Faces up to 10 years in prison for illegally making and selling silencers

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According to this link U.S. Attorneys, Western District of Louisiana, a man faces 10 years in prison for illegally making and selling silencers. He has not been sentenced yet, but will be just before Christmas.

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“Grayson man pleads guilty to illegally making, selling silencers  MONROE, La. – United States Attorney Stephanie A. Finley announced that a Grayson man pleaded guilty last week to manufacturing and selling firearm silencers.  XXXX, 31, of Grayson, La., pleaded guilty Wednesday before U.S. Magistrate Judge Karen L. Hayes to one count of illegally selling and manufacturing firearm silencers. The plea will become final when accepted by U.S. District Judge S. Maurice Hicks Jr. According to the guilty plea, in May 2016, the ATF conducted a controlled purchase of three firearm silencers from a target of the investigation who later identified XXXX as the manufacturer of the silencers. XXXX sold the silencers from a Facebook site called “Angel of Death Tactical,” without having paid the special occupational tax and not having registered the silencers as required by federal law. A search was conducted at XXXX’ residence on May 19, 2016.  Several firearms were seized with silencers attached, as well as assorted silencer parts with drilled baffles and end caps, other assorted parts for making silencers, and boxes of parts showing mailing information that they were imported from India. XXXX also had drill presses used to complete the manufacture of silencers.   XXXX faces up to 10 years in prison, three years of supervised release and a $10,000 fine. A sentencing date of December 20, 2016 was set.  This investigation and prosecution is part of Project Safe Neighborhoods, which is a Department of Justice initiative to promote firearm safety and to reduce firearm crimes by preventing the possession and use of firearms by dangerous and persistent felons and others not authorized to possess a firearm.  The ATF conducted the investigation.  Assistant U.S. Attorney James C. Cowles Jr. is prosecuting the case.”


 

Angel of Death Tactical’s Facebook page is still up and running here, although I would not advice anyone to buy from there for obvious reasons.

By the looks of it, AoDT have been selling the silencers as “solvent trap kits”.

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I’d be honest and say that none of these “solvent traps” is something I would like to put on any firearm, regardless if it was legal. The material looks like brass, will it outlast the blast of a 5,56 through a rifle?

To me this looks like a very dangerous thing to put on a firearm.

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Quote: “…as well as assorted silencer parts with drilled baffles and end caps, other assorted parts for making silencers, and boxes of parts showing mailing information that they were imported from India.

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“Solvent trap” give aways!

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So before you start selling “solvent traps” and similar parts, regardless what you call them, please consider the laws.



Eric B

Ex-Arctic Ranger. Competitive practical shooter and hunter with an European focus. Always ready to increase my collection of modern semi-automatic firearms, optics and sound suppressors.


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  • DaveP.

    “Angel of Death Tactical”?
    Wow. Just wow. Why not name it “Hey Officer, Look At This Illegal Thing I’m Doing, Inc.”?
    How about, “I Want No Sympathy From Any Jury Anywhere Ever Ltd.”?
    Cuz “Angel of Death Tactical” might just be too subtle.

    • Gambler X

      well guess i should shut down completleyillegalmachinegunsicansellyou dot com…

      • Rock or Something

        Well as a co-worker tried to justify it to me one time “I think it’s ok, I’m ordering it from a site called legalsteroidsdotcom.”

    • Nebelwerfer

      “Angel of Death Tactical”, because “TactiTard Manufacturing” was probably taken already.

      And showing the “solvent trap” mounted on an AR is probably the smartest thing you can do when manufacturing illegal class 3 items…

      • Icer

        I like TactiTard Manufacturing. I think I’m going to use it to sell online popcorn.

        • Phillip Cooper

          Make sure it’s bacon flavored. Everyone knows it has to have bacon.

          • Phillip Cooper

            Also, TAKE MAH MONAY!!!

          • Ned Weatherby

            ALOHA SNACK-BAR!!!!

          • M1911

            Call it tactical bacon, put some black nylon on the package, and mark it up another 20%.

          • Icer

            Shipped exclusively in 1000 denier cordura.

          • Phillip Cooper

            Amateur.
            200%!

        • Gary Kirk

          Already contacting the trademark office for my new line of mustard that incorporates crisc.. I mean fireclean..

        • CountryBoy

          Yessir, Kernal, I mean Colonel!

      • Remember, Class III is a dealer’s license. The items are not and have never been “Class 3” they are “Title II NFA Firearms.” — That includes the silencers, which are considered firearms under the NFA.

      • Ned Weatherby

        Good observation, and awesome terminology. Incidentally, I saw a “solvent trap” dealer at a gun show, and across the isle, was an ATF booth.

        I’m all for someone carefully challenging the law, but heavens – “DEATH FROM ABOVE” manufacturing of, for instance, armed drones, is likely going to land one in jail.

        Doing everything following the advice of a lawyer may still land one in trouble. But this just looks like F**ktard-ism in full swing….

  • thedonn007

    There is nothing illegal about solvent traps. Was he selling pre-drilled storage cups? Aluminum storage cups are not very robust for much more than .22lr anyway.

  • Edeco

    …”Solvent trap giveaway”

    Me: “Hey, no, don’t mail me that thing!”

    • Had one, tried it, threw the adapter into a lake afterwards. Or something like that. Completely useless on pistol due to size. Didn’t own a threaded rifle at that time.

  • CTFish

    What was the problem? Pre-assembly of parts? Machining?

    • Joe Greene

      The fact the end cap had a hole drilled through it.

      • Flounder

        The front endcap is usually considered a baffle by the ATF which counts as a suppressor. The rear endcap is only sometimes considered a suppressor by itself. It seems that if it retains baffles then it is a suppressor, which I just look at and die a little inside.

        Plus this guy was obviously drilling out baffles so… Not at all okay. I forgot to mention that the outer tube is also considered a suppressor, it is also the only serialized part so the ATF kinda treats it like a reciever. I am kinda surprised he is getting off so lightly for all the apparent violations here.

    • Glenn Bellamy

      18 USC 921(a)(24): The terms “firearm silencer” and “firearm muffler” mean any device
      for silencing, muffling, or diminishing the report of a portable
      firearm, including any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and
      intended for use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or
      firearm muffler, and any part intended only for use in such assembly or
      fabrication.

      “Intended for use in . . .”

      • Don La Rue

        I wish he did this in Arizona as it would have been a great test case…Though, I think jury nullification is the only thing that’s going to get one off on such a charge. It’s the only thing between the FED’s and all the pot smokers up in Colorado and in Washington.

        13-3114

        Arizona manufactured firearms;

        Beginning October 1, 2010, a personal firearm, a firearm accessory or ammunition that is manufactured commercially or privately in this state and that remains within the borders of this state is not subject to federal law or federal regulation, including registration, under the authority of Congress to regulate interstate commerce and is not considered to have traveled in interstate commerce.

        D. This section does not apply to:

        1. A firearm that cannot be carried and used by one person.

        2. A firearm that has a bore diameter of more than one and one-half inches and that uses smokeless powder as a propellant.

        3. Ammunition with a projectile that explodes using an explosion of chemical energy after the projectile leaves the firearm.

        4. A firearm that discharges two or more projectiles with one activation of the trigger or other firing device.

        E. A firearm that is manufactured and sold in this state pursuant to this section shall have the words “made in Arizona” clearly stamped on a central metallic part such as the receiver or frame.

        F. For the purposes of this section:

        1. “Firearm accessory” means an item that is used in conjunction with or mounted on a firearm but that is not essential to the basic function of a firearm, including telescopic or laser sights, magazines, flash suppressors, folding or aftermarket stocks and grips, speedloaders, ammunition carriers and lights for target illumination.

        2. “Generic or insignificant part” includes springs, screws, nuts and pins.

        3. “Manufactured” means that a firearm, a firearm accessory or ammunition has been created from basic materials for functional usefulness, including forging, casting, machining or other processes for working materials.

  • Geoff Timm

    The real question is, did he buy any mailing lists and turn them over to the BATFE as customers? Geoff Who ordered from some online sellers who may have sold his info.

    • Oh man… Please tell me you didn’t…

      • Geoff Timm

        Sorry, I ordered from “Cheaper than Dirt” which ain’t, but I’ve gotten unsolicited offers since then, from a whole bunch of questionable source, which I studiously shred.

  • i_the_jury

    I’m not seeing a crime here.

    • Lew Siffer

      He sold completed silencers to an informant, and then they found completed silencers attached to firearms, along with drilled out caps and baffles. That is the crime here, not the sale or possession of solvent traps and solvent trap parts. He converted them to silencers.

      • i_the_jury

        I know why he was arrested. I still don’t see a crime here.

        • RaunchyDawg

          I believe you do see a crime, it’s just not the one the article wants you to see. 🙂

        • Jon Telles

          Unfortunately the ATF plays by a different set of rules. Intent to manufacture is what they will hit him with, is it right Hell No, but thats the way they roll. They had a guy in the city I live in busted for intent to manufacture an SBR. He had a 10 inch upper and a lower in the same place at the same time. Honestly I dont understand why the hell suppressors are an NFA item when is the last time someone was murdered with a suppressed firearm in the USA

    • kingghidorah

      Maybe then you should take over his business.

  • Bill

    Substitute “Everything You Need to Make an Indoor Marijuana Grow Including Dirt and Some Species of Seeds” and then complain about how this isn’t illegal and shouldn’t be illegal and how we should all be allowed to attach 1962 VW Beetle exhaust pipes to our guns because, you know, hearing.

    I’m going to write to the ATF and ask about the legality of converting a suppressor into a solvent trap.

    • David Silverstein

      While you’re at it, ask about converting a suppressor into a muffler for you 62 VW.

    • Tothe

      Plants shouldn’t be illegal either. I support the right of married homosexuals to defend their marijuana grow ops with suppressed SBRs, all without any licenses or registrations.

  • Dickie

    Curious if the buyers will face prosecution

  • Minuteman

    Which part of ‘shall not be infringed’ did the prosecution not understand?

    • zardoz711

      a silencer/suppressor isn’t a firearm, it’s an accessory.
      hell, it isn’t even an “arm”, much too short to club someone with.

      • Kivaari

        Not under the law. The way it is written it is a firearm. Same for a bomb, grenade and similar things. In reading the NFA there are lots of firearms that are not rifles, pistols or shotguns.

        • Norm Glitz

          “Destructive devices” ?

          • Kivaari

            Yes, DDs are “firearms”. It’s a weird way they define firearms for the law. It in essence excludes all conventional firearms. A shotgun isn’t a firearm under the NFA until it becomes too short. Pressure cooker bombs are firearms.

        • Bill

          Yes, but no. It isn’t like you can’t buy ARs by the clothes rack; the case is about a part that by itself will not launch a projectile. Does anyone think the FFs had suppressors in mind when they wrote the Second? They hadn’t even imagined of such things, so extending their statement to an invention made a hundred years later is a stretch

          • Kivaari

            NFA ’34 and GCA ’68 defines the devices as firearms. The FF didn’t think of hand grenades and land mines nor rocket launchers with anti-tank warheads either. I think we should be allowed anything short of nukes.

          • Bill

            I’ve seen enough stupid human tricks with guns, the mayhem that the average twit could raise with an RPG…well, there isn’t enough spackle in Walmart to cover up that ND.

    • Dan

      Yeah we all know, “shall not be infringed” blah blah just quit. Go educate people that don’t already know this. That will be time better spent than saying to like minded people.

  • Renegade

    Fool.

  • Armed Antagonist

    Everyone on here lambasting this schmuck has probably at some point muttered “Shall not be infringed …” Without a hint of irony. This is infringement and your fellow man is about to go to prison for breaking politician scribbles because he wanted to sell suppressors which should not be illegal in the first place. Any troops going to go spring this guy?

    • Gambler X

      Suppressors are not illegal in most states however they are taxed and the gubment sure does love its taxes. Do you pay sales tax on the guns you buy? Why do you think they tell us cigarettes are bad but never ban them, just raise the tax? Next time you are in McDonalds i dare you to pay for your double quarter combo meal without the tax and yell “SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!” See how far that gets ya.

      • Alex Agius

        “Next time you are in McDonalds i dare you to pay for your double quarter combo meal without the tax and yell “SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!” See how far that gets ya.”

        The paying of tax isn’t the issue. I’m sure everyone here would trade the NFA BS for a simple $200 sales tax on all NFA items.

        The problem is the registration and other BS that goes along with NFA items. You don’t have to register that burger. You can buy it and walk out with it the same day, and (should you wish) you can take it across state lines without telling anyone.

        It’s a pretty piss poor analogy.

        • Gambler X

          To the government, its taxes, and taxes are the issue. You mess with their income and they tend to be unhappy about it. I dont like the NFA process any more than you or anyone else that has done it or wants to do it.

          Its sorta like the BMV, mine used to be terrible, in a few short years i can do everything online, or if completely space it i can re-register all my cars at a kiosk at 2am if need be…which i have. Last time i actually went inside I was out in under 10 minutes with new plates for a new car. We as customers need to force that change but we are also a small clientele.

          Granted the burger isnt the best analogy but i was annoyed with the jackass spouting revolutions over solvent traps nonsense and it seemed on his level.

          • Alex Agius

            The purpose of the NFA was to limit the number of these kinds of “firearms” in general circulation.

            If it was solely a tax issue it would be a sales tax of $200 (which would generate FAR more money than the NFA does and did) or the fee would have kept up with inflation (thankfully it has not).

        • Bill

          A suppressor isn’t a firearm

          • Alex Agius

            Hence why I used quotation marks; in the sane world a supressor is a muzzle device, in the insane world of government legislation a supressor is a firearm.

            Here is the legal definition of a firearm in the USA “The term ‘firearm’ means (A) any weapon ( including a starter
            gun) which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel
            a projectile by the action of an explosive; (B) the frame or receiver
            of any such weapon; (C) any firearm muffler or firearm silencer; or
            (D) any destructive device. Such term does not include an antique
            firearm. “

          • Bill

            You are correct, I should have been more clear in referring to firearms in the 2nd Amendment Constitutional context.

          • HSR47

            First, “suppressor” is not a legally correct term for that particular type of item. Federal law defines these items interchangeably as silencers and mufflers. Ergo, if you want to be a pedant you should call them mufflers.

            Further, federal law specifically includes mufflers in the definition of “firearms” — see 18 U.S. Code § 921(a)(3): “The term “firearm” means (A) any weapon (including a starter gun) which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; (B) the frame or receiver of any such weapon; (C) any firearm muffler or firearm silencer; or (D) any destructive device. Such term does not include an antique firearm.”

            TLDR: While I agree with you that it’s a stretch to call firearm mufflers “firearms” that also ignores one simple fact: Laws don’t have to make sense.

      • Mystick

        They might call it a “tax stamp”, but it plainly and simply a license. It can be denied. it can be withdrawn. Taxation is an “after-the-fact” enumeration on a transaction that has already happened. When you follow NFA, you are asking the government permission to complete a transaction. That is not a tax.

        • Guest

          If you intend to use it for legal purposes it can’t be denied actually…

          • David Silverstein

            The fact that you have to add a caveat means that it CAN be denied. You are asking permission. You just expect that you’ll get it. The whole purpose of the 2nd Amendment is to prevent tyranny by not allowing the government to be in the position of giving (or not giving) permission in regards to the ownership and bearing of arms.

    • Kivaari

      BUT, he didn’t follow the law. He was a schmuck because he flaunted his business. Like many crooks he was waving a big flag saying, “Here I am, I am really stupid, so you should pay attention to me”.

      • Tothe

        The law is wrong.

      • STFUTWIT

        Are you mad that the “silencer guy” because he stole your advertisement strategy?

        • Kivaari

          It was a failed practice. Notice he was arrested and pleaded guilty.

    • Coralyn Herenschrict

      While springing him is impractical, withdrawing your support for the people responsible for locking him in a cage is practical.

      A whole array of people from police to judges to prosecutors to politicians to prison guards are responsible. Stop serving these people at your businesses. Stop social relations with them. Exclude them from your affairs.

      Don’t let them get away with what they do. Send a message that their aggression against innocents are not OK and have consequences.

      • Mystick

        They won’t let you. They make you bake cakes for them. Enforced by rule of law.

        • Coralyn Herenschrict

          Smart objection. My response is, let’s not defeat ourselves in our own heads before we get started. Just because they have a lot of guns doesn’t make them omnipotent. Actually, they are vulnerable. They are dependent on maintaining a certain facade. They are dependent on mass voluntary support.

          Let’s say they pass a caking-baking law forcing businesses to serve state agents. Right away, that blows a big hole in their propaganda that the state is the people and governs with consent. Throwing people in jail for not serving the state would expose them too plainly for what they are. Self-defeating for them. I think they would never pass such a law.

          Even if they did, forced cake baking still requires cooperation. Bakers could simply “accidentally” replace sugar with salt in the cake. Or run out of gas delivering the cake. Or 1,000 other creative ways to achieve the desired outcome while technically complying with the letter of the law. They simply don’t have enough agents and resources to withstand widespread creative disobedience.

          • Ostracism is indeed powerful. I didn’t keep the news article but several years ago some Forest Service people quit because the people in the area where they worked shunned them.

          • Mystick

            The “consent” ship sailed long ago…

      • Old Vet

        Even as we speak, Republicans are considering “gun control legislation” that “they can live with”…..this one party system is about to kill us all. It is time to beat some plowshares my friends.

  • Rob

    Regulating silencers is retarded. It’s a freaking muffler, guns are loud. We need this ignorant law repealed.

    • Drew Coleman

      Let’s get SBR’s and SBS’s off the NFA too, while we’re at it.

      • Let’s try one at a time… 🙂

        • Tothe

          Step 1: Abolish the ATF.

          Done.

          • jeff

            that will not get the dumb laws off the books

          • Coralyn Herenschrict

            Abolish the ATF and repeal all gun laws.

            Done.

          • Tothe

            If the dumb laws are not enforced, the dumb laws are effectively nullified.

      • Emperius

        Uhm, how about REPEAL the ’34, ’68 and ’86 laws?

      • Outlaw

        Start by not letting Hillary win or there won’t be a need for silencers anyway, there won’t be any guns to put them on.

    • Pete – TFB Writer

      They are way too scary to deregulate.

      • Ebby123

        Let the Anti’s say that as we pass it,
        Just like they screamed “Blood in the streets!” as we passed Constitutional Carry in state after State after State….

        Let THEM decide its not worth the fight because they’ll almost certainly lose.

        • Pete – TFB Writer

          Sorry. Purely sarcasm.

        • Bill

          Wait, what happened to the ever-constricting attack on our gun rights?

          • Kivaari

            The attack continues. Washington is now going after all assault weapons and magazines over 10 rounds. Look how California just passed 10 new laws retroactively outlawing guns and magazines. Republican states loosen laws, democrat states restrict guns.

  • Ambassador Vader

    It looks like the end cap just has a pilot indent and not an actual hole. What about it was illegal? Did he make some without paper work and that is what they are going after as manufacturing and selling? Good lord the NFA needs to be abolished, these suppressor laws make no sense. Thanks a lot FDR.

    • Pete – TFB Writer

      In one of the ads he mentions “silencer kits”. Unfortunately there is no such thing. As soon as it is a a part for a silencer, it needs a stamp. Whether or not it silences a firearm.

      The law should be repealed. But for now it’s the law.

      • cwp

        So, hypothetically, if someone were to build a silencer, and one of the parts were a Justin Bieber CD, Justin Bieber CDs would need tax stamps thereafter?

        • Pete – TFB Writer

          That’s just silly. Nothing the Biebs does is quiet.

    • Flounder

      The quote says that completed suppressors were mounted on guns and that there were “baffles” siezed at his house. So he was not actually arrested for the solvent traps. They just got him noticed by the gov.

      • BryanS

        Im betting they were not drilled, and that since they consider these things to be something they are not, they call them whatever they want.

        The agency that has shown a generation they are not above killing you and your family over 2″ of pipe and a tax gets to make the language rules.

    • Kivaari

      Thank congress.

  • Major Tom

    On the one hand, part of me goes the whole “shall not be infringed” schtick. On the other, would these suppressors pass muster in the whole range of stuff like not exploding the first time I’d fire a round through it?

    Because it’d be real hard to drum up sympathy for a guy who makes unsafe and unreliable suppressors.

    • Flounder

      Aluminium is fine for rimfire. I think it is actually the industry standard. Pistol cans are also incorporating more and more aluminium as well. Some rifle cans even use it.

      Brass on the other hand seems foolish. It is very heavy and soft, but it would probably work for all the standard pistol calibers. just weigh more than your gun.

      • Bill Plowman

        It’s not brass. It’s gold anodized. You can see in one photo of the raw aluminum “storage cups”. Nobody would use brass.
        It’s another example of this web site. The authors don’t have a clue about the subject most of the time.

    • Christian Hedegaard-Schou

      Considering they are being sold as “solvent traps” without any actual holes through the “storage cups”, if you DID put this on a rifle and fire it, yes it probably would explode.

      You’d have to build an actual silencer from these parts first.

      So the trick here is that the ATF is going to have to convince a jury that there’s no such thing as an “80%” silencer and that these ARE in fact silencers and silencer parts, even though they can’t be assembled into a silencer without further machine work.

      • RaunchyDawg

        That won’t be hard considering the general populations level of education regarding general firearm operation, let alone aftermarket parts.

      • David Silverstein

        Good luck finding a jury of liberty-minded folks to side with the guy who’s clearly trying to skirt a stupid law.

      • Rollin Shultz

        What trick? This knucklehead plead guilty. He should have done a Hillary, or Lois Lerner on them. You never give up, because there is often a way out if you can present a good case and he didn’t even try, he just buckled under pressure. Then there is the fact he is guilty because they found actual silencers on guns and solvent cups, already pre drilled. If he would have stuck to the plan and just made and sold the solvent trap kits, he would have had a winnable case.

        • Norm Glitz

          We don’t know the entire history leading up to his guilty plea. Maybe they “promised” to “go easy on him” if he plead guilty.

        • Repoman3737

          I read another article about this guy somwhere else a few days ago and this is his second time being arrested for silencers and other questionable parts if i remember the article correctly

  • Liberals and Communists trigge

    Another thread to complain, another day America lives in the hard earned “freedom” after beating the ebil nutzi fascists across the atlantic.
    Ironic justice.

  • TxPoor

    It appears AoDT forgot rule #1… never, ever invite the man into your life.

  • Bradley

    They change their mind about nfa rules way too rapidly to even begin to argue about it, but I do see from a google search that there are tons of websites selling “solvent trap” kits. I don’t have any knowledge about this practice, but by the description they sound similar to what this guy was selling. It does seem to state that when they searched his home he had some completed suppressors installed on firearms which is clearly illegal. So the question may be whether they were justified in performing a search based on what he had on the facebook page. Then again it does say he is charged with making and selling them. I doubt making sense is a requirement at all really.

    • Gary Kirk

      Most of what are sold as “solvent traps” generally use an oil filter, and the adapter doesn’t cover the return ports. Think you know suppressor blowback? (Note, I have never used one myself, find them way to edgy) Kind of enjoy my eyeballs

      • Bradley

        I’ve seen what you’re talking about as well, but there are many entire websites dedicated to selling kits that look almost exactly like what is shown here. One even included free nfa trust paperwork in case you wanted to build a supressor with it.

        • Gary Kirk

          Yeah.. And this guy was sketchy? Nothing involving the nfa is ever free..

  • Pete – TFB Writer

    Erik, I think those are gold anodized aluminum baffles. Rimfire only I suspect.

    • Christian Hedegaard-Schou

      Well, the ad straight-up called them aluminum. To assume they’re brass is just shoddy reporting.

      • Pete – TFB Writer

        Slow down shooter. That was unnecessary.

        • Mystick

          Reading is hard.

    • Edeco

      yeah, doesn’t sound like a titanium nitride kind of operation. Not that I think ill of it from a moral standpoint.

    • Cymond

      My guess would be terrible lighting and no effort to correct white balance.

      • JT Wise

        I’ve seen many of TFB’s videos, yet you’re lecturing on white balance???

        • Cymond

          First, I’m not associated with TFB in any way, I just post comments.

          Second, I was merely proposing an alternate explanation. A single sentence is hardly “lecturing”.

          • JT Wise

            My mistake – I erroneously attributed your remark to the previous poster, who is with TFB. No offense intended.

  • Pete – TFB Writer

    This is partly why the second edition of the ‘build your own silencer’ series is delayed. I’m trying to figure out how to mention parts suppliers.

    • PK

      Don’t. People can use Google.

    • David Silverstein

      I agree with PK. If you describe the parts, people will find a way. If you make it too easy, the ATF will reinterpret laws (not in your favor).

    • Bill

      Ask yourself if the benefits outweigh the risks.

    • Gary Kirk

      I completely understand that point.. Could land you in some DS

    • Cymond

      Yeah, it’s tricky. I’ve considered doing a Form 1 build, but I don’t have any kind of machinist experience or tools. I would be reliant on drilling out a solvent trap. Of course, those parts are expensive enough to be comparable to an entry level commercial can, but commercial cans tend to be smaller & lighter for similar performance.

      Heck, I figure the $100 Rebel rimdire suppressor is going basically kill Form 1 rimfire cans.

  • Phillip Cooper

    I like how they throw the posession of a drill press in there, as if it’s a controlled item.
    “You can have my cheap chinese-made machine tools when you take them from my cold dead hands… Or when I’m done building the Jeep”
    (Joke’s on them- Jeeps are never finished! Admire my clever ploy!)

    • Bill

      Actually, if the drill press is being used as an instrument in committing a crime it’s a criminal tool. Irrigation pipe is fine in a cornfield, but an additional criminal count at an outdoor marijuana grow. I know of a case where a tube sock lead to a charge- a thief was using it to dump change into as he was breaking into vending machines.

      • Amplified Heat

        Between that tube sock charge & the infamous shoelace machinegun, it’s a wonder the cops don’t charge all criminals for wearing shoes & clothing as “criminal tools” in the commission of whatever. I suspect the drill press is far more likely just another example of intent to manufacture that they are constructing against this guy.

        His only crime was not having the resources (legal/political) to back up such brazen behavior; this is something that all gunowners should realize.

        • Kivaari

          Gun owners should realize that this guy was dumber than a rock.

        • Bill

          Sport, try that argument at 3:00 AM when someone is found within 2 blocks of 7 raped vending machines while wearing 2 socks and carrying 1.

          Believe it or not, not everyone is your idea of a “good guy.”

          • Mystick

            Those vending machines were asking for it, dressing like that in that neighborhood, at that time of night…

      • Gary Kirk

        There’s a far more insidious use for pipe, as was witnessed this weekend.. As well as pressure cookers and many other general containers, we must ban high capacity Rubbermaid..

        • Bill

          You could be right, maybe he was gearing up to make bombs also.

          • Pontificant

            Perhaps, we could develop silencers for bombs before they make them illegal!? I mean, those things are annoyingly loud.

            HushaBoomdotcom?

          • Aldo1887

            That sounds more like an Indiana Jones villain than a company name, but I like where your head’s at!

          • STFUTWIT

            So, now we can get arrested on speculation and assumptions…..according to your “maybe he was…”

          • Bill

            It’s called “attempt.”

          • STFUTWIT

            No, thats not what you wrote

          • Bill

            The legal aspect preparing to execute a crime is referred to as “attempt.” That’s exactly what I wrote.

          • STFUTWIT

            Really, lmao….let me quote you on what I replied to, “You could be right, maybe he was gearing up to make bombs also.” So….where is the attempt? Oh, yeah…..just a personal assumption. You have no idea if he even tried or thought about making bombs. Just the facts. Please don’t tell me you’re a lawyer too…..

          • Bill

            Critical thinking, give it a try, it doesn’t hurt.

          • Matt

            For some people…

          • STFUTWIT

            Wow, now youre trying to insult…keep trying. Good luck with denile…

          • Bill

            Well, you do seem pretty dense with an inability to understand the blindingly obvious, so if the insult fits, fly it high.

          • STFUTWIT

            Wow, pot calling the kettle black….try the mirror

          • Ned Weatherby

            Take that matter up with the department of pre-crime…

          • STFUTWIT

            ??? Is there a law enforcement crystal ball???

        • Dr. Obvious

          i know a couple insidious uses for tube socks.

          • Gary Kirk

            Stay in school..

          • Dr. Obvious

            post doc work?

      • Tothe

        Where’s the crime? Sure, he “broke the law,” but if there is no victim, no actionable injury against another individual or his property, then there is no crime. Legality and morality are not synonymous.

        • Bill

          If you don’t understand the concept of statutory law, the rule of law and not men, and malum prohibitum offenses, study up.

          The “victim” is everyone who followed established legal procedure in the manufacture, sale and possession of firearms suppressors.

          • Norm Glitz

            That’s a stretch.

            Those who followed “established legal procedure” would be victims of government overregulation, not of this particular bozo.

          • Bill

            Want to apply the same argument to tax fraud?

          • Mystick

            Show the damage.

          • Bill

            The damage is the effort and cost that everyone who went through the legal process to obtain a suppressor that he subverted.

          • Mystick

            That’s not damages. They have lost nothing and suffered no hardship as a direct result.

          • Bill

            You mean it’s fine for a criminal to not have to wait for approval and pay their fees like everyone else? I didn’t realize that a free FastPass was a viable defense to a crime.

          • Tothe

            Precisely. Malum prohibitum vs. malum in se.

          • Hank Seiter

            And what part of “man was not made for law, but law for man” don’t we understand? Have we all become sheep in the face of bureaucratic fascism which has unconstitutionally absconded with the non-transferable plenary powers of Congress? Vesting congressional legislative powers in what amounts to extra-constitutional departmental entities is despotic and dangerous to every man’s liberties as evidenced by the legislative fascism of the ATF and any number of other federal “agencies” which have no explicit grounding in the U.S. Constitution despite whatever 9 black-robed thugs may unconstitutionally opine in their court which institutionalizes such despotisms.
            Just sayin’.

        • David Silverstein

          The regulation of firearms and suppressors, while unlawful, does serve a positive purpose: oversight. When a gun backfires and kills the shooter or a suppressor explodes you can’t very well say that there is no victim. I don’t like the regulations, but I can acknowledge a benefit gained by them.

          • Tothe

            Do you believe a centralized monopoly is necessary for oversight, or the ideal means of providing oversight? Monopolies promote waste and abuse, especially when competition is outlawed and they are funded by theft.

          • David Silverstein

            No. It’s not the best way, but right now it’s all we have. Walk into any gun store, reputable or otherwise, and you’ll be hard pressed to find a NEW gun that will blow up in your hand. There are some crappy brands, but none that are inherently unsafe. I kind of like that.

    • Klaus Von Schmitto

      When drill presses are outlawed………..

      • CountryBoy

        It will be a lot less boring then…

        Sorry.

  • QuadGMoto

    This guy was clearly trying to hide illegal activity*. But this made me wonder, is there legitimately such a thing as a “solvent trap”?

    (* It should not be illegal, but it is and the government has the ability to make it stick.)

    • David Silverstein

      I disagree. He was selling parts that could clearly be manufactured into suppressor parts, but, without the holes drilled through them, they’re no different than the things sold at Home Depot or the like. If you assembled this into a hole-less suppressor, it would not function as a suppressor, nor was it advertised to do so. If the buyer put holes into it, HE would be the one manufacturing suppressor parts.

      • Bill

        The intended outcome of his “parts kits” is pretty obvious

        • Ralph Brooks

          It doesn’t matter, the intended outcome of an 80% receiver is obvious as well. There’s a very legal manner to take one of these kits to the final product of suppressor, just like there’s a legal way to take an 80% lower to the final product of working AR.

          The fact remains that, unless holes are drilled in the cups or the endcap, it’s not a suppressor and can be sold, sans paperwork, under any other moniker.

          • Bill

            Go for it, let us know how you enjoy the finished product, and being a test case.

          • Ralph Brooks

            Guess you’ve never filed a Form 1 before. That’s ok, I remember when I was ignorant of the NFA too.

          • Bill

            I’m definitely not ignorant of filling out forms and paying taxes

      • Gary Kirk

        You’d be better off going to an auto parts store and getting valve spring retainers.. Not sure if you could find any preformed baffles in home depot..??

        • David Silverstein

          The point is that it wouldn’t function as it is. It still needs to be machined to become a suppressor part.

  • guest

    Might want to go back and add another “XXXX”. There is still a sentence with his uncensored name.

  • smurf

    Doubt that’s brass. More like anodized aluminum.

  • Jeremy Star

    Here in the Land of the Free you can go to prison for duct-taping a soda bottle to the end of your rifle. I’m not sure why he didn’t see this coming.

    • Bill

      I hear that a lot, yet it happens rarely if not at all. They aren’t going to give up a federal prison bed for a pop bottle convict when they could put a weed convict in it. Priorities

      • Jeremy Star

        Sure they will. Rapists and murderers get pushed out all the time for petty stuff like this.

        • Bill

          Not really. That’s a common misperception, like federal prisons being country clubs.

  • Mark

    Some okes will always think they are smarter than the system and try a loophole (though anyone that can read would know that “solvent traps” aren’t a loophole at all) and eventually get caught. It’s not worth it. It really sucks for you guys across the big pond, but to be totally honest, I would give up suppressors for your general gun laws any day. For me to get a gun, I need to go through the same amount of scrap you guys do for suppressors, and I can only have a max of 4 guns under normal circumstances.

    This, however, is such a stupid law because it does nothing to keep suppressor out of criminal hands (do criminals even use suppressors!?). Anyway, hopefully you guys can someday get rid of the idiocy that is your ATF.

    • David Silverstein

      It’s not a loophole to do something that is legal. Just like the “gun show loophole” is only called that to distract from the fact that it is perfectly legal (under federal law) for an individual to sell a gun to another non-prohibited resident of his own state. Not a loophole.
      As for this guy, he was selling INCOMPLETE suppressor parts, just like Home Depot does. When someone drills holes in them, suddenly they become parts that can be used in a suppressor. So really, the buyer is the one doing the manufacturing.

      The problem is that the ATF, like any unelected bureaucracy, interprets laws however they see fit. When those laws are very complex to begin with, they rely on juries taking the government’s word for it that a crime was committed.

      • did you miss that he was drilling the holes?

        • Tothe

          How is drilling holes fundamentally a crime? Who is the victim? Who has suffered injury to life, liberty, or property?

    • Tothe

      Loopholes are the portals through which freedom flows.

  • Don La Rue

    I wish he did this in Arizona as it would have been a great test
    case…Though, I think jury nullification is the only thing that’s going
    to get one off on such a charge. It’s the only thing between the FED’s
    and all the pot smokers up in Colorado and in Washington.

    Arizona Revised Statute:
    13-3114
    Arizona manufactured firearms;

    Beginning
    October 1, 2010, a personal firearm, a firearm accessory or ammunition
    that is manufactured commercially or privately in this state and that
    remains within the borders of this state is not subject to federal law
    or federal regulation, including registration, under the authority of
    Congress to regulate interstate commerce and is not considered to have
    traveled in interstate commerce.

    D. This section does not apply to:

    1. A firearm that cannot be carried and used by one person.

    2. A firearm that has a bore diameter of more than one and one-half inches and that uses smokeless powder as a propellant.

    3. Ammunition with a projectile that explodes using an explosion of chemical energy after the projectile leaves the firearm.

    4. A firearm that discharges two or more projectiles with one activation of the trigger or other firing device.

    E.
    A firearm that is manufactured and sold in this state pursuant to this
    section shall have the words “made in Arizona” clearly stamped on a
    central metallic part such as the receiver or frame.

    F. For the purposes of this section:

    1.
    “Firearm accessory” means an item that is used in conjunction with or
    mounted on a firearm but that is not essential to the basic function of a
    firearm, including telescopic or laser sights, magazines, flash
    suppressors, folding or aftermarket stocks and grips, speedloaders,
    ammunition carriers and lights for target illumination.

    2. “Generic or insignificant part” includes springs, screws, nuts and pins.

    3.
    “Manufactured” means that a firearm, a firearm accessory or ammunition
    has been created from basic materials for functional usefulness,
    including forging, casting, machining or other processes for working
    materials.

    • Tothe

      Idaho has similar laws.

  • Jake

    Shall not be infringed

    • regulation is not infringement.

      • Tothe

        Yes, it is. A license is permission to do something that is otherwise “illegal.” That means something was made “illegal” by government legislation. If something is “illegal,” but there is no victim of a crime against person or property, then a right has been infringed.

  • Andrew Miller

    Don’t recall seeing this guy, but I had on occasion stuck in my “feed” pages advertising “solvent traps for sale.
    Never bit, I’m not a fan of “jail”.

    • Ralph Brooks

      They’re totally legal til you drill the cups or the endcap. Unless you file a Form 1.

  • Joseph Goins

    “Mama always said, ‘Stupid is as stupid does.'”
    Forrest Gump

  • Mack

    From my understanding, he isn’t being prosecuted for selling solvent traps, he is being prosecuted for having the solvent traps completed and not stamped, and other parts that were completed with out paperwork. That’s why you file you form 1 before you get out the dremel and drill.

  • I’m having a hard time believing any of this.

  • Mike Crognale

    Stupid man pays the price.

  • BryanS

    Funny how they can make millions pay a tax on a firearm that cant shoot a bullet or load a cartridge.

  • Spencerhut

    The law is the law, even if we don’t agree with it.*
    Seems like this fella was extraordinarily stupid. Just begging to go to jail.

    *Silencers/suppressors should be 100% legal to make/buy/sell/loan with zero paperwork or involvement from the .gov. But it just ain’t so . . .

    • Tothe

      Appeal to legality is not a moral or rational argument. Breaking the law is only stupid if you get caught, or if the law coincidentally happens to identify an actual crime against an actual victim.

  • MyFifteenthAccount

    The meathead probably would have been fine if he hadn’t drilled all the holes in everything before selling them.

    • Cymond

      Paranoid Cymond wonders if we should really believe he did. Do we really trust the source (ATF) to report the situation from a neutral, unbiased perspective? Especially since it would be counter to their own arrest.

  • Amplified Heat

    Should’ve been nullified by jury. Oh well.

    • Kivaari

      He knew better, and pleaded guilty. No chance for jury nullification.

  • Amplified Heat

    And the Maglite corporation continues to manufacture complete silencer tubes without any objections from the same Bureau that holds the ‘tube’ IS the ‘silencer’ in their eyes, and frets over pilot holes vs. indentations in freeze plugs…

    • Mike Lashewitz

      Hmmm. Pilot holes in condoms… a scary thing…. In the military we had a joke about needle dicked bug effers…

    • STFUTWIT

      It’s all about money. If the guy making the “illegal” solvent devices had a crap load of cash I’m sure he wouldn’t be having a court date or even facing any prison time……money makes government giddy….

  • Kivaari

    It’s amazing that he lasted in business for more than a few days. What did he expect considering his method of advertising and sales. I wonder how good his records were as to customer lists.

    • Klaus Von Schmitto

      It doesn’t matter how good his lists were, if he didn’t conduct a cash business, his bank will rat him out. Or PayPal.

  • Treyh007

    Saw something very similar to this at a local gun show this weekend. This guy had his entire lil family with him at the booth, youngins, the dog and the wife. It’s kinda sad that he might be putting his family at risk “legally”.

  • Roy Rabbit

    Hell if I was on the jury I would find him guilty and I like guns!!!

  • POsP-Eye

    “This investigation and prosecution is part of Project Safe Neighborhoods…”

  • Dr. Joshua Cappuccilli

    I bet the whole case ultimately came down to the fact that he had taken a few units the last few steps to actually being a suppressor, like taking am 80% lower to the end result of a legal firearm. He wasn’t charged like there was a pallet of silencers or he would be facing 100,000 years of jail.

  • john396

    Only in the “Land Of The Free” could you get sent to prison for making a SAFETY DEVICE!
    Ear damaging noise is a SAFETY issue in EVERY instance, except when talking about firearms. A suppressor is NOT a weapon, there is no reason it should be regulated by the Feds. (Nor TAXED!!!)
    Like the politicians in the 50’s that banned automatic knives after watching too many old motorcycle gang movies, our politicians have watched too many spy movies.

    Like the anti-gunners say “Time for some SENSIBLE gun laws.”

    • Bill

      “Like the politicians in the 50’s that banned automatic knives after watching too many old motorcycle gang movies, our politicians have watched too many spy movies.”

      A number of states have lifted restrictions on automatic knives, a further erosion of our rights…Wait, what?

      • john396

        QUOTE “A number of states have lifted restrictions on automatic knives”

        After over 50 years, it’s about time don’t ya think? What makes a ‘auto’ knife any worse than a chef’s knife?
        And the suppressor’s being made legal is LONG overdue too….

        • Bill

          So, instead of acknowledging that it’s finally occurring, you’re going to complain that it’s taken too long?

          And auto knives make horrible chef’s knives.

          • john396

            No Bill I do acknowledge that it is finally occurring, and yes I will complain that it has taken entirely FAR TOO long…

            Auto knives make horrible chef’s knives!?!? Billl…you outlaw you, do you have a auto knife? :O

          • Bill

            I have at least a dozen, mostly Microtechs and Protechs. Chicks really dig the Godfather with the Jazz finish, but It’ terrible for carving a turkey.

  • Ralph Brooks

    Doesn’t look any different than the offerings from SD Tactical which have been held as legal. This guy must have been finishing them, because the pictured items are legal.

  • Icarus

    I don’t see the issue if he does not drill the baffles.

    • Ralph Brooks

      Or endcap.

  • Mike Lashewitz

    Sounds to me like he was doing business like the Clintons. You know thinly veiled crime that appears legal. . . . Till someone scrapes off the veneer of crap.

    I wonder where this fits within the concept of, Shall Not Be Infringed. . . .

  • Squrrily

    Silencers, machine guns, mortars, shoulder fired rockets…….make em’ all legal! We need so much more than rifles and pistols to hunt and for protection. Abolish the ATF???? Have we lost our freaking minds? People who support companies like “Angel of Death” do not understand how the promotion enhanced weapons sheds an ugly light on those of us who use guns to hunt. We do not need silenced weapons any more than we need personal nukes.

    • Not Gersh Kuntzman

      Definitely from someone who has NEVER heard a suppressed firearm or fired one himself.

      Educate yourself before spouting this Fudd bullshit.

      • Squrrily

        What the HELL does “hearing” a suppressed weapon have to do with the need for owning one? Oh yeah, the bullshit you refer to is most likely what your brain is made of. You ignorant bastard. BTW, for the record, I have used silenced weapons and the public doesn’t need them.

        • Not Gersh Kuntzman

          If you actually knew what you were talking about, A) you wouldn’t call them “silencers” and B) you’d realized that even with a suppressor, a firearm is still roughly ~120 dB. Which is just on the right side of hearing safe.

          Real life isn’t Hollywood, and using a suppressor on CoD doesn’t count as using one in real life.

          Let me ask you this.

          What is better and safer for you? Being in the woods hunting with a suppressed firearm and no hearing protection, and thus maintaining complete situational awareness (and thus being able to hear people calling out to you or approaching you); or being in the woods hunting with an unsuppressed firearm and hearing protection on that dampens ALL noise (and thus makes it harder to hear people calling out to you or approaching you)?

          • Squrrily

            BLAH, BLAH, BLAH…..SHUTUP

          • Not Gersh Kuntzman

            Is the Fudd angry cause he got caught talking about something he knows nothing about and making stuff up?

          • Randy HK-91

            I think hes an anti gunner acting as a Gun owner =prolly paid by Bloomthurdd

        • Ralph Brooks

          Suppressors are considered being a good neighbor in the UK, and they barely have any gun rights.

          So there’s that. I mean, you could stop getting your ideas about what guns are from Hollywood, or you could be informed. Your call.

        • Repoman3737

          You really put nukes and silencers in the same context.. I think your cheese may have slid off your cracker a little. I want to thank you though for taking the time to decide what us simple folk need and don’t need. I have a hard time making up my mind what things are necessary in life so maybe you could make us an approved list of things that meet your approval.. then I have a few suggestions on where you can stick that list.. a silencer is a muffler that makes a loud bang a little more bearable to neighbors who may not appreciate hearing the local gun range 7 days a week. You must be one of those people who think it makes a gun as quiet as a movie gun..

        • Tothe

          Putting the hearing protection on the firearm is much more sensible than making sure all people have their ears on. America: Where you go to jail for putting a muffler on your gun, or for not putting a muffler on your car.

    • Patrick ONeil

      Europe must be a crazy hellhole of fun death. In much (all?) of Europe silencers are fully legal to buy over the counter. Why a silencer? Noise reduction. A quieter gun is a much more pleasant gun. It won’t disturb Wildlife as much, won’t scree up your hearing the hearing of bystanders. Why have a muffler on your car?

      Silencers in the US should be handled as in Europe: easily available over the counter, and considered a proper tool for responsible gun owners.

      • actually most of Europe silencers are not legal period or only legal if you don’t have a gun. other countries the restrictions are on guns. UK pretty much no handguns, no black powder, no rifles greater then 22. also no machine guns in the majority of European countries.

    • Rob

      A- You don’t get to decide what I “need”
      B- It was poaching fudds who got them banned in the first place.
      C- See A

      • Squrrily

        you are right, I can;t decide what you need but the nation can and the laws of the nation can jail you for possession of ANYTHING the current laws say you do not need.

        • Matt

          But…muh Constitution.

        • Rob

          They can jail me for not paying a tax on a silencer. Don’t pay the tax man, you go to jail.

  • AlDeLarge

    “…as well as assorted silencer parts with drilled baffles and end caps, other assorted parts for making silencers,”

    There’s the real problem. He wasn’t just selling “solvent traps” which are completely legal. He was selling what those “solvent traps” turn into once they’re drilled: “silencers.” SD Tactical sells most of these parts out in the open with no pretense. They have forums discussing how people make silencers from them. They also stress the importance of complying with NFA laws, there are also discussions about filing Form 1, and none of their stuff comes drilled except the thread adapters. That’s how I made my Form 1 silencer. They even have an arrangement with someone who will engrave your tube for you.

    • Ralph Brooks

      Bill farther down that page swears that this is impossible. Haha. NFA newbs.

  • Aaron E

    First, the firearms community needs to make a concerted effort to remove silencers from the NFA controlled list – period!

    Second, this guy made himself low-hanging fruit for the ATF. Change the law, don’t be an idiot and drop your pants in front of the crowd!

  • Make Tangible sense

    THIS IS WRONG. WILL SOMEONE PLEASE FLUSH THE TOILET IN DC

  • Randy HK-91

    I know you all will vote for TRUMP ==BUT If you dont drag your friends “”Kicking and screaming” to the Polls –WE will loose Our rights –No less repeal any bad gun laws —

    • Bill

      Trump would pay his NFA stamp fees for sure, with Foundation money.

      Why not just recycle 2008 and 2012’s hysterical posts? Think of the bytes,

  • Art Nickel

    As long as silencers are regulated what is stupid is to do what this idiot has done.
    First of all, it reinforces the idea that silencers are a bad thing–the press loves this as does the anti-gun lobby.
    What this guy, and others like him, have done is give fuel to keep silencers on the NFA list and also take away from the more needed investigations that the BATFE needs to be doing, like chasing down bomb making materials and investigation every bomb found anywhere.
    As for idiot(s) running Angel of Death Tactical, they all need to be jailed over this. Wrong is wrong.

  • CruisingTroll

    ooh, ooh, look.
    Infringement.

  • Eduardo Vazquez Sotomayor

    Sorry but for me this is a super fake case, no one is that stupid and make a Facebook page like that. This look like this is made up by ATF, is hard to believe that.

  • M1911

    I hate malum prohibitum laws.

  • Doug Simpson

    I love internet lawyers like Tothe.

    • Tothe

      I love how people prefer to apply labels rather than actually address arguments presented.

  • Matt

    Suppressors promote firearm safety. Hearing loss is a serious thing.

  • Dr. Obvious

    jury nullification

  • Luke Shootsalot

    Hilarious. The ad at the bottom of this article is for solvent traps.

  • avconsumer2

    Gubment mad they didn’t get their share.

  • Bob

    so tell me, who in the world FILLS their barrel with solvent.
    I don’t ! I run the brush with a 22 patch around it soaked with hoppes #9, and take the patch off the brush after it comes out the muzzle in one pass (why pull all that crud back into the barrel?)
    Then I might run the wet brush up and back 7 times max.
    then dry patch it. then wet patch it with break free clp.
    Solvent trap??? you’ve got to be kidding me!!
    in all my years shooting in NRA highpower, I’ve never heard of anyone FILLING their bore with solvent.

    • Matt

      That’s what they call “running it wet.”

      (Sorry, your attempt at troll comment makes you look very ignorant.)

      • Bob

        hardly a troll sir, I’ve been shooting since 1969, Never heard of LOADING your barrel with solvent with the only exception being that some folks used to run an electrode into their barrel loaded with some special solvent/cleaner to get rid of excess copper/ bronze in their barrel.

  • Rebel Silencer

    Pretty simple, you want to sell suppressors… gotta play by the rules. Don’t like the rules? Then help change the rules. I’m a big fan of the rules changing, but solvent trap makers are running a risk of getting bitten. It’s a can’t take the heat get out the kitchen type of thing.

  • Regular Guy

    He didn’t break the law and the Feds don’t have a case. They can however, keep him in court until he goes bankrupt.