 7 rounds of .357 mag in a wheel gun over 7 rounds of .45 ACP in a design that is only reliable when thousands of man hours have been poured into fitting and finishing each gun. I suppose they also think 8 rounds of .30-06 in an enbloc clip fired from a gun with a sieve for an action is better than a fully sealed action in 5.56 with 30 rounds per mag and select fire coz muh nostalgia. Let’s go back to using weapons that were obsolete by the end of WWII cause anecdotes.

  • CharlesH

    I wouldn’t be upset if the MCX moved in as the next standard issue rifle.

  • tree fiddy

    I hope this means the price of mags go down

  • BeenThereDoneThat

    Any one notice the announcement that our military is going to adapt HP (point) 9m/m ammo???

  • NukeItFromOrbit

    Glock fanboy detected.

    • Richard Lutz

      “Reverting to name calling suggests that you are defensive, and therefore, find my opinion valid.” – Spock (Star Trek Into Darkness).

  • Alex Yamach

    “Will Trump also put a gun to the head of the US Navy SEALs and tell them to replace the foreign made Glock 19 pistols they adopted in 2015 with the SIG USA made P320/M17 in case the Austrians have hidden microphones in them that could reveal that the SEALs like grabbing…”.

    Still wetting your bed, we see.

  • Richard Lutz

    The striker fired 9mm Glocks have an excellent reputation for reliability, which cannot be said for the SIG P320 or the hammer fired P250. Someone should overrule the decision to adopt the SIG and force the US Army to adopt the Gen3 Glock 19 adopted by the US Navy SEALs in 2015.

  • Richard Lutz

    The striker fired 9mm Glocks have an excellent reputation for reliability, which cannot be said for the SIG P320 or the hammer fired P250 it is based on. Someone should overrule the decision to adopt the SIG and force the US Army to adopt the Gen3 Glock 19 adopted by the US Navy SEALs in 2015.