POTD: M27 and M38 Live-Fire Action at Range 410A

by Eric B

Published: January 6th, 2021

U.S. Marine Corps Lance Cpl. Kevin M. Blodgett, an infantry rifleman with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division, engages a simulated target during Integrated Training Exercise 5-19 at Marine Corps Air Ground Combat Center Twentynine Palms, Calif., July 27, 2019. ITX 5-19 is a live-fire and maneuver combined arms exercise designed to train battalion and squadron-sized units in tactics, techniques, and procedures required to provide a sustainable and ready operational reserve for employment across the full spectrum of crisis and global engagement. (U.S. Marine Corps photo by Lance Cpl. Jose Gonzalez)

In today’s Photo Of The Day we take a closer look at a group of U.S. Marine Corps infantry riflemen with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division as they participate in an Integrated Training Exercise called 5-19. Location: Twentynine Palms, California, in the year 2019.

ITX 5-19 was a live-fire and maneuver combined arms exercise designed to train battalion and squadron-sized units in tactics, techniques, and procedures required to provide a sustainable and ready operational reserve for employment across the full spectrum of crisis and global engagement.

Shouting out commands during Integrated Training Exercise 5-19 at Marine Corps Air Ground Combat Center.

A U.S. Marine Corps infantry rifleman on the move with his M38.

U.S. Marine Corps infantry riflemen with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division, prepare to move.

U.S. Marine Corps infantry riflemen with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division, engage a simulated target.

U.S. Marine Corps infantry riflemen with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division.

U.S. Marine Corps infantry riflemen with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division, prepare to move out.

U.S. Marine Corps infantry riflemen with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division, engage a simulated target

U.S. Marine Corps infantry riflemen with 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division, prepare to move toward a simulated target

All photos by the U.S. Marine Corps, taken by Lance Cpl. Jose Gonzalez.

Which would you rather have? The M27 or the M38?

#M27 #MarineCorps #Heckler&Kock #M38

Eric B

Ex-Arctic Ranger. Competitive practical shooter and hunter with a European focus. Always ready to increase my collection of modern semi-automatics, optics, thermals and suppressors. TCCC Certified. Occasionaly seen in a 6x6 Bug Out Vehicle, always with a big smile.

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9 of 22 comments

Brett baker on Jan 07, 2021

I would prefer an M4A1.

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- Billrla on Jan 07, 2021
  
  @Brett baker Brett baker: They have to keep changing the number and letter designations to keep the enemy confused. Heck, I'm confused.
  
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Geoff Timm on Jan 07, 2021

Is the M27 the result of reports soldiers are firing their weapons full auto all the time, rather than semi-auto? Everybody has a machinegun. Geoff Who notes planning does not equal reality.

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- Kinetics on Jan 07, 2021
  
  @Geoff Timm TL;DR for the last ~13 years: Guys absolutely hated room clearing using SAWs in Iraq. Marines also disliked the SAW because their M249’s were some of the oldest, most worn out, least reliable in the DoD.
  The USMC decides they need to adopt a Mag fed automatic rifle to address these issues, for whatever reason. Very soon after that decision was made, someone realized they could use it is a way to back door an M16/M4 replacement and the IAR program shifted to what it is today. An ill conceived attempt at fooling the bean counters that resulted in the USMC adopting a heavy rifle, with a proprietary mag well, that doesn’t like M855A1, has issues maintaining zero of rail mounted IR lasers...all for the low low price of 3k a piece, not including optics.
  And then almost right after it was adopted they said it was “amazing and magical and laser beam accurate” so they were going to issue them with Luepold scopes to be used by squad designated marksmen on semi-auto. Kinda defeating the point for it to be used in any real auto-rifle role.
  A few years ago some guy FOIA’d the program docs which showed that of all the submissions, the USMC chose the most expensive rifle, with the lightest barrel, that somewhat resembled an M4/M16, but was least capable of sustained automatic fire and likewise was not the most reliable.
  
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- N0truscotsman on Jan 08, 2021
  
  @Kinetics Did they even test the Colt IAR? I know Canada did some R&D on it and see that as potentially a more suitable option than the 416.
  Im not very familiar with the IAR program.
  From my experience, the SAW was not really well liked and many of them had maintenance issues (or lack thereof). Im sure the newer revisions are better though, but i haven't handled one.
  
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- Kinetics on Jan 08, 2021
  
  @n0truscotsman They did; the entrants included the Colt IAR, the Colt LSW (or a modernized derivative of it), the FN Hammer (SCAR with open-bolt full auto, closed-bolt semi auto functionality), the GD Ultimax, and the HK 416 with a heavy barrel (M27).
  If memory serves right, the HK entrant looked most like an M4 and was lightest by a very small margin (literally ounces), the LSW was the cheapest, the Ultimax was the most reliable, and the Hammer and Ultimax were more or less even for greatest sustained fire capability...with both being heads and shoulders more capable than the Colt and HK entries there.
  
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- Uniform223 on Jan 09, 2021
  
  @Kinetics According to SmallArmsSolutions Colt gave the USMC exactly what they asked for according to the RFP and listed requirements. However the USMC said they wanted one thing but in actuality desired something else.
  
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- Uniform223 on Jan 09, 2021
  
  @Kinetics Marines who I know who found out that they were replacing the SAW with an automatic rifle with a 30rd magazine all said it is a dumb idea. They dont speak for the entire corp but it is their opinion and I agree with them.
  
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- Kinetics on Jan 09, 2021
  
  @Uniform223 Yep, the FOIA docs showed that Colt’s IAR passed all of the benchmarks for a basic automatic rifle, which is what the USMC said they wanted, the LSW...not so much.
  The Hammer, but to a greater extent the Ultimax, outright blew the requirements away and really narrowed the gap between a magazine fed squad automatic weapon and a belt fed squad automatic weapon.
  In the end it was the “needs to be as M4-ish as possible” requirement that supposedly handed the win to HK, which in practicality makes no sense because any of the entries are demonstrably different in appearance from a SAW, but very little about the way the IAR program unfolded makes sense.
  I think most rational people realized this was a bait and switch when the USMC said they were flat out not going to consider drum mags like the D-60, but rather that they were going to spread the 20+ Stanag mags it takes to reach a basic 600 round SAW load out throughout the squad.
  
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POTD: M27 and M38 Live-Fire Action at Range 410A

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