Top 9 H&K Semi-Automatic MP5K / SP5K Alternatives You Can Buy TODAY. Why Wait for H&K to catch up?

hk

With the recent announcement by Heckler and Koch USA that the SP5K (MP5K-ish) will be available to the U.S. market, also comes a flood of consumer emotions.

Excitement: “This is awesome!”

Euphoria: “Yipee Ki Yay, Mother F******!”

Anxiety: “Is there any chance i will be able to afford one of these?”

Shock: “How much above MSRP?”

Depression: “What, no paddle mag release?”

Anger: “Stupid H&K hates Americans.”

Defiance: “I’ll never buy a neutered MP5K. Never!”

Acceptance: “It’s fine. The Hi-Point Carbine is basically the same thing.”

(No disrespect, Hi-Point)

Whatever the reason, you now refuse to even consider buying the SP5K, even though it has been your dream to own an MP5 ever since John McClane shot some terrorists (bearer bond mega-thieves) at the Nakatomi Plaza high rise in 1988. I’m not projecting here or anything.

Standby, you have options.

The American market contains a handful of H&K builders/importers of MP5s that, while they may not necessarily be more affordable than the SP5K, can be more technically accurate when compared to the original.

Both the prices and quality run the gamut – I could post rave reviews and negative experiences on at least some of the companies listed below, but it would only be unfair second-hand internet chatter. I guess the only way to know is to shoot them all side-by-side. Humbly, I volunteer for the job.

Until that epic review happens, we are left mainly with internet research and word of mouth. Take some time to explore the MP5 “clone” options on the market. Here are most of the commercially available Roller Lock/H&K Builders listed in alphabetical order (if I missed one, let me know in the comments section):

BOPS

black_ops_hk-mp5-build-services

Black Ops Defense – http://blackopsdefense.com/ 

Contact

Phone: 717-608-7277

Price Range: $2,395


bagearlogo4501

breth

Brethren Armament – http://brethrenarms.com/

Phone: 801-810-0392

2156 W 2300 S, WVC, UT 84119

Price Range (est): $1,899 to $3,899


d54_01

Dakota Tactical – https://dakotatactical.com

Phone: 734-560-7407

8495 Ronda Drive, Canton, MI 48188

Price Range (est): $3,499 to $3,699


IGF

Investment Grade Firearms – http://www.investmentgradefirearms.com/

Phone: 314-649-8162

Mountain Home, AR 72653

Price: Call/Email


kelogo

Kelly Enterprises – http://www.kellyenterprises.net/

Phone: 305-923-6560

1107 Key Plaza #401, Key West Florida 33040

Price Range (est): $2,299 to $2,699


pof5pk (1 of 7)

Pakistan Ordinance Factory (POF) – http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/component/virtuemart/shipping-rifles/pof-9mm-k-pistol-detail.html?Itemid=0

Phone: 410-352-5183

Atlantic Firearms,llc
10337 Bunting Road, Bishopville, MD 21813

Price Range (est): $1,495


TPMLOGO

TPM_IMG_1830-min

TPM Outfitters – http://www.tpmoutfitters.net/

Phone: 214-801-1429

1003 W. Main St. Carrollton, TX 75006-7235

Price Range (est): $3,125 to $3,795


TSC

tsc_MP5K_mainTSC Machine – http://www.tscmachine.com/

Phone: 804-994-9999

Email: mike@tscmachine.com

Price Range: Call/Email


zenith_firearms_logo zenith

Zenith Firearms – http://zenithfirearms.com/

Phone: 434-202-7790

10950 Rockfish Valley Highway Suite C, Afton, VA 22920

Price Range (est): $1,800


Which company did I go with for my MP5? You’ll have to wait until next week for that emotion-free information.

By the way, I don’t really think that H&K hates America or Americans, but that is a dissertation for a another time.


Commercial and Law Enforcement Sales (USA)

HECKLER & KOCH
5675 Transport Boulevard
Columbus, Georgia 31907 USA
Tel: (706) 568-1906
Fax: (706) 568-9151
E-mail: cs@heckler-koch-us.com



Pete

LE – Science – OSINT.
On a mission to make all of my guns as quiet as possible.
Pete.M@staff.thefirearmblog.com


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  • Daniel

    No, they hate us. It’s our money they don’t have a problem with.

  • Or just get the inofficial successor to the MP5 from the Swiss company that works closely together with H&K: The B&T APC9 (or APC45). It’s about 2`500$ with an Aimpoint, front grip and multiple magazines included.

    • Giolli Joker

      I don’t understand this thing of associating the straight blowback B&T to the MP5…
      If anything it’s a Swiss UMP.

    • Swissguy

      Geng die huere Schwiizer, wo Öpfle u Birre vergliche…

  • thedonn007

    Do all of these companies listed build them from the ground up, or are they all using the same parts?

    • Pete M

      Combination. Some use all HK parts, some are imports made on HK machines, some make their own.

    • Chris Cosby

      Most are going to be sourcing parts from the same places although you do have some that will start with HK parts kits vs third party ones. Others like the POF and MKE importers are bringing in guns that are made on HK tooling.

      I don’t believe TSC machine really does anything with clones. They make some clone guns but they start with real HK ones(ie they will take a mp5sd parts kit and a hk94 and make a clone of the mp5sd). What you end up with is top notch though.

  • Giolli Joker

    [Pedantic mode]
    Roller Lock/H&K Builders
    Delayed or Retarded, not Locked. 😉

    [Pedantic mode OFF]

    Interesting article and entertaining approach! 😉

    • iksnilol

      MP5s seem to be functioning fine. They don’t seem delayed or retarded to me.

      ¯_(ツ)_/¯

      • Giolli Joker

        It took 50 years for the original to reach the civilian market… if that isn’t delayed… 😛

        • iksnilol

          OH COME ON! You can’t blame MP5 for its parents flaws. The kid isn’t the fault of everything.

  • Twilight sparkle

    Why not make it ten, and let’s be honest we’ve all been spoiled by the armalite layout anyways, rollers are so 80’s

    • Because the MP5 is a better gun.

      • A Fascist Corgi

        How so?

        • Twilight sparkle

          Check out his mp5 run and gun video on tfb TV

        • Pete M

          That’s an entire article onto itself.

          • A Fascist Corgi

            You didn’t compare the 2 guns in that video.

      • Pete M

        As a preview to next weeks reveal of the manufacturer of my new selected MP5 variant, Alex C. has visited this company in the past.

      • Twilight sparkle

        long live the smg King

      • HKGuns

        Darn tootin.

      • RealitiCzech

        Sterling SMG is best SMG!

        • Steve_7

          Try firing one off your left shoulder.

      • Steve_7

        Can someone explain to me how any of this is legal? H&K is always very keen on suing people for violating their trade dress, and as for the SP5K, the SP89 was banned from import in 1993 as “non-sporting”. It wasn’t like H&K decided to stop making them, they were compelled to stop importing them. What’s changed? They’re not making them in the US from what I’ve read.

        • Twilight sparkle

          They weren’t caught in the ban of 94 though they would have been if H&K was still importing them. They got banned by an executive order which I’m not too familiar with but it could be that a simple name change is enough to bring them in again.

          • Steve_7

            Clinton banned them under 925(d)(3) in 1993. As I recall, the criteria was any handgun based on the design of an SMG, which this clearly is. The Steyr SPP, Uzi pistol and SITES spectre etc. were also banned from import. I’d hold your breath until ATF approves the Form 6, although I’ve been under the impression that the Tech Branch has fallen asleep at the switch since Ed Owens retired.

    • Joshua Knott

      Well a roller delayed blowback system isn’t reliant on gas port size or consistent ammo, just requires the round to go bang. PTR 32 anyone?

      • Twilight sparkle

        I recal reading of a lot of reliability problems regarding ammo and roller retarded blowback rifles.

        • Joshua Knott

          “delayed” not retarded lol although its funny. What source is this coming from?, far as i know the bundeswehr considered it the most reliable battle rifle platform, they had opportunity to use FAL’s and M14’s, you also get a harmonic advantage with less moving parts over the barrel…well really no moving parts. But i cant think of a source citing “over gassing” only because you cant really. What was the deal with the ammo, stick powder, ball??

          • Twilight sparkle

            Lol actually I’ve read the word retarded in some British sources on the delayed blowback system, I think most people have dropped it due to the negative connotations though. Most of what I read was back when I was considering a PTR 91 or cetme, I read and heard about cycling issues with certain brands of ammo, I think pmc was one and I shoot that stuff a lot. I’ve also read a lot about case head separation but that could be a combination of ammo and chamber fluting issues. On the flip side they’re supposed to be pretty accurate.

          • Joshua Knott

            kinda like our bodies if you feed it sheet you get sheet(replace e’s with i, you get it lol) Im going to do some research though, as case separation is concerned. And if its coming from Military contractors outta germany just beware the g36 nonsense, it was all in their faulty ammo, not the platform. if you wanna talk about case separation look at the FAMAS, its a freaking joke to say it nicely haha.

          • Joshua Knott

            ps. THE PC crowd can get rekt as far as I’m concerned.” Man should not fear words, but have pride made of iron to deflect such absurdities” i just said that but figured it’d be cooler with quotations

          • Stan Darsh

            I will double check, but IIRC the PTR problems of a decade ago were due to the barrel manufacturer having trouble with correct chamber dimension and chamber flute depth. The dimensional problems really showed when using lacquered steel case ammo that would get stuck and required a rod and mallet to remedy.

          • Twilight sparkle

            Well that’s interesting, I’ve never really had issues with lacquer, not like what people have claimed. I think the real issue has been just the fact that still cased ammo is dirty and expands without contracting as well as brass. The chamber issues probably just amplified the steel cases issues.

          • stfram1

            The Germans had selected the FAL (G1) as their army rifle, and went to FN to get a license to manufacture it themselves. FN refused to grant a license, so the Germans went domestic. The CETME design was licensed by HK, and the rest is history.

        • Steve_7

          But it’s not a rifle, that’s the point. It’s true you can have all kinds of weirdness happen in roller-locked rifles, which is why they fluted the chamber. The FA MAS isn’t roller-locked but has a P38 style lockup and that has a fluted chamber as well and they have occasional problems with case head separation. However these problems aren’t such an issue with lower pressure pistol calibres. Lower pressure, not a bottle-necked cartridge.

          • Twilight sparkle

            Actually the FAMAS uses a lever delayed blowback operation and it has dual extractors, I would think that lead to the numerous case head separations.

          • Steve_7

            … which is the same style of lockup that the P38 and the Beretta use. FA MAS has two teeth though rather than just one block that falls into place. It’s more complicated because it’s in a rifle but it’s the same basic principle, more or less. And it has a reversible extractor, not dual extractors. Bear in mind you’re talking to someone who used to own one, although it was awhile back.

          • Twilight sparkle

            Not really, the p38 is recoil operated more like the Johnson rifle the p38 and Johnson actually lock into place whereas the FAMAS has no real lockup.
            I know plenty of people that had m4’s and have no idea how they actually work. Are you from France or did you have one of the century imports?

            I’ve spent some time in France so I’ve seen quite a few FAMAS rifles, I don’t think I ever saw a second generation one though.

          • Steve_7

            The locking block, legs whatever you want to call them hit a pin in through the bolt carrier rather than using a plunger like the Beretta then they pivot down like the block does in a Beretta. It a very similar method of lockup imo.

            And no, this isn’t an airsoft. :p

          • Twilight sparkle

            You were really lucky to have had one of the century imports, I’ve yet to see one in person over here. It looks almost identical to the ones in France though, just no rings on the barrel.

            What you’re thinking as the locking block is the lever that delays the action, the bolt carrier should have been in two pieces of I’m not mistaken and the bottom piece held the lever while the top part was acted upon by the lever slowing the bottom half (which also is the bolt face). There’s some good info on it on the “firearmshistory blogspot” they have a webpage about the lever delayed action. Unfortunately I can’t include the link here but here’s the picture on how it works

          • Steve_7

            Oh dear you’ve just failed Small Arms Identification 101.
            To me that is a similar method of lockup to the P38, like I said it is more complicated but it’s delayed blowback with a block that tilts, so similar.

          • Twilight sparkle

            That’s a gen 2… I’m stupid when I don’t sleep… I should have looked more at the trigger area than the barrel

            I guess the lever from the FAMAS and the locking block in a p38 are similar but they perform a different function, the p38 actually locks slide and barrel together while they move backwards under recoil and they never separate until well after the bullet has cleared the barrel. The lever on the FAMAS doesn’t actually lock the bolt down it just slows down its reward movement, the FAMAS uses a true delayed blowback action where the bolt starts moving pretty much the same time the cartridge gets fired, the lever just slows things down to help most of the pressure escape the chamber, when the lever doesn’t do that properly you’ll get case head separations.

  • Dr. Longfellow Buchenrad

    If I was spending my own money Id just get a CZ Scorpion. If I was spending someone elses money Id get a Sig MPX.

    • James Young

      My thoughts exactly…

    • lowrez

      Exactly!

  • Mmmtacos

    This is definitely great, there were a few on here I was unaware of. Is there any chance of expanding the list though? It’d be nice to see this updated with more pertinent info: 3-lug adaptable? Threaded? Auto sear ready? What kind of lowers available? What kind of calibers available? Welded pic rail or claw or none? What kind of mags included? Etc.

    With or without the information, it’s still very helpful. One day I’ll own one… and on that day I will tell my friends, “Now I have a machine gun ho-ho-ho”

    • Pete M

      I’ll see if I can add a spreadsheet-type list to next week’s story. Thanks.

  • Malthrak

    Jesus…with what these cost…why wouldnt you just get a CZ Scorpion unless you’re just after an MP5 for 80’s nostalgia? For what the *cheapest* of these cost, you could get a Scorpion, pay your $200 tax stamp, buy the SBR kit, a decent optic, and extra mags…and probably pick the Scorpion up locally to boot.

    • Pete M

      As good as the CZ is, it’s not an MP5.

      • Malthrak

        Are we talking practical functionality or just subjective cool factor?

        If the latter, then sure, ok, but as for the former? I cant think if a way in which the MP5 is, objectively, a superior firearm, especially to such a degree that it would justify such a price premium for a 9mm sub gun.

        • Jesus

          The only thing I could think of is it may be a little more accurate because of the roller locked breach but practically I feel, on paper, the cz is better then it on every other way except maybe cool factor

        • Pete M

          Honestly, both. Having spent 7/8 years behind an MP5, it’s one of the nicest guns to shoot that has ever been made. Smooth. Like butter.

          • Malthrak

            Well, I guess what exactly does “smooth” entail? I mean, the CZ is dead on reliable, as accurate as you could ask of an 8″ 9mm subgun, isn’t substantially different in weight from an MP5, has far more accessory mounting options with gobs of rail space, a fantastic folding stock once SBR’d, etc.

            I dont doubt that MP5’s are awesome, I enjoyed shooting them when given the chance, I just dont see where they have any advantages in practical efficacy over substantially cheaper options.

          • Steve

            I have the CZ Scorpion and love it, but my experience has been this: it’s great if you don’t disassemble it beyond a basic field strip for cleaning. Once you start removing screws and barrel nuts, things can break, and not in a ‘just buy a new part’ way, but rather a ‘just scrap the receiver’ way.

            CZ replaced my receiver while I had a pending Form 1… while it wasn’t impossible to address the S/N change with the BATF, it wasn’t a fun process.

          • Steve

            I forgot to tie this back in to the topic – of all the sub-guns I’ve fired (both select-fire and semi), the Scorpion, Sterling, and MP5 have ‘felt’ the best. Everything else (UZI, PPSh, Grease Gun, and maybe ~10 others) always felt like the gun was 1 round shy of puking a handful of springs and other components out of the magazine well.

          • Pete M

            You definitely have a point. In which case I suggest:

            Get both.

          • Malthrak

            One fine day… 😀

    • Anon

      What I want to know is why are all of these MP5 clones so ridiculously expensive? They’re made of stamped steel, one of the cheapest manufacturing processes there is and yet, they’re all more expensive than a HK 91 clone (PTR 91), which if anything, that should be more expensive than these, since the MP5 is basically a downscaled version of that rifle.

      It’s completely ludicrous that you could get two decent stamped AKs, two HK 91 clones, or whatever for less than MP5 clones, am I the only one who notices how utterly ridiculous this is?

      • Malthrak

        No joke, and that’s the *low* end, some of these are going for ~$4K…and that’s before $200 SBR tax plus however much for the stock kit and optics and other accessories.

        I mean, I get the cool factor and pop culture value the MP5 has, and they’re fun guns…but I cannot fathom who’s buying these guns.

        • Anon

          I think that they’re either guys who either have too much money to spend, or that they think they’re getting a heirloom or something, when it’s really just a gun made of stamped steel.

          There’s a good reason some people call the Scorpion EVO the “MP5 killer”, not because it’s better shooting or smoother than a MP5 clone, it’s because it’s much more competitively priced than pretty much any MP5 clone. Oh, and while we’re talking about the EVO, it’s much simpler than a roller-delayed blowback gun, since direct blowback is about as simple as it gets, no rollers to break or whatever.

          • Pete M

            For me, the difference is the MP5 is a much better suppressor host.

            Besides, there are many guys out there that have $4k 1911’s, $4k O/U shotguns, $4k bolt guns.

          • Anon

            It’s still made by stamping steel though, and it’s not like it’s ridiculously accurized, engraved, handmade, or whatever. So in my opinion, it’s not worth so much more money for being a marginally superior suppressor host or shooting more “smoothly”, but if you disagree, that’s fine, it’s your choice, your money.

          • Pete M

            But what difference does it make how it’s made? I could make the same argument about the CZ. “It’s injection molded polymer, it should cost $300.”

          • Anon

            Yes, you could, but it’s still much cheaper than a MP5 clone, so that means it’s still much more affordable, regardless of how expensive it really should be, which is the point that I was trying to make: it’s less ridiculously expensive for what you get.

            Also, if we’re both being honest here, you could make the exact same argument for a lot of guns in general, such as Glocks, Scars, Tavors, AUGs, the list goes on for “ridiculously overpriced for how they’re made” guns.

            If you believe that a MP5 clone is worth that much, that’s fine, but I think that we may have to “agree to disagree”.

          • Pete M

            I agree with you there.

            I had a specific reason in going with the manufacturer and MP5 variant that I did. I’ll try to explain next week.

          • Anon

            Okay, I’m glad that we agree there and I’ll be on the lookout for that article next week.

          • Pete M

            Glad to hear it. Appreciate the discussion.

      • Darren Hruska

        The firearm market is just ass-backwards like that nowadays. The more compact a firearm is made, the more expensive it becomes despite there being less material used. The only logic behind such is the demand for compact firearms. So, manufacturers can get away with charging more while spending less.

        • Anon

          I’m thinking that in this case since the MP5 is a “cool” gun (showing up in a lot of movies, games, and so on), manufacturers know that people will be willing to pay ridiculous prices for them, well that, and there’s the fact that there’s not enough competition in the MP5 clone market to drive prices down (although there is a good reason that some people call the Scorpion EVO the “MP5 killer”, since it completely outclasses the MP5 clones when it comes to price).

      • BryanS

        The cast / molded trigger frame / grip isnt helping, insurance costs and cost of doing business as a gun manufacturer isnt helping.

        Most, if not all gun in the US market are way over priced in today’s market.

  • TheUnspoken

    Parabellum combat systems (PCS) Jeff Walters aka ghilliebear, mostly custom builds but seems to make whatever you want

    Atlantic recently announced a new production line for Omega (Wade Bailey) sourced by HK parts, but totally quality control guarantee by Atlantic

    Michael’s machines, mostly known for belt fed builds but I think he does mp5 models

    MAD (Moore Advanced Dynamics) also makes mp5 and roller locked guns

    Vector too.

    • Pete M

      I was going to mention Ghilliebear, because all his stuff looks awesome, but he seems low volume.

      Kelly Enterprises (listed) makes the Omega.

      Michaels Machines only does parts kits builds, but I should have listed him.

      Will check out MAD.

      Is vector still around?

      Thanks!

    • Sam Chen

      I concur with MAD 😀
      I have one of their “K” guns and love it 😀

      • Pete M

        Should should have included MAD. Apologies.

  • Matt Shermer

    Thanks for the list of American manufacturers of HK clones, given the way things have been going in Turkey and Pakistan recently, I’ve been looking more and more at American clones as opposed to clones being made in countries with either massive human rights violations (Turkey against the ethnic Kurds) or countries supporting and sheltering terrorism (Pakistan).

  • Ed

    Be just as fun for plinking to get a GSG-5 and get a full size MP-5 style semi auto.

  • maodeedee

    I don’t see the value of one of these clones as a “pistol” or an SBR. I’d rather have one with a carbine length barrel (16″) and the HK collapsible stock.

    The official HK clone isn’t even roller locked. That’s just wrong.

    • iksnilol

      Why not as an SBR? I mean, it’s made like that originally.

    • Giolli Joker

      Which is “the official HK clone”?
      The SP5K is roller delayed.

    • Some configuration of last year’s run of Atlantic clones had pinned flashhiders extending the barrel to 16 inches. I’m looking into a similar build this summer because the MP5 is my Holy Gun Grail and NFA laws suck.

      • Pete M

        Pistol. Stabilizing. Brace.

        If you refuse to go NFA.

        • I don’t want to be a test case if the brace migrates from my cheek to my shoulder. Also, braces are ugly.

          • Pete M

            I’m tracking.

          • Stan Darsh

            Technically the ATF said not to shoulder it, they never said anything about collar-boning it.

  • forrest1985

    Loved the original models but never really been a fan of the MP5K…Its wrong but visually, i actually like the look of the Highpoint carbine…but not over an MP5 (sit back down)

  • SirOliverHumperdink

    Zenith, ‘The quality goes in before the name goes on’, oh wait, they make guns?

  • Joe S

    I am the owner of Dakota Tactical and would like to thank you for the inclusion of our company in your article. Now on to business…

    There is no reason to dislike the SP5K. Take the $2,699 retail price and consider the $300 optic mount and the $500 ambidextrous trigger pack that it comes with. That nets to about $1,699 retail for the base gun not yet considering the value of the bungee sling and hard case that are also included. If you figure on average $1,300 for a replacement 3-lug barrel and mag release paddle install (parts included), you’re at approx $2999, RETAIL, for an authentic German K-gun. In my opinion, it’s the best value going.

    ~Joe

    • Pete M

      Thanks for stopping by Joe. All good points on the SP5K.

      I guess the counter point is that some people don’t want to have to make $1,300 in changes on a brand new H&K. Also, I’m guessing that demand will push these guns to sell above MSRP for at least six months.

      Side note, does Dakota build an SD variant? If not, any plans to make one?

      • Joe S

        I keep going back and forth on what the street price will actually be. In any event, you have a valid point with some people not wanting to send a brand new gun out for modifications. It is unfortunate that the German government has restricted the 3 lug barrel and paddle for commercial export. I know the folks down at HK USA sure wish they were able to include them. For someone like me, it’s exciting nonetheless to have them in the marketplace.

        Yes, we do plan on reintroducing our D54SD later this year. We are currently working on suppressor options so that we can include a suppressor with the purchase. Thank you for asking.

        ~Joe

        • Pete M

          Great info. Thank you.

  • Markius Fox

    I’d support the Pakistanis before the Turks to be honest. Seriously have a Brethren in 10mm on my wish list though.