Goodyear Fires CMP Distinguished Shooter After Fellow Shooter Visits Him At Work

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David Waters, one of the top shooters in Australian, competes regularly in high-power shooting competitions in the USA. In 2008 he became the first non-US citizen to be awarded the Distinguished Rifleman Badge by the CMP

David Waters

David Waters

A mechanical engineer by profession, he has worked for Goodyear in Australia for the past 12 years until earlier this year when he was fired.

A friend of his, an inexperienced shooter named Liz from his target shooting club, visited him at the Goodyear Corporate Headquarters. She wanted advice on how to fit an accessory to her target rifle. He had expected her to bring the accessory, but she also bought the rifle.

In the car park David told her to put the rifle, which she had removed from the car (minus the bolt and magazine), back in the car. Someone called the police after seeing her holding the rifle. Sixteen police officers arrived on the scene. The police searched the car and she was charged on a technically to do with the transport of ammunition (although the charge is likely to be dropped).

David was suspended without pay and called in a week later for a meeting with Goodyear HR. His friend, Australian Senator Leyonhjelm attended the meeting at his request. An hour later he was fired on grounds that “his conduct had significant reputational impact on the company”. Two days ago Senator Leyonhjelm made a speech recounting the events in the Australian Senate.

Goodyear Australia have managed to tarnish the international Goodyear brand over what amount to a non-event. It is my hope Goodyear HQ in Ohio take note of this incident and instruct their subsidiary to right its wrong.

Thanks to Whaleoil for information. 



Steve Johnson

Founder and Dictator-In-Chief of TFB. A passionate gun owner, a shooting enthusiast and totally tacti-uncool. Favorite first date location: any gun range. Steve can be contacted here.


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  • M.M.D.C.

    Hysteria. That’s what this is. It’s what happens when people have been taught to fear inanimate objects.

    • Esh325

      Australia is a great place to live from hearing from my friends and it isn’t any less of a place by having stricter gun laws than the USA if that’s what you’re trying to imply.

      • M.M.D.C.

        Gah!! Are you implying that I’m implying that Australia isn’t a great place to live?

        • Dan

          No he is trying to imply that the U.S. is a bunch of trigger happy hillbillies and we are inferior because the majority of us are “cowboys” rootin tootin and shootin erbody. He dislikes the freedoms we have and doesn’t believe in our rights. He embodies what the progressive agenda wants for America

          • Ed Ward

            Very well said Sir!

          • Dan

            Wonder what he thinks of those great european gun laws that prevented the seige on the concert hall in Paris, oh wait they didn’t. Guess there are crazy people everywhere.

          • Ed Ward

            Bingo! A Law abiding licensed CCW in the States at the “very least” gives innocent people a “fighting chance” instead of waiting for imminent execution like sheep…May God be with both the victims and their families.

          • Keith Melton

            Defending ones self, ones family, ones country has nothing to do with hate, but a very high form of love.

          • avlisk

            My permit is called The Second Amendment here in Arizona. I love Arizona. Perhaps this incident in Paris will move us to ending the irrationality of “soft targets”. We still have schools here with “gun-free zone” signs, advertising to the criminal loonies that they can carry out their evil without any impediment. It’s only a matter of time that it will happen again if we continue this ignorance.

          • Ed Ward

            Great State of Arizona. Now if we can protect that State along with its Neighbors from who knows what is coming up from the South, our entire Nation will be stronger.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Actually, the specter of 8 out of 10 who are law-abiding citizens, being able to carry WITHOUT ANY PERMIT–AS THE 2A PROVIDES, would give us practically a crime-free America, like they have a nearly crime-free Kennesaw, GA.

          • Dan

            We are responsible for our own safety. We wear seat belts drive safer cars have smoke alarms fire extinguishers locks on our doors etc. It would seem to me that you should also think to carry some means to protect yourself. Anything to give yourself a possible upper hand when something as simple as leaving isn’t possible. Bad people will do anything to hurt you they will find any means to give themselves the upper hand. No law will stop that. No feel good speach about the golden rule will change their mind. The framers understood that and recognized that we have that inherent right to protect ourselves and our country from those that chose to do us harm. You don’t need guns to kill alot of people. Guns are not the problem. People wanting to kill are the problem.

        • Vizzini

          Any place that denies my gun rights isn’t, by my definition, a great place to live.

      • toms

        It is less of a place for people whose major hobby is shooting, who frequent gun boards, and who would also have to surrender a great deal of their personal property to the government if they moved there. Why do you post on a firearms orientated website?

        • Esh325

          There is firearms ownership in Australia. It’s more of a place to live if you don’t want to get shot why you’re at a mall or school. Because I enjoy firearms? Maybe I don’t see gun ownership the same way most Americans see it?

          • Ask the people of Melbourne about that which has experienced a dramatic rise in gun crime despite stringent gun laws.

          • Esh325

            Could you cite the source for this?

          • Mark

            Australia’s Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research http://www.bocsar.nsw.gov.au

          • Esh325

            I don’t see what you are talking about on the site.

          • Mark

            In providing two extensive reviews, I have done my duty to expose the flaws in your CDC “statistics.” If you want to criticize the widely-reported Australian BCSR stats showing an increase in violence, including homicide (except for a tiny one year dip), you will have to do your own homework. I am not going to change your diaper or do your homework. Get busy.

          • JK

            Mall and school shootings? Well, if we’re talking about statistically rare events, I don’t want to find poisonous snakes in my pantry, and I want the right to kill any poisonous snakes on my property.

          • Esh325

            Not to mention, just mass shootings, but being killed or injured by a gun period.

          • Cynic

            If you aren’t involved with the drugs trade, related to or involved with someone in the drugs trade and aren’t involved in violent crime (Including burglary and muggings)

            Then generally you aren’t at risk in the us, strangely enough if we remove 6% of the population of the us from the equation the gun death rate drops to much less than Australia.

            Stay away from drugs, gangs and the ‘ghetto’ to use a term glamorised by the culture in question and you will be fine

          • Esh325
          • SP mclaughlin

            Just saying but I’ve never been shot at any school or mall I’ve been in my 19 years in the USA.

          • Esh325

            You could be shot up anywhere in the world at a mall or school as guns exist and aren’t going anywhere, but your chances of being shot up at a mall or school in the USA are much greater than some where like Australia because of how many guns you have and the loose regulation.

          • Mark

            Reminiscent of Tim Lambert—you make category errors and meaningless cross-cultural comparisons.

            If you honestly want assess the benefit of gun bans, you need to look at before and after the gun ban. Many have done that with the Australian data and, as so many have documented, violence, including murder and rape, INCREASED. That observation is all the more striking because Australia is geographically isolated.

            Another striking observation, while violence was increasing in the gun ban paradise of Australia, the swimming-in-guns USA was seeing its rates of violence, including murder, cut in half.

          • Esh325

            You’re either lying,brainwashed, or just ignorant to say that the Australian gun ban increased murders because that’s factually untrue. “Furthermore, murders using firearms have declined even more sharply than murders in general since the 1996 gun law. In the seven years prior to 1997, firearms were used in 24 percent of all Australian homicides. But most recently, firearms were used in only 11 percent of Australian homicides, according to figures for the 12 months ending July 1, 2007. That’s a decline of more than half since enactment of the gun law to which this message refers.”

            http://www.factcheck.org/2009/05/gun-control-in-australia/

          • Mark

            Ah… so now you add “bait and switch” (substituting “gun deaths” as though non-gun deaths are irrelevant) to your other deceits. Here’s your indictment. You have used:
            straw men
            non-sequiturs
            emotionalism
            neologism
            personal attacks
            bait and switch
            illogic
            gratuitous assertions

            What deceit won’t you use?

          • Esh325

            You aren’t really even making any sense. It’s like you just bashed your head on the keyboard to come up with that. Well we are talking about guns here. That is the original discussion. Just because we focus on gun deaths doesn’t mean we are saying other deaths don’t matter like seem to think. Talk about illogical on your part.

          • Mark

            •straw man—when you inferred that Cymond said “suicide gun deaths don’t count.”
            •non-sequiturs—your conflation of legal ownership and illegal access and your buy-an-AK47-in-Africa conclusion
            •emotionalism—your “get shot at the mall” hysteria
            •neologism—your aberrant definition of “tyranny”
            •personal attacks—your innuendo about Suter’s denial about NRA funding and your “probably tell them to buy a gun” remark
            •bait and switch—your substitution of “gun deaths” in a discussion of total deaths
            •illogic—your irrelevant citation of “factcheck”
            •gratuitous assertions—your insistence without evidence that gun bans reduce violence

          • wzrd1

            Didn’t you just bait and switch with the “gratuitous assertions” claim when one is discussing firearms related deaths and you include *all* violence, rather than perhaps, firearm related violence?
            When you call someone out for something, it’s always good to be on guard against accidentally doing just what one is calling the other out on. Got bit in the ass doing that very thing myself once.

          • Mark

            No, not bait and switch. From the very beginning almost every poster pointed out that, because of “method substitution,” Esh’s factoids did not address what is meaningful, total deaths, total violence. I, like the others, simply returned the discussion to stay on point. For example, I could have pointed out that the knife homicide rate skyrocketed in Australlia after the gun ban. Since a death by stabbing is not any more morally correct than a death by stabbing, I did not waste time on the observation. What really makes an impact in public policy are measures that reduce ALL murders and other violence.

          • AR-PRO

            Brilliant comment!

          • Mark

            Thank you.

          • gunsandrockets

            Fun fact: there have been more mass murders in Australia after 1996 (when many guns were banned), then the number of mass murders before 1989.

          • Mark

            A less fun fact: US police killed more people last year than were killed in ALL the sensationalized US mass murders. In the face of falling violence, falling gun violence, and a murder rate half of what it was, we have been subjected to increased and hysterical mass media reporting. Shall we ban corporate media?

          • Dan

            Ban corporate media you say? Hmmmmm………………..there has to be a downside to that but I just don’t see it. Lol

          • LeslieFish

            Amazing! Just how are those mass murders done? Illegal guns? Bombs? Arson?

          • gunsandrockets

            In one case 8 with knives, in another case 15 with arson. People are fragile.

          • Jim_Macklin

            Taking guns away from potential victims means that social predators can and will murder more victims.

          • Mark

            In the 20th century, NOT including war, governments killed about 1/3 BILLION of their own citizens. Government murder dwarfs all private violence. Since they are the worst mass murderers, governments are he ones least deserving of a monopoly on weapons.

          • MichaelZWilliamson

            Well, I know I for one would feel a lot better about having my brains bashed in rather than being shot. That would make all the difference.

          • john396

            LoL that’s like comparing surfing deaths in Hawaii to surfing deaths in Arizona.
            You use the classic “GUN” deaths to cover the actual crime stats, just as our anti-gunners do.

            Why would a crook have to shoot a unarmed person? Your laws just made them helpless, unless your claiming that ALL the criminals turned in their guns too? LoL

          • AR-PRO

            It’s funny how you point out that murders with firearms (not just murders-they have increased substantially) have decreased to 11% of homicides since the gun ban, how can that be? The guns you speak of have been banned! You make yourself look like a child when you change the term “murders” to “gun related” murders. You obviously need a nap some vegimite and the ability to make intelligent remarks. You shouldn’t comment on the benefits of being free because you never have been. 300 million firearms hurt no one last night. I’ll be on the range all day today teaching Americans how to exercise their 2nd Amendment rights, not thinking of this conversation at all.

          • wzrd1

            When people speak of any form of gun control, they must differentiate between murders committed with other weapons vs murders committed with firearms. That is just common sense.

            Now, excuse me, I have to go pick up some tapered pins to replace the LP gas block with a LP rail block that I picked up.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Aussie Aus-hole: I think you want a total gun-free society where NOBODY ever gets shot, like Soviet Union and Nazi Germany. Oh WAIT–they hade over 30 Million and 6 Million killed there because of a defenseless victim society!

          • cawpin

            Violent crime sharply increased after your ban. It has now dropped back to just under its pre-ban level.

          • Daniel F. Melton

            People that rely on factcheck should not post on forums that will expose the truth.

          • LeslieFish

            Yes, yes, *gun* murders have declined — but what about murders with *other* objects? Why is it somehow better to be killed with a blade, a bludgeon, or bare hands than to be killed with a firearm? Dead is dead, and murdered is murdered.

          • Dixie Shooter

            Which is worse, being shot, stabbed, or beat to death with a claw hammer?

          • Cynic

            He hasn’t said the ban increased murders, just pointing out that since the ban the murder rate went up whereas in the us which has had an increase in access to concealed carry permits across the states the murder rate has dropped.

            Correlation isn’t causation. What he’s saying is that the mere presence of legally owned guns isn’t having an affect on the crime rate

          • drone

            You chance of being poisoned or eaten by some kind of weird animal is greater in Australia but it’s as rare an occurrence as shootings in the US so you don’t think about it too much.

          • SP mclaughlin

            That’s like saying you are more likely to be bombed in a mall or school in Europe because of how many immigrants you host and loose regulation.

          • john396

            The reason your more likely to be shot at a school or mall here is that they keep these places a “No Gun Zone”, so that is where the nuts go to try to kill unarmed people.
            Yes, we have a lot of guns, but I live in a state that does NOT have loose regulations, (you can’t even legally TOUCH a gun without a FOID card here), but still has some of the highest murder rates. Even though overall violent crime has been cut in half as state after state has passed concealed carry laws.
            Of course we have our Government LETTING illegal weapons
            on the streets in our country, as in the Fast & Furious scandal. Plus
            having our Government shipping out tons of automatic weapons, that they would
            never allow us to own, to end up in our enemy’s hands. Hard to say how many people have been killed over that!
            Wouldn’t surprise me a bit to learn that the Paris attack had our weapons used in it.
            Our country is great too, but you don’t want to confuse that with our Government, which is a necessary evil that needs to be on a short leash….unfortunately it is out of control of the people of the USA…and is being controlled by big money.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            You mean the loose regulations on CRIMINALS, giving them free turkey-shoots at defenseless children in the Gun-Free Victim Zones.

          • Rodney Steward

            U sick puppy!

          • cawpin

            This is a fallacy. Gun laws don’t affect criminals. So our “loose” gun laws have no affect on them.

          • David Emanuel

            you absolutely dont get it, do you? the ability to protect ones self from unlawful gun owners is what a free country is all about. do you really believe there are no illegal guns in Australia just because they are socialist? just wait till isis targets Australia and you have no defense. Mexican cartel’s control Mexico because citizens are unarmed and the police can’t protect them, the government has to negotiate with them. making guns illegal to law abiding citizens just makes for easy domination by those who don’t have any concern for any laws. probably no drugs in Australia either either, right, because they are also illegal. as was stated in the US many years ago, “when guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns”. let’s just outlaw autos also, they kill way more of our citizens than guns do.

          • LeslieFish

            How good are your chances of being stabbed or bludgeoned?

          • Cobranut

            Sorry, but you’re DEAD WRONG!!!
            Virtually ALL the mass shootings in recent years have been in “gun-free zones”, where guns are BANNED!!!
            Trouble is, CRIMINALS DO NOT OBEY LAWS, so these bans only ensure a target-rich environment filled with defenseless victims.

            I choose not to do business with places that support these policies. I will not be denied my right to defend myself or my family. I carry daily and suggest that all law-abiding citizens do the same. Let’s make a life of crime dangerous FOR THE CRIMINAL!!!

          • Miguel Raton

            Our chances of being shot up at a mall or school here in the US are much greater than AUS not because of how many guns we have but because a decent mall or school here have populations as large as some of your cities. There’s simply a higher density of crazies here. But they don’t need guns: the highest body count at a school here in the U.S. happened back in the ’20s iirc. No firearm present or necessary. Seriously, you’re focused on the wrong thing. Instead of punishing all the law-abiding gun owners after the Port Arthur massacre, Australia would have been better off incarcerating all of its crazies “for their own protection.” It would have had a more useful effect than the 300% increase in homicides in Victoria after your gun ban went into effect… [real stats, not your make-believe stuff.]

          • Randy

            No, you stand a higher chance of getting shot at a school or mall because feel good idiots like yourself have helped change these places into gun free zones, which let the crazies with guns know they can shoot there the best.

          • Doug_723

            Just like I’ve never been shot (or even shot at) in any of my 52 years living in the USA.

          • Daniel F. Melton

            And carrying a fire extinguisher is a waste of time too, unless you’ve already had a fire. (sarc)
            I carry a handgun for the same reason I have a fire extinguisher, it’s much better to have and not need than to need and not have.

          • disqus_f62emCdwDh

            Or my fifty-seven, 42 of which were in Los Angeles.

          • Doug_723

            I’m sorry for your bad luck at living in LA, you have been able to leave the Peoples’ Republic of Kalifornia, haven’t you?

          • disqus_f62emCdwDh

            Doug, even as a teen I saw the sea changes occurring there in the early 1970s. The “coarsening of society,” loss of courtesy and manners, including driving cars, the huge increase in population, loss of any remnant of the mostly agrarian areas in the San Fernando Valley.
            I am now in the “People’s Replublik of Eugene” in Oregon, which as you may know, is endemic to most all of the cities west of the mountains along the coast. It isn’t much better than L.A., though for the moment we do have more level-headed people and haven’t been taken over demographically…yet.
            Somehow though, all those years in L.A., no issues with firearms and I…go figure. I simply didn’t travel to areas of that megapolis where they were used constantly by the drug gangs.

          • William Dinwiddie

            here here I live in springfield most liberal idiots in Eugene do not realise Oregon is an open carry state, but if the liberals in salem have their way Oregon will be the next kommiefornia. remember the slogan donot californicate Oregon during the 70s.

          • William Burke

            It’s a great idea, for sure.

            I have lived most of my life in Virginia, five years or so in New Mexico, both gun-friendly states. I once lived in Maryland for about 6-7 months. Not only is that shithole gun- hostile, you can’t even buy beer in supermarkets there!

          • Doug_723

            Likewise, I’ve lived in Virginia from 14 (1978) to now (52), except for the time my wife and I lived in Germantown from ’97 to ’02 for her job (5 of the longest years of my life). Bought a S & W .45 auto from Sports Authority in Gaithersburg, had to be escorted to my truck by the manager with my new firearm purchase (now mind you, NO ammo, factory trigger lock still in place), but still had to be escorted out of the store.

          • William Burke

            Almost 68 here. No one has ever shot ME.

          • David Hawk

            That’s likely because you aren’t a black or hispanic drug dealer and don’t list “hoodlum” as your occupation on government forms? 🙂

          • Doug_723

            Not only those, but I don’t go out at night running around the low rent side of town trying to score.

          • BigR

            I’ve been in the USA all my life and in 77 years, I haven’t been shot at once!

          • Daniel F. Melton

            You’ve never heard of the “Unmentionable Law”? As soon as ya start talking about something, if it’s bad, it happens. If it’s good it goes away.

          • Dan Moore

            I have, and it hurts like hell.

          • toms

            I don’t consider the right to own a bolt action rifle or trap gun much of a right at all. Its better than nothing I guess, but still why do you post on this website? I worry more about people with your mentality than I do about getting shot at a school. I’m not one to live in fear of what might happen.

          • Esh325

            I wonder back in the USA when the only guns available that were bolt actions did they think they had no rights back then? I wonder did they think, gee I wish I had something that was deadlier.

          • Mark

            When the leviathan state determines what privileges they will deign to confer or not, there is no right at all—only tyranny.

          • Esh325

            Tyranny to me is when a mentally deranged kid is able to legally buy an AR15 and as many rounds of ammo as he wants, and then go shoot up 20 people at a movie theater.

          • Mark

            Professionally we call your definition a “neologism.”

          • Esh325

            I would feel sorry for any of your patients. You would probably tell them to buy a gun.

          • Mark

            That is a professional “boundary violation.” Please do not project your lack of ethics on us.

            As I said, you are so lacking in evidence and logic that you are reduced to neologisms, hysteria, and personal attacks.

          • Esh325

            You didn’t prove me wrong on the simpleton part as you were toting the lie that murders increased after the Australian gun ban even when the facts show otherwise.

          • Mark

            Don’t be dyslexic—I said there was a brief dip and then rates rose.

          • Esh325

            “Have murders increased since the gun law change, as claimed? Actually, Australian crime statistics show a marked decrease in homicides since the gun law change. According to the Australian Institute of Criminology, a government agency, the number of homicides in Australia did increase slightly in 1997 and peaked in 1999, but has since declined to the lowest number on record in 2007, the most recent year for which official figures are available.”

          • Mark

            As I acknowledged, population-adjusted homicide rates in Australia dipped briefly following the ban, specifically in 96/97 and 97/98 and then rose again until 2001. How do you explain the rise following the ban?

            If you extend the data to 2012, Australian homicide rates have dropped 10% from pre-ban levels, but the USA homicide rate has dropped 50% in that same time period.

            I fail to see support for a gun ban in any of that.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Mark–lets just hope he never sneaks into America and tries to get into politics here, like the Aus-hole from Kenya did!

          • Mark

            Truly!

          • Boo

            ‘Since’ the changes in law. Don’t mention that they were falling prior to the laws being introduced. And that this is not unique to Australia. This is a great thing. We should figure out what caused this and do more of it. If we don’t we could end up with a suicide rate like Japan (very few civilian guns and a bad place to drive trains) or have a violent homicide rate like the former USSR (again, few guns and a crap place to live).

          • Mark

            After parsing the data for decades, I think the best correlation of violence rates is the percentage of the population in the 19-25 year old age cohort. Naturally the baseline varies from culture to culture.

          • Boo

            And the vast majority of the violence is related to crime. And so on. When the silliness with stats doesn’t play out so well they’ll drag out a victim of crime as a human shield, the ‘call to emotion’. It’s a circus, it’s diverting limited public funds away from where they will do the most good. Better to feel good i guess?

          • Mark

            I believe that gun ban “command and control” is fully committed to control, not safety. As for the useful idiots, there are many who are content grazing in their illogic, emotionalism, and self-deceit.

          • M40

            The Russian stats aren’t hard to figure out… few guns, but a crap place to live… AND a place where vodka flows like water and half the population is piss drunk on a daily basis.

          • wzrd1

            Interesting, that “Half the population is piss drunk on a daily basis” sounds a lot like where I’m at in Louisiana.
            At least, that’s to judge by how they’re driving. The same was true in Maryland, where I had to avoid Harvey Wallbanger on a nightly basis coming home from work.

          • M40

            Did I say ‘half’? Silly me… I meant to say MOST. It’s a serious problem in many areas of Russia.

          • wzrd1

            Well, it does get pretty dreadfully cold, they do need their antifreeze. 😉

          • john396

            And during all these times your posting gun ownership numbers never changed?
            Because I have heard that ownership of guns is back up to pre-ban levels. True?

          • Lou

            Esh- When Stalin took all the guns away from the people of Russia, domestic violence went DOWN. But people then died in the 10’s of millions from government violence. They were forced to go into battle even without having been given a rifle sometimes. They were told to pick up a rifle from the first dead man they seen.
            Stalin told Churchill that the violence of the war with the people of Russia, to take away their land and weapons, made WW2 look small.
            You obviously are what Lenin called, one of the useful idiots that helped the communists take over Russia and then were later eliminated by the communists.

          • BigR

            @esh325:disqus
            Do you think we really give a s**t about your opinion or Australia?

          • Vizzini

            What’s wrong with telling people to buy a gun?

          • Mark

            It would be considered a “boundary violation” for a physician to use his imbalance of power in the patient-doctor relationship to make either a buy-a-gun or don’t-buy-a-gun advice.

            Doctors for Responsible Gun Ownership (DRGO) was the first professional organization to publish on those medical ethics.

          • Vizzini

            Kids can’t legally buy guns in the U.S. You have to be an adult to buy a gun.

            Such sensationalized events make a statistically negligible contribution to the U.S. murder rate. Most murders in the U.S. are black-on-black and gang and/or drug trade related.

          • Jim_Macklin

            Mentally deranged and kids cannot LEGALLY buy any gun, be it a .22 single shot or an AR. But it is true that anybody who wants to break the law can do so.
            Murders happened for thousands of years before the first gun was invented. People started carrying guns for protection from knives.

          • M40

            Gosh Jim… are you implying that criminals (by definition) might refuse to follow the approximately 20,000 gun laws we’ve already written? Well maybe twenty-thousand and ONE gun laws will be enough to intimidate them into becoming law-abiding citizens!

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Aussie–don’t be an Aus-hole. No mentally deranged kid ever BOUGHT a gun–they STOLE them–they’re CRIMINALS! I guess your Aussieland Ut-opiate doesn’t have criminals.

          • BigR

            @disqus_6eatjFPe9s:disqus
            I wish I had said that!

          • Mark

            🙂

          • mosinman

            there was a time when the citizens actually owned better or equivalent compared to our the Army ( American revolutionary war)

          • Vizzini

            When someone was in a gunfight, and outnumbered and outgunned, yes, they did wish for something deadlier. That’s why detachable-magazine, semi-auto firearms were invented.

          • claymore

            There has never been a time when ONLY bot action firearms were available here. And we like it that way.

          • Dan

            Deadlier? A semi auto is somehow deadlier than a bolt action? And yes they did think something like that. They said gee i wish i had a way to shoot more bullets faster.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Hardly–because at the time when WE THE PEOPLE had only BA’s, the potential tyrants had only BA’s!

          • Y-man

            Wow. I WISH and PRAY for the day I will have the right to own a Bolt Action Rifle, even a .22 bolt action. ONE DAY!

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Y-MAN, you must be from the Aussieland Facist Paridise!

          • Y-man

            Colonel, I am in WORSE! I am in N*****a [West Africa]! Hell, my comment above is WRONG – I WISH with ALL my Heart that I can even own a .22 SINGLE-SHOT rifle! Or even a 9mm single shot! Thats how bad it is here.

          • gunsandrockets

            How many other employers in Australia are like Goodyear? Live in Australia? As a gun owner? No thanks.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            I wouldn’t live in the Aussieland Utopiate with or WITHOUT a gun. I’d rather live in Somalia!

          • Goody

            You’re seeing it wrong, bud. Every Aussie shooter knows that if they were in the Lindt Cafe with a g43 things would’ve been different. At least, every Aussie shooter with a back bone.

          • MichaelZWilliamson

            Just like France and Norway?

          • AR-PRO

            I would bet people who live in Paris said the same thing before the shooting at the newspaper headquarters, and now with the horrible terrorist act. God bless the victims of this cowardly attack. I’ll stay in the greatest country in the world, the USA! I’ll also enjoy all the freedom that our Constitution guarantee me, unlike places like Australia. I also sleep well knowing I can protect myself and my family if need be, unlike, well, you know. Lol.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Tell me, Aussie NoGun, what brilliant law have your body-guarded rulers come up with to make CRIMINALS willingly lay down their gun? The same gun laws they have in Chicago and Detroit?

          • BigR

            @esh325:disqus
            Sounds like living in France! You remember Paris, don’t you?

          • Dan Moore

            You will think of firearms in a different light when the muslim population becomes too great and the massacres in Australia mimic the ones in Paris yesterday.

          • LeslieFish

            So very few people in Australia die of gunshots. Fine. What other objects are they killed by, and in what numbers? What’s the actual violent-crime rate and homicide rate? Note that, according to the WHO, there are 107 countries which have higher homicide rates than the US, and every last one of them has stricter gun-control laws, if not outright bans. Lack of civilian firearms doesn’t mean civil peace.

          • William Burke

            But you and dozens of others could be run down by a psycho behind the wheel of a car or truck, right? When are you going to ban motor vehicles, hammers, pools and staircases, all of which take more lives than guns?

          • LeslieFish

            Since 1950, in the US, all but *two* mass-shootings were done in “gun-free” zones — which are mostly schools. The last shopping-mall shooting I heard of here was actually done in a movie theater, which — yes — was a posted “gun-free” zone.

            The solution is obvious; to prevent mass-shootings, we must abolish gun-free zones.

          • Louis Chapman

            you’ll just get shot by jihadis in a coffee shop, right?

        • smartacus

          Australia is one of the WORST places to live, regardless of how they spin it. Even the most dedicated anti-gun loon would become infuriated at the openly legalized hostility, sexism, and lack of equal human rights thanks to their Feminist controlled society down there.

          They basically hold rallies demanding legalization of murder by females because they already get far far less conviction rates for female committed murders, and far less sentencing for those convictions that stick.

          Australia is not much better than living under the ISIS banner, regardless of how anyone tries to lie about

          • LeslieFish

            This sounds as if you had a specific incident in mind. Care to tell the rest of us about it?

          • smartacus

            And their anti-hooning laws ALSO help Australia be one of the WORST places to live. Even Lewis Hamilton the 3-time World Champion Driver was cited for hooning because he did a burnout. OMG he must be punished to protect all the children.

          • William Burke

            WTF is “Hooning”?

          • Miguel Raton

            Tearing about on the road in a car. The sort of stuff you would get a citation for “exhibition of speed” here in the States.

          • LeslieFish

            Don’t they have any proper car-racetracks in Australia? We’ve got them all over the place. Anybody who wants to tear around in a car can legally do it there. Is there some sort of appeal to doing it on a public road?

      • billyoblivion

        I lived there for 2 years, and while it’s a wonderful place filled with decent blokes, yeah, it is a less of a place because I don’t enjoy the same rights there that I do here in the US.

        • Esh325

          What other “rights” besides being able to more easily acquire a variety guns in the USA (You can own a gun in Australia) do you have not have in Australia? It’s interesting in the USA everybody talks about the rights of people who are armed, but they never talk about the rights of people not to become victims who end up dead or maimed because of a gun.

          • Mark

            Australia prosecutes politically incorrect historians and others under their “hate speech” laws.

          • HKGuns

            Go away. You somehow stumbled upon the wrong site.

          • marathag

            Can’t own a semi-auto shotgun, for starters.

            Or even got all worked up over a 7 round, lever action shotgun being too powerful to be imported.

          • Esh325

            And in the USA most people don’t have machine guns or grenade launchers,grenades, and mortars. In some African countries you can easily get a fully automatic AK-47. So using how easily you can get guns and what type of guns you can get is not really a good yardstck for “freedom”.

          • Mark

            You attempt to conflate legal ownership and illegal access.

            I infer that Australians have ready access to blanks because you are shooting nothing but blanks in your visit here.

          • Vizzini

            Actually, many people in the U.S. have machine guns. There’s a rather silly law on the books that they have to have been registered prior to 1986, and you have to have a federal permit, but I was just shooting at the range the other day right next to a guy with a full-auto M-16.

            It could be that there’s more than just one thing that represents freedom, and the U.S. has very many of those things.

            On the hierarchy of freedoms, free speech and the right to keep and bear arms rank very highly, and the U.S. is better than Australia on both counts.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            The 2nd Amendment Right to Keep and BEAR Arms is the ONLY God-given right that guarantees all the other God-given rights. Citizens–oops– SUBJECTS of the Aussieland Utopiate have their “rights” given by some king or queen or some other self-important autocrat. And the “ruler” can take them away just as quickly. God does not take away His GOD-GIVEN RIGHTS. And no king Obuma is going to take them away either! We can only feel sorry that the Aussie didn’t have the balls to break away from the tyrants.

          • billyoblivion

            Your notion of “rights” is utterly ass backwards.

            You do not have a “right” not to be a victim[1], you have a right to resist being made a victim as forcefully as need be, and you have a right, and in some ways and cases an obligation to take steps not to be a victim, but you have no right to *be* safe.

            Here’s the thing, in America you have the right to resist being victimized, and you have the right to the tools to do that.

            In Australia you *do not*. If you keep a cricket bat by your bed you’d best have it on top of a pile of flannels if someone breaks in and you use it on them.

            In most of the US I can take whatever means I feel justified in taking to stop someone from hurting me, people I am responsible for, or others. I do not have to wait for them to escalate. If you give me reason to be in fear of death or serious bodily injury I can shoot you where you stand[1]. In Australia I was required to risk bodily harm because I could *NOT* use overwhelming force.

            To make myself clear–Australian law **REQUIRED** that if someone decided to kick my ass just because they felt like a punch up and I happened to be there, that the most I could respond with was fists and feet, putting me at risk–even if I won–of pain and injury. Here in Colorado I *would* shoot them if they hit me for no discernable reason, and I’d stand a good chance of not going to jail for it.

            I had 2 *barely* teenagers break into our house while we were in Australia. One of them assaulted (not rape, just hit) my wife. That is significantly more likely to happen Australia than in the US. By like an order of magnitude.

            Where is my wife’s right not to be victimized because the state leaves us legally helpless against the very criminals it creates with it’s social programs? (Yes, two aboriginal boys whose parents were drunk or in prison were the perpetrators).

            Also you utterly fail to understand the demographics of gun violence in the US. Which is understandable because it’s a toxic subject. A significant portion of the murders (somewhere north of 70%) in the US are committed by people who *already* are not allowed to own guns, and if you take the most dangerous cities/counties/zipcodes out of the mix (and do so for almost any European country or Australia) murder and gun violence rates get REALLY close.

            But no one wants to talk about the toxic inner city culture we have here, and we just pretend you’re as likely to die by gun violence if you’re in the middle class hanging out in Ogden Utah as you are if you’re at Kedzie and Lake Street in Chicago, Illinois.

          • Mark

            Indeed, one of the taboos in the gun debate is to notice that about 2/3rds of US homicide “victims” are murdered by their competitors in the illegal drug trade. Such are those that the CDC insisted on calling “friends and family” simply because the drug dealers knew each other.

          • nadnerbus

            “because of a gun.”

            Not because of the person that used the gun to murder them?

            This is where the basic difference of opinion comes from most of the time I think. Pro gun people just don’t accept that availability of guns drives up murder rates. And there is a lot of anecdotal and statistical evidence, as well as cultural comparisons to back that up.

            Guns are every bit as available in my suburban town as anywhere else in the US, and there have been two gun deaths there in the last ten or 15 years, both shot by the police (one was mentally unstable and came at the cop with a knife, the other I don’t recall the particulars, but let’s just say that one had a gun).

            From what I have seen of gun statistics in Australia, the ban had a negligible effect. Australia is just not as violent a nation as the US is, and has pretty much always been that way. As far as not having a mass shooting, neither has New Zealand, and they don’t have your gun laws.

            People outside of the US have this media painted image that we are all ducking behind our fireplaces at night to hide from the random gunfire. It just isn’t the case for the vast majority of the country, and in the few places where it is bad, it is extreme poverty, toxic race relations, and drug/gang wars that drive it. The guns are just the device used. Count yourself lucky that Oz doesn’t seem to have that same mix in the quantities the US does, because I would bet hard money that if you did, you’d see gun violence go up in a hurry.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            All the Aussies are ACCUSTOMED to being watched over by “authorized” people with guns, while not being able to have one themselves. After all–they are all descendants of prison colony inmates. Give them a little break, Bloke—it’s in their genes!

          • Vizzini

            Australia also has weak free speech rights compared to the U.S. There are no “hate speech” laws in the U.S. Andrew Bolt was recently convicted there for speech that would have been Constitutionally protected in the U.S.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Tell that to all the victims in the Gun-Free Victim Zone massacres!

      • Ed Ward

        Yes it is a “lesser place” by having “stricter gun laws” precisely because that eliminates my Rights under both God and Our Constitution, namely, the right to “Life” just to name one among many. If Australia Strips its Citizens of the RIGHT to defend their respective lives it’s categorically a lesser place by virtue…

        • Secundius

          @ Ed Ward.

          And just EXACTLY, where does “Right to Life” include owning a Firearm. I don’t recall seeing that in Either the US Constitution or the Bill of Rights…

          • Daniel F. Melton

            ***And just EXACTLY, where does “Right to Life” include owning a Firearm. I don’t recall seeing that in Either the US Constitution or the Bill of Rights.***

            In case you are totally ignorant of the United States Constitution, the Second Amendment states: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

          • Secundius

            @ Daniel F. Melton.

            The Question was “RIGHT OF LIFE”, WHERE DOES THE NEED TO GUN OWNERSHIP FIT IN THAT STATEMENT…

          • Daniel F. Melton

            You really need some help with your sentence composition.

          • Mark

            Don’t be dense. Preserving life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are integral to one’s rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. A right is infringed when the means to effectively enforce the right are prohibited.

          • COL Bull-sigh

            Danny boy–you really don’t know the correlation of “right to life” and the right to keep and bear arms??? You are such a pansie, you would use the gun in your hand to shoot Stalin if he was raping your 3 year-old daughter.

          • Daniel F. Melton

            ***Danny boy–you really don’t know the correlation of “right to life” and the right to keep and bear arms?***
            The “right to life” stops when ya happen to egregiously offend those who have the means to end your existence.
            “He needed killin'” was once considered a valid defense against criminal charges in Texas. Perhaps that should be reinstated.

            “An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back his acts with his life.” ~Robert A Heinlein

            ***You are such a pansie, you would use the gun in your hand to shoot Stalin if he was raping your 3 year-old daughter.***
            That statement is as nonsensical as it is incorrect.

          • Vizzini

            Seriously? Daniel F. Melton answers, but I’m still just agog at this comment.

          • Ed Ward

            Are you “down under” or State-Side? Please don’t tell me you’re an American as the Second Amendment to The Bill of Rights clears states in clear English: “The right of the people to keep and bear “ARMS” shall not be infringed.”

            Wow…

          • Secundius

            @ Ed Ward.

            The Disqualification Act of 1787, can SUSPEND the Bill of Rights. For an Indefinite Period of Time, First Used by President George Washington in 1787 to 1789 in the Shays’ Rebellion of 1787…

      • Keith Melton

        Australia, a great place to die a victim.

      • Living in some jails can be pretty nice, until the jailer comes in with a weapon to rape you.

      • albaby2

        I’ll be looking for your comments when ISIS hits Australia like they did France.

      • William Burke

        Please move there ASAP.

    • avlisk

      I must remember to not buy Goodyear products in the future. Their hysteria and ignorance was fine until they cruise into the territory of irrationality that destroys innocent lives and increases our lack of safety in an increasingly dangerous world. No more “soft targets”.

      • Sgt. Stedenko

        Bridgestone and Continental make better tires, anyway.

      • Mustascheo

        Their tires suck anyway…..

      • William Burke

        This was Goodyear Australia. They do not take any direct policy orders from Goodyear in the USA.

        And It’s sad to see, but complacent, go-along-to-get-along Aussies allowed evil politicians to disarm them, in the name of (I know this sounds wacko) SAFETY and “FREEDOM FROM FEAR”.

        It’s harder to imagine folks signing up for disarmament of themselves and not the police or military; it requires a childish level of trust.

        • Cal

          Doesn’t matter, they are a world corporation and if we ALLboybcott them worldwide it will hurt them.

    • Miguel Raton

      While that would be the best way for Goodyear USA to spin the actions of their Australian counterpart, it may not be practical or possible for Mr. Waters to accept, given familial obligations, US immigration & employment policies, etc. Who knows? He may really enjoy culling ‘roos, and you can’t do that anywhere else in the world but Oz…

  • Chris

    “Firearms Not Politics”

    • Vitsuas

      Only applies to us peasants who post in the comments section.

      • MR

        Either way, it holds about as much sway as “shall not be infringed”, or “innocent until proven guilty”.

        • abecido

          Firearms are an inherently political subject.

          • milesfortis

            Firearms are only a ‘political subject’ because those with the totalitarian bent, and their lackeys, are quite concerned that, one day, the people they despise; the “unwashed masses” will get sick and tired enough of them and solve the problem.

    • hardly political, it has everything to do with company policies, not laws.

      • The Forty ‘Twa

        I’m not really so sure this is a cast iron case of discrimination against a shooter. Like I mentioned previously, being involved in something that leads to the police being called to your place of work is enough to get you fired in some places even if there wasn’t a firearm involved.

    • Hint it’s not political. It’s about unreasonable fear and corporate management who are scared a Prius owners won’t buy Goodyear tires. It’s also about a lack of common sense.

    • Rock or Something

      *rolls eyes

      “Man is by nature a political animal.” -Aristotle

    • Flintlok

      I guess there’s no Goodyear tires in my future………

    • Twilight sparkle

      Sometimes the two meet while crossing the street. This happens to be politics regarding firearms, good enough for me, you can always skip to another post if you like

  • Harrison Jones

    I thought this would be the best thing to ever happen to the guy as if he’s a good worker it could give him a lot of opportunities to work in the firearms industry then I saw it happened in Australia. Hopefully things work out for him!

    • 6.5x55Swedish

      Maybe he moves to the US.

      • Harrison Jones

        A possibility but having a cousin that currently works in Australia and having other relatives that used to it is difficult to live halfway around the world from what you know.

        • billyoblivion

          Depends on how well you get on with your relatives, now don’t it?

  • Esh325

    She should have had better sense I think not to bring the rifle there, but firing him obviously is not warranted at all.

    • TheNotoriousIUD

      Yeah his friend sounds like an idiot.
      Bring a weapon on the property of any large company and youre gonna get canned.

  • Don Ward

    I have worked at jobs where I signed an agreement not to bring a firearm into the office or even the parking lot with the expectation that I’d be fired if I do so. I suspect the individual in question did the same.

    • 6.5x55Swedish

      But he dind’t bring a firearm to the car park..

    • EmptyJay

      Except he didn’t. It was not his firearm, but that of a visitor. He had no knowledge of it beforehand.

      • Don Ward

        I’m not saying this was a good decision. The TFB article seems to be leaving out a lot of key information and I would hesitate to make too many assumptions. At initial blush, it seems like the individual was seen – or was perceived to be handling a firearm in the parking lot which violates a lot of the nanny agreements that grown-ups have to sign these days for Human Resources to hire you. As a gun owner you have to be smart these days and going out to the parking lot to talk guns on your lunch break puts yourself at greater risk to the sort of folks who have nothing better to do than make your life miserable.

    • Bursar

      This is not generally written in to Australian employments contracts. What he does have though is a huge case for unfair/unlawful dismissal. He should be in contact with his union rep, and lodging a case in Fairwork Australia ASAP.

      • Tassiebush

        I have never seen such a clause either. I certainly wouldn’t expect to get sacked over this.

        • Bursar

          Probably the fact that the rozzers attended the site would be what tipped Goodyear over the edge to sacking. Something about bringing the company into disrepute is my guess.

      • Don Ward

        Interesting. I guess then that I’ve learned something.

  • JK

    Guess I’ll be buying Interco’s instead.

  • CJR

    While I’m sympathetic with Mr. Waters, he (really Liz, but Mr. Waters managed to get caught up in the slipstream) violated the golden rule – “Thou shalt not embarrass thine employer.”

    Instigating a situation which ends up with the cops searching cars at your place of business, counts as embarrassing your employer.

    Yes, in a sane society, this should have been a total non-issue. But Australia is not a sane society, at least when it comes to guns. Both Mr. Waters and Liz should have known this.

    • JK

      No one would have heard of this incident, had management not overreacted.

    • Esh325

      What’s funny is that many people in Australia would say the USA isn’t a sane society when it comes to guns. 33,636 gun deaths a year in the USA + plus the number of injuries associated with gun shots.

      • JK

        Your numbers are suspect.

        • Esh325

          Then you’re saying reality is suspect then. http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm

          • JK

            Hmm, in your “reality”, automobiles are more deadly, as are poisonings. Perhaps we’re focusing on the wrong issues.

          • Cymond

            Here we go again … another running debate about including suicide stats when most people are afraid of crimes of aggression.

          • Esh325

            There isn’t actually a large difference between automobile deaths and gun deaths in those statistics. They are separate issues after all. Maybe if those self driving cars become practical a lot of people who otherwise would be dead or injured could be saved.

          • Cymond

            I didn’t say anything about automobile deaths here. Maybe you meant to reply to JK?
            Regardless, if we’re talking about ACCIDENTS and SAFETY then the number of accidental car deaths is far greater than the number of accidental gun deaths.

            “They are separate issues after all.”

            As are suicide, homicide, and accidents but you still lump them together without clarification.

          • Esh325

            I was talking to JK. I started the issue saying GUN deaths which means all guns deaths. Okay I’ll play into your flawed logic that suicide gun deaths don’t count. That puts it at 12,461 non suicidal gun deaths +all the injuries associated with them. That’s still quite high for a developed country that isn’t at war.

          • Mark

            Straw man argument. Cymond didn’t say, “suicide gun deaths don’t count.” He said they are separate issues that require separate evaluation.

          • Esh325

            It’s interesting gun suicides are a separate issue, but people always bring up people dying in other ways like swimming to pools to some how deflect from the problem. Okay they are separate, you still have a high amount of non suicide gun deaths and injuries.

          • Esh325

            When the pundits say mental health is an issue in the USA it would appear to be true as you have people here saying suicides don’t matter.

          • JK

            Just saying a gun ban won’t eliminate suicides. So in arguing for or against a gun ban, suicides are irrelevant.

          • Esh325

            Traffic lights don’t stop all people from crashing their cars either…..

          • abecido

            And in reality, there is very little difference in the suicide rates of the US and Australia.

          • Cymond

            Oh, they matter, just not to a subject that’s focused on violent crime. I’m just sick of seeing that 30,000+ number being thrown around as part of “gun violence”. Heck, I wouldn’t care if the people using it were more clear.
            When talking about “gun violence” most people assume you’re talking about crimes of aggression like homicide. Homicide and suicide are two very different issues with very different causes. It’s misleading to lump them together without clarifying that. Would it be too much to ask you to say “X suicides and Y homicides” instead of “Z gun deaths”?
            On a similar note, I hate it when someone’s talking about gun SAFETY (as in, like, preventing accidents) and some anti-gunner says that over 10,000 kids are hurt or wounded with firearms every year. Of course, too many people misread that as “10,000 kids killed by gun accidents”. If someone intentionally shoots a kid, that’s not a “safety” problem, that’s a crime problem. It’s misleading to lump deliberate shootings with accidents when discussing “safety” and to lump all wounds (including minor ones) in with fatalities. It’s almost like the anti-gunners are want people to imagine the worst. Maybe saying “less than 100 kids under age 15 are killed in gun accidents per year” doesn’t support their agenda.

            Whenever I see this tactic, it really feels like someone’s trying to obscure the truth. It reeks of the same kind of spin I see in newspaper articles that are technically factual, but try to influence the reader with the connotations of the words and the article’s unspoken tone. That kind of manipulative trickery is what I came to TFB to avoid.

            So please, just be more clear what you’re talking about.Otherwise it looks like you have a hidden agenda.

          • Esh325

            I don’t believe I specifically said just violence originally, I said ALL gun deaths. You’re the one using trickery since you think I was saying that.

          • Mark

            Two (of several) reviews influential in the Congressional finding on the CDC’s prostitution of science (The reviews are pertinent still because gun banners are trying to resurrect their long discredited factoids—as Esh325 is attempting here to resurrect the long discredited “reduce gun suicide” factoid) :

            GUNS IN THE MEDICAL LITERATURE—A FAILURE OF PEER REVIEW
            http://www.haciendapub.com/articles/guns-medical-literature-—-failure-peer-review-edgar-suter-md

            GUNS AND PUBLIC HEALTH: EPIDEMIC OF
            VIOLENCE OR PANDEMIC OF PROPAGANDA?

            http://www.guncite.com/journals/tennmed.html

          • Esh325

            “In attacking science, vested interests may also hide their identities by masquerading as grassroots coalitions or by affiliating themselves with neutral organizations. Consider, for example, the National Coalition on Ergonomics, a research group that opposes a national ergonomics standard; the Food Chain Coalition, which represents the pesticide industry and works to prevent regulations; Doctors for Integrity in Research and Public Policy, physicians who oppose gun control and handgun research; and the Center for Patient Advocacy, the orthopedic group that lobbied against the Agency for Health Care Policy and Research’s back treatment recommendations.14,15,22,23 Most recently, what had appeared to be a grassroots coalition striving to raise awareness about the hepatitis C virus was actually shown to be a marketing effort run by the pharmaceutical company Schering-Plough Corp to promote their product, Rebetron, which is the primary hepatitis C therapy.24

            Vested interests have also found ways to infiltrate professional organizations under the guise of academic neutrality. This can have serious ramifications for national policy, since the credentials and expertise of professional organizations give them high credibility. The International Commission on Occupational Health, which assists in the development of scientific and policy recommendations, recently fell victim to this strategy when several members with a vested interest in the asbestos industry used their affiliation with the commission to develop an International Labor Organization document that was unusually favorable to the industry.25,26” http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447376/

          • Mark

            Indeed, though necessarily verbose, you make my point for me. The politicized and financial failures of peer review are why it behooves a reader to carefully analyze the methodology and conclusions of published papers, not simply parrot them…. (ahem!).

            Personally, I found great irony in Dr. Marcia Angell’s recent admission of the unreliability of the medical literature. She was 20 years too late in her confession. She was an editor at the New England Journal of Medicine while NEJM was touting Kellermann, Reay, Sloan, Loftin, and the rest of the CDC’s gun ban prostitutes.

          • Esh325

            “Dr. Suter denies his organization is linked to direct NRA funding, although members have worked closely with NRA researchers. He claims that most medical journals have refused to publish articles supporting his position because of editors’ biases against guns. “It’s truly an outrage how flawed and dishonest the medical literature is on the subject,” says Dr. Suter.” http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/injuries.html

          • Mark

            You would be far more convincing if you could actually critique the evidence. Innuendo and the NRA bogeyman won’t even get you a cup of coffee.

          • Esh325

            If my links showing the dangers of firearms ownership had people that were assoicated with the Brady Campaign what would you say?

          • Mark

            I do what I always do. I address the data, the method, and the conclusions. THAT is why I provided the articles that were persuasive to the US Congress. It takes LOTS of data to unfund a bureaucracy. That you have attempted to divert into innuendo about one of the authors underscores that you are shooting blanks.

          • Esh325

            So you don’t think working with a gun rights advocacy organization doesn’t effect research?

          • Mark

            Again, you are attempting to divert into a personal attack because YOU HAVE NO HONEST DATA, NO COMPETENT METHODOLOGY, and NO LOGICAL CONCLUSIONS TO SUPPORT YOUR CAUSE. You attempted to resurrect the phony “gun suicide” factoid and many exposed your fraud, so all you have left is name-calling.

            Whether the issue is vaccines, medical marijuana, or the risk/benefit ratio for guns, if a researcher has carefully analyzed data, used proper methodology, and made logical conclusions, it is perfectly human and appropriate to communicate with others who have reached the same conclusions and who seek the same public policy.

          • Esh325
          • Mark

            The CDC’s gun banners were unfunded because their research was demonstrably and deeply flawed. The CDC’s gun banners were not unfunded because of their friends.

          • Esh325

            They were unfunded by politicians with connections to the NRA. The defunding of the CDC was orchestrated by the NRA.

          • Mark

            A gratuitous assertion on your part.

          • Esh325

            They didn’t advocate a ban on all guns. That’s a lie.

          • You can make numbers say pretty much what you want them to.

          • Esh325
          • Mark

            Read the original article carefully. Suter made no claim of causality. Lambert defeats only a straw man.

            Are you Lambert? Your styles are so similar.

          • Esh325

            If saying places like DC,California,and Chicago higher amounts of murders despite having looser gun laws is not causality, then I don’t know what it is. My name is not anywhere close to being Lambert.

          • Mark

            Well, since you “don’t know,” you actually have to think a bit. Suter’s high-gun-ownership/low-violence and low-gun-ownership/high violence examples pierce the standard “high-gun-ownership/high violence shibboleth of the gun banners. Suter inferred no causality. He simply pointed out the flaws of the gun banners’ claims. Lambert was doing his usual—”defeating” a straw man of his own making.

          • mosinman

            *tighter guns laws

          • Heywood Jablome

            nonsense….gun laws are tighter in those particular progressive jurisdictions

        • Cymond

          In typical anti-gunner style, he’s lumping suicides in with his stats. While his statement is technically true, it also misleads people. Most people who support gun control appear to be concerned with and focused on violent crimes like homicide. They gain support by spreading fear that “you could be next”*. Then, they cite statistics that include suicides while focusing the rhetoric heavily on mass shooters, giving the impression that the US is swept up in a crime wave that makes 80’s crime movies look utopian by comparison.

          *Of course, the pro-gunners also seem to gain support by saying “you could be next”. It’s just that the pro-gunners have a different response to the threat of being attacked.

          • Esh325

            I didn’t make those statistics genius. the CDC did. Why don’t suicides matter?

          • JK

            Without guns, they would find another way. Next they’ll be banning rope and rat poison.

          • abecido

            According to the World Health Organization, the suicide rate in the US is 12.1/100,000 per year. In Australia it is 10.6/100.000 per year.

          • Esh325

            And what is the suicide rate for just guns?

          • abecido

            Guns are inanimate objects. They don’t commit suicide.

          • Mark

            “Just guns”??? You are attempting to resurrect the errors of Kellermann AL, Rivara, FP, Somes G, et al. Suicide in the Home in Relationship to Gun Ownership. N Engl J Med. 1992; 327: 467-72.

            methodological and conceptual errors:
            • an “adjustment” to eliminate suicide outside the home for the stated purpose of exaggerating the focus on guns
            • ignored the vast body of data on suicide method substitution
            • the authors virtually ignored their own data showing that factors, such as psychotropic medications, drug abuse, living alone, and hospitalization for alcoholism, have much higher correlations with suicide than guns
            • failed to address the important social and ethical dilemma – how to reduce overall suicide rates
            • ignored the role of failing health in the suicide of the elderly…

          • You have to remember the total population and population density between the two countries.

          • Sianmink

            Because gun ownership has no effect at all on the overall suicide rate, as many international studies have concluded.

          • Esh325

            Like?

          • Mark

            Suicides matter. Why doesn’t “method substitution” matter to you? When guns are banned, leaping and carbon monoxide are substituted in suicides, so that TOTAL suicide rates remain unchanged. Is suicide by leaping or carbon monoxide more pleasing to you?

            In 1995, Congress solicited expert testimony and confirmed egregious flaws of both methodology and interpretation in the CDC’s politicized gun “research.” To prevent further such misconduct, the US Congress made it ILLEGAL for the CDC to fund gun studies. With the stroke of a pen in 2014, Obama ILLEGALLY re-funded the CDC’s gun banners. The CDC’s prostitution of science is not limited to guns. Whistleblowers have revealed that, for political reasons, the CDC disappeared the evidence that vaccines do cause autism in some cases. Suffice it to say, anyone who touts CDC “research” is shooting blanks.

      • CJR

        Those people are wrong.

      • Mark

        The root causes and, hence, prevention strategies, are very different for accidents, homicides, and suicides. To make guns seem a problem, gun banners (1) dishonestly conflate accidents, suicides, and homicides and (2) completely ignore “method substitution.” Their dishonesty makes for seductive factoids about “gun suicides,” while ignoring total suicides. Again dishonestly, gun banners tout factoids about “gun accidents,” while ignoring that only one cause of accidental death is actually frequent, “car accidents.” What about homicide? Since the 1990’s we have seen a dramatic increase in gun ownership and concealed carry and the total murder rate has been cut in half.

      • marathag

        Oz has a 10.6 per 100k suicide rate, vs 12.1 for the USA. 2/3rds of US suicides are by firearm.

        Since the USA has 112.6 guns per 100 residents now in 2014, Oz has 21.7, I don’t think its the number of firearms that drive suicide deaths

      • Esh ease up please. I’ve read the FBI Uniform Crime Statistics every year for well over 20 years. A number of the stats you use conflict with the official stats.

  • TheNotoriousIUD

    I dont usually do this but this thing has a ton of typos for a very short story.

  • The Forty ‘Twa

    Get yourself tangled up in a situation where the police are called to your place of work and you’ll probably lose your job in a lot of situations, gun or no gun. Not really fair but life isn’t fair. Live and learn.

    • Edeco

      Yep. The freak-out and cop-calling sounds excessive to me, but apparently it happened. And since it did I can see why the guy would be in bad odor with the employer, like, morally guilty or not, just for being the lightningrod.

      I feel like I’m missing something, I mean, senator getting involved… :S Oh well, not my society.

  • Esh325

    None of that is really true actually. http://www.factcheck.org/2009/05/gun-control-in-australia/

    • Macht

      You realize that link refutes none of the points listed above, right?

      • billyoblivion

        No, I don’t think they do.

        (You are right however that what Kevinp2 posted is not refuted by that link)

    • Mark

      Gun banners are as amusing as they are dishonest. If a brief drop in deaths is discovered (or statistically contrived), gun control must receive the credit, but when attention is drawn to the failures of gun control, the failures of gun control must be credited to “other causes.”

  • Hensley Beuron Garlington

    That’s insane! He didn’t deserve to lose his job over that, he had like, zero control over the way that happened.

    And I wonder what real crimes were happening while police so heavyhandedly responded to this!?

    America is already near the same level of hysteria over the sight of black weapons. Crap has to stop. I wouldn’t ever report someone for carrying, but I also carry.

  • Dan

    HOPEFULLY YOU READ THIS BUT JUST DISREGARD THE ANTI U.S. RHETORIC FROM ESH325 don’t fall into his little game if him posting stats without context.

    • milesfortis

      Thanks.
      Esh is FTB’s visiting alien, bigoted anti-gun troll.
      This one will never defer to reason, because it’s simply an anti-gun bigot.
      From all previous encounters, this troll is a paid one since most other snti0gun bigots wouldn’t come around here since guns are ‘icky’.
      The main rule I do need to restate with trolls is: DON’T FEED THE TROLLS.

      • Mark

        He offers a useful opportunity to disseminate the evidence against the usual gun ban tropes.

      • Dan

        I dont think he is anti gun I think he is anti gun ownership without extreme overreaching government approval. And anti American

        • milesfortis

          I think we can agree that the vast majority of ‘anti-gunners’ are actually anti-civil rights.

          • Dan

            I predict a “it’s my right not to be shot” comment from him if he reads this.

    • M.M.D.C.

      Yeah. I poke him whenever he shows up but reasoning with him is a complete waste of time.

      • Dan

        Im beginning to think he is still in that age range where one believes they know everything.

    • mosinman

      he’s good for a chuckle though

    • JK

      Arguing ideology on the internet is pointless, anyway. Try to point out some key facts, in case someone with an open mind is actually paying attention, then let the conversation continue on its inevitable path into despotic zealotism.

  • Bursar

    There is a very good chance he would win an unfair/unlawful dismissal case. David needs to get in touch with his union rep (if he was a member) or a solicitor and get to Fair Work Australia ASAP.

  • Tassiebush

    I am really saddened to hear about this. I will certainly be boycotting this company. David seems to be a very nice helpful kind of bloke who always goes the extra mile to support shooting.

  • John Smith

    Should have titled this David vs Goliath Goodyear.
    I for one have emailed Goodyear and will not be buying there tires for my trucks anymore.

    • billyoblivion

      The problem with this is that Goodyear (US) and Goodyear (AU) are going to be *legally* different entities and Goodyear (US) had little or nothing to do with it.

      OTOH, they seem to be at least mildly anti-ccw so ICBW.

  • Boo

    Folks, I’m an Aussie, thought I’d provide a bit of background. For quite some time now us firearms owners have been subjected to vilification. We have low levels of violent crime, which like the USA and Canada, has been falling since the ’90’s. We seem to cop the blame for the actions of criminals and terrorists, despite a senate inquiry finding that there is no justification for this. We do seem to also suffer from dodgy stats. And now David has got the sack for this. Despite having, and complying with strict gun laws, we are still subject to an ongoing hate campaign. It was to stop. One thing we can do is make it clear that actions have consequences. These people just don’t understand reason.

  • Esh325

    Do you think a doctor is more likely to save somebody who went unconscious from swallowing a bottle of pills versus somebody who’s brain matter is scattered everywhere from a suicide attempt with a shotgun? Considering the fact that firearms are the number one use for homicides in the USA and no other method comes close, it’s safe to say there isn’t a method that is just as effective.

    • Mark

      Complete baloney, Esh. People choose their methods carefully. In general, those who choose pills (usually with a phone call to someone first) and those who make little chicken scratches on their wrists are making a gesture, a call for help or attention, not a serious attempt. The choices of leaping, carbon monoxide, hanging, and guns are equally lethal. Leaping, carbon monoxide, hanging, and guns are chosen with serious intent, not mere showmanship for sympathy.

      Time series and cross-cultural studies show the same thing after gun bans—method substitution, so suicide rates show no significant change after gun bans. When guns are not readily available, people who are serious about committing suicide choose equally lethal and readily available means, leaping, carbon monoxide, and hanging.

  • Will

    I just wrote corporate Goodyear and let them know after 18 years and having nothing but Goodyears, I will not and can not in good faith purchase from them any longer.

  • smartacus

    I expect to read about a full apology from Goodyear within the next 24 hours
    …otherwise many many people will promptly stop putting their money into another disarmament sympathizer.

  • smartacus

    Discrimination is wrong and is supposed to be illegal in civilized societies!!!

  • Tassiebush

    Another thing David Waters does is he makes fantastic tikka t3 10shot magazines in .223, .308 and 6.5×55 cartridge sizes. I know that the .223 ones are able to accommodate nice long projectiles. I really love mine. I would definitely recommend them to anyone wanting a good solid high quality magazine for their Tikka.

  • None

    Do you guys employ a giraffe to proofread or do you just not care?

  • Another serious consideration is disputes among gangs over territory, money, status etc. A great number of homicides are in this category.

    Of all the suicide calls I’ve handled over a long LEO career I’ve noticed that white males use guns, hanging and to a lesser degree wrist cutting. White and black females tend toward overdoses and cutting wrist. I’ve seen exceptions but by far these are the methods I’ve personally seen.

    • billyoblivion

      I think it would be very interesting to get zip/post code level crime data from the Anglosphere countries (Well, from everywhere) that included financial status.

  • Hans

    All shooters drive cars, vote and have mates that love shooting for fun, Goodyear i suggest should sack the dummies that sacked the young man or feel the wrath of millions of shooters.

  • William The Warlord

    Time to boycott Goodyear Tires and write their corporate CEO in Ohio and let him know this outrage will cost them money,business and reputation!

  • Mark

    Since we have seen increasing gun ownership and concealed carry during a decade of falling violence rates, I observe that the USA has a “gun solution,” not a “gun problem.” Even Chicago has seen violence fall since concealed carry was forced upon the Chicago political machine.

    The reports of a spike in gun sales in Europe suggest that Europeans have belatedly recognized that guns are indeed a solution to their problems of banksters and invasion.

  • Joseph A. Clark

    Ever met David Waters? I have, he was in my block this past summer at Camp Perry. He shot on Target 72 for High Power Rifle. One of the nicest guys you’d ever want to meet. We spoke, and had a couple of jokes, and I wished him the best of luck. Too bad Goodyear has just tarnished their reputations with this one…..Australians aren’t given a whole lot of freedom when it comes to firearms, especially since their laws were all reactionary. Oh, someone got shot, ban guns! There was a guy on the streetcorner with a samurai sword, swinging it (nobody got hurt), ban swords! Anything else you want to ban? Oh, wait, Steve Irwin got killed by a stingray, ban swimming!

    • Tassiebush

      I haven’t met him but I have bought one of the 10round Tikka T3 mags he makes and he definitely strikes me as a nice guy and an open and honest one at that. I have been very happy with the magazine. He deserves much better treatment than this.

  • Joshua Noble

    That guy’s friend is an idiot. Someone else’s place of business is not your personal club house.

  • john4637

    Maybe a little bit of thinking ahead would have dictated that having a friend bring a rifle to the parking lot of his place of employment was not such a great idea. Maybe considering one of the ranges I’m sure they frequent would have been a much better choice.

  • Mark

    Another European gun ban “success”: “13 Nov 2015 PARIS (AP) — Two police officials said at least 26 people have been killed in shootings and explosions around Paris Friday, in the deadliest violence in France in decades….”

  • wzrd1

    If someone that I know visited me at work with a firearm, I’d likely get fired as well.
    My company has a strict no firearms on company property policy and it’s their property, they have the right as the property owner to say what goes on on their property.
    That said, I assume when speaking to a novice, that they’re an idiot and make very clearly defined instructions on what to bring and not bring when meeting.
    After all, these days, it only takes one brain fart to get fired.

    • Keyser Soze

      I doubt there is a workplace in Australia with a ‘no firearms’ policy. Firearms are not carried by the public so there is no need. The issue here is that Goodyear have constructed David’s dismissal from a situation not of his making and they do not appear to have followed due process with his sacking. They are on a hiding to nothing and for no good reason. I suspect that perhaps David may not have been well liked at work and his bosses saw this as an opportunity to get rid of him but unfortunately its going to cost them a fortune both in lost business and a nice fat payout to David.

      • wzrd1

        I can’t speak to Australian law, but I’m certain that if his termination was unlawful, he would indeed receive compensation.
        Here in the US, companies can and do have no firearms permitted policies in place.

        A question about Australian law on transporting firearms and ammunition, what is the process that one conducts such transport?

        • Tassiebush

          Might vary from state to state/Territory but the basics are remove bolt and lock it in a secure box or compartment i.e glovebox or fit a trigger lock. Do not have it in a visible spot. Cannot have a mag with rounds in it. Ammo needs to be locked in a container too separate from gun. It’s the bane of my life as I always seem to see game right before the point where I am able to get it back together

          • wzrd1

            Many states in the US have similar laws, although the bolt can usually be with the weapon and ammunition locked in the glove box.
            Other states are totally open carry and a loaded firearm can be in the cab of the vehicle.
            when I transport my M4, I have a chamber plug that shows that the weapon is empty and my ammunition is secured in a locked container in the cab of the vehicle.

        • Keyser Soze

          So if your company had a no firearms policy and I came to visit you and without your knowing, lawfully brought a firearm with me which was later discovered you would be terminated?!? Are you expected to frisk every visitor? Those are some messed up employment laws that seem to fly in the face of natural justice i.e. being punished for an offence you were not party to.

          I’m not Australian expert, but I believe that if ammo and weapons are transported in same vehicle they must be ‘secured’ separately… I suspect in this case David’s visitor may not have had her ammo secured hence her being charged on a technical breach. An Aussie will correct me if I’m wrong.

  • Tejanojack

    The problem with Australia is that it remained in the Commonwealth too long. It should have kicked out the Brits, like the Americans did, so it wouldn’t become a nation of sheep like the Brits.

    • Tassiebush

      Go easy mate. It seems like a lot of US based readers here are of the view that this would probably happen to them too. I’m from Australia and I don’t think my workplace would respond this way.

      • Tejanojack

        Y’all need to guard your freedoms jealously, Mate. Once the camel has his nose in the tent…

        I know there are plenty of tough Aussies who don’t go along with the gun confiscation and Left wing BS. I served with them in Vietnam and in Iraq. Aussies ought to boycott Goodyear. I’ll never buy one of their tires again. Cheers Mate

        • Tassiebush

          Well I can’t argue with that.

        • Bursar

          Not alls the lefties in Australia are anti gun, but we are a minority in the Aussie shooting community.

  • gabriel_a_pharmer

    I hate stories like this.

  • MichaelZWilliamson

    Do please fix the multiple typos, however. It will make the article easier to share.

  • Wayne

    I am so glad I took the time to read this. It is time to by tires for my truck and travel trailer, I will not be purchasing Goodyear as I have in the past. I know the eight tire I am about to purchase will not mean a lot to Goodyear but, I will be doing my part not to support them.

  • Robert

    Easy to change thebrand of tires you buy. No more Goodyear for me. BTW there are 3 autos in the garage that currently wear Goodyear rubber. They will never be replaced by a Goodyear product again.

  • COL Bull-sigh

    Hope their blimp never flies over the Aussie Gun Club!

  • DCNielsen

    I would recommend anyone and everyone contact either or both Goodyear in the US and/Australia. I just wrote them, it’s just as easy as posting a comment. Perhaps the best place to voice displeasure is directly. I openly admitted to being a lifelong supporter of Goodyear being the tire I have regularly spent extra on because of my perception of the company outfitting both daily drivers as well as off-road vehicles like Jeep Wranglers and Landcruisers but that is going to abruptly change unless they correct this mistake and apologize to shooting enthusiasts.

  • Flyn_Bryan

    US tyrannical loving progressive leftists hope this will become the norm at some point the future.

  • albaby2

    With Australias gun laws it’s probably political and discrimination against shooters, although it wasn’t too smart of her to bring the rifle into his workplacel

  • jbird

    Steve, you need to proofread these articles better.

  • Bill

    And this, boys and girls, is a sneak preview of Clinton II.

  • scaatylobo

    Goodyear ,you are DONE on any shopping list I have.
    And I will be sure to let you AND all your companys know why I CHOOSE to not spend my money with you.
    BOYCOTT is the American way to let all know that WAGE EARNERS have options.

  • COL Bull-sigh

    Yunyo–I hope you mean smaller in population! (Not including kangaroos who, by the way, make up their judiciary branch, as they did in 1936 Germany.)

  • Stijn Van Damn

    why is he being punished for her being careless and stupid.
    Seriously bringing a gun to somebodies workplace (unless he is a gunsmith or shop) is just dumb

  • ScranunSlim

    Incredibly amateurish article (“bought” instead of “bRought” and “technically” instead of “technical-IT-y”).

    Heed the advice WSJ editor Paul Gigot got when as young reporter, he made similar mistakes: “One more mistake like that, son, and you’re outta here.”

  • lordmorgul

    Goodyear tarnishing its own brand.

  • Rodney Steward

    This is another country that has bowed to the wants of the UN, total gun control, just like what Obama is trying here, and the one thing that Hellary said she would take. Look at France this morning because of gun control, and is a matter of time before Australia has the same terrorist attacks! This was supposed to have been refugees, like the ones coming HERE! As I have stated several times, every country that has given up it’s guns has been flooded with well armed muslims! To all U REAL Americans that hate guns, U better learn to love them, because what has happened in France is headed here. Australia, get your head out of your a$$ and give back your guns, Good Year, you’re a disappointment and thee are other tires out there and much cheaper by the way!

  • David Emanuel

    I will never buy goodyear again and will write a letter to goodyear explaining why. Hopefulloy the US isn’t the next Australia. See what happens when fear overrides commonsence.

  • Mustascheo

    “reputational impact on the company”? Not as if I was going to buy Goodyear tires in the first place, but I will certainly not now.

  • dltaylor51

    I need to buy a new set of tires for my ford diesel one ton (six tires in all)and you can bet that Goodyear wont be getting my business.

  • StBernardnot

    Perfect timing Goodyear! I’m researching new tires for the family car & it ain’t gonna’ be Goodyear. Idiots!

  • Msgtdubb

    It seems to me, the company did more to tarnish it’s image than Mr Waters ever could. Remember this Goodyear: shooters buy tires and other rubber goods, too, and your not the only source of these products.

  • Francisco Machado

    Killing is done by persons, so the total number of killings by persons is the issue. Guns are one of many methods, blunt force trauma being the most popular. If, statistically, killings increase when gun ownership is restricted then it is reasonable to study the effect of the restrictions on the statistics. One statistic I never see, one I think would be critical to the issue, is the balance of justified (self defense) killings to felonious killings. If, out of a thousand killings (by any method), 300 were self defense and 700 felonies before the ban and 50 were self defense and 950 were felonies after the ban we would have a better understanding of the effectiveness of banning firearms – without even considering the inhibiting factor of the criminal’s fear the potential victim just might be armed. The gun is, after all, a force equalizer.

    • LeslieFish

      I can refer you to the FBI’s annual Uniform Crime Statistics Reports, which show (you have to dig for them, but the statistics are there) that in the past 5 years roughly 10,000 Americans are feloniously killed by firearms, between 12,000 and 20,000 (varies wildly by year) die of firearms suicide (which is not a felony in the US), and between 2000 and 2500 by firearms accidents. This is in a population of 315 million. At the same time, at least 900,000 Americans every year use a firearm to prevent crime — and this is only the number which report to the police; the actual figure could easily be twice or thrice as high.

      • Francisco Machado

        My curiosity was the change in the ratio of justifiable homicides to felonious homicides with the expectation that gun restrictions bias that ration toward the felonious, since those regulations disadvantage only the law abiding. The number of times a firearm was used to prevent crime is far more sensitive to the legality of the act than to its occurrence. The complexity of dealing with the hierarchy of officialdom is in exponential ration to the number of officials. When working with a contractor to clear land for a project, he said “If you find a skeleton, bury it.” It’s called contingency Avoidance.

      • Cal

        Ah, the other question rarely raised is how many of those crimes/murders are committed by actual US citizens rather then by those “imported” citizens or illegals (Yes, ILLEGALS. No person who has served as a US President was ever delegated the authority to create ANY legislature, it is forbidden to them. Nor can they LAWFULLY refuse to enforce the laws. WE are going to charge and prosecute Bush 1, the Clinton’s, Bush 2, Obama, and all of their respective administrations with Treason, *Terrorism, etc).

        *28 C.F.R. Section 0.85 Terrorism is defined as “the unlawful use of
        force and violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives”.

  • BigR

    Goodyear will never put tires on my car anymore!

  • rawhide3

    to bad this guy was not a muslim, nothing would have been said then

  • Donald Darr

    The man didn’t tell her to bring the gun and was trying to get her to put it back in her vehicle. How can he be at fault? Scenario: Husband comes to wife’s work place with a gun to shoot her but gets stopped. He goes to jail but should the wife get fired because of his actions? No more Goodyear products for my vehicles.

  • Eric B.

    This Australian senator has done EXACTLY the right thing here. When anti-gun people use their ignorance and prejudice to harm the welfare of other innocent people on trumped up charges it is time for good people to repudiate them. “All it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to remain silent.”

  • LeslieFish

    He should take up a fine old American tradition, and sue the company for slander, libel, discrimination, unfair loss of income, and anything else his lawyer can think of. First, of course, his friend has to be cleared of that technicality charge; then she can sue too — for harassment, slander, and likewise anything else. One thing that corporate managers and police officials respect is being legally hit in the wallet.

  • Core

    Sad bunch of corporate hacks… I’m boycotting Goodyear.

  • MVantroy

    Australian managers are legendary for shooting first asking questions later. Hopefully Mr. Waters is able to land at a company that has real values and doesn’t suck/blow in the winds of polite politics.

  • Karl

    I just had to put tires on my truck to today. The Goodyears came off and the Firestones went on! Letting Goodyear know about my decision.

  • Rocketman

    I’m boycotting Goodyear for this travesty and I advise all other shooters to do likewise.
    I’m going to send a letter to their corporate HQ telling them the reason why.

  • William Taylor

    That idiot woman has no right even being around a rifle, let alone owning one. Hauling it into the parking lot of an obviously paranoid company and putting her friend at great personal risk? The dummy blew it out her backside.

  • Tim Pearce

    Hey, yet another reason not to buy Goodyear tires.

  • EstebanCafe

    With the Paris attacks claiming 127 lives this Friday, one can only hope that other “Gun Free Countries” don’t allow their citizens to be butchered. Sadly, Australia isn’t likely to be one of them.
    David is the kind of citizen that could help to stop such tradgedies.

  • Charles Newman

    Goodyear Hoplophobia. So much for my buying anymore Goodyear tires.

  • William Burke

    EVERYTHING is political at some level or another. If you think there is anything or anyplace untouched by politics, you’re a goddamned fool.

  • Reginald Pettifogger

    Goodyear has specialized on stepping on its attachments going all the way back to the death of Mark Donohue.

  • jrdeahl

    I have a Dodge diesel that has Goodyear tires on it. They are needing to be replaced. I will wait to see what Goodyear does with Waters. No Waters, no Goodyear!

  • Adam

    Its Australia…. What do you expect… I got raided because someone at my work saw two Aluminum rifle stocks i had machined up on the back seat of my car at work..And coped a warning letter about weapons… This country is going down hill rapidly…

  • Adam

    And maybe Goodyear could give him his job back and sponsor him.. Considering our population is 25 million and theres basically 1 million adults who shoot , and thats 1 million adults who drive cars…

  • Max Glazer

    Welcome to Australia. Where braindead masses believe everything they hear about evil guns. Sculled koo-aid from government and asked for another barrel of it to take home. I live here and people are utterly terrified of guns.

  • Dixie Shooter

    I wonder why those wonderful police didn’t inform Goodyear’s HR that there was no threat to anyone due to this being an incomplete firearm. He instructed her to put the rifle back in the car immediately. How can they say he failed to prevent the security of the other employees. I guess their HR people are all democrats.

  • Doug_723

    I haven’t bought Goodyears in years (just too damned expensive). There are better tires IMO to be had with Coopers, BFG’s, or pretty much any other tire brand. And CHEAPER too!!! Just had a pair of Coopers put on my truck by Merchant’s, cost me $154.99 each for a
    LT 275/65R18 tire.

  • Cal

    Goodyear and Dunlop will be lsoing a LOT of US business. Obviously they are a partner in the destruction of governments including the USA, so that there will be a One World Government instituted with each nation demolished. You know, the same old “rule the world scenario again.

    This time, lets make sure we PROSECUTE and HANG those scum if found guilty as charged who believe they are elite and are willing to destroy anyone and any nation to increase their “power”.

  • Westcoast Guy

    Well, I also will not be buying Goodyear products until David is re-instated.

    What a farce, driven by hysteria, managed by (at least) incompetant management at Goodyear Autralia.

  • LetsTryLibertyAgain

    I sent a polite message to Goodyear’s US customer service representative via their online form. See my comment below for details. I just received a reply.

    “To clarify and correct some misinformation – Mr. Waters was not dismissed
    for being a shooter.
    Mr. Waters was dismissed for a violation of the company’s policy. The
    incident involved a firearm that had been brought onto company property.
    Mr. Waters is challenging the Company’s action before the Australian Fair
    Work Commission, as is his right. As the matter is currently being examined
    by the AFWC, we are not able to make any further comments at this time.”

    It doesn’t sound like they understand the first rule of defusing a customer initiated boycott. By and large, customers are easy going disorganized individuals. When a company does something to piss off the sheep enough to make them herd up and get rowdy, a company needs to go into full blown The Customer Is Always Right mode. This is not the time to argue with customers. This is the time to admit that someone in your company did something wrong, apologize, and try to make it right.

    Based on their response, I assume I was among the first to contact Goodyear’s US division concerning this situation. With some more feedback from US firearms enthusiasts, I’m sure they’ll adopt a more conciliatory tone soon. When customers tell you they aren’t happy with something your company did and you have an opportunity to fix the problem or lose the customer, smart companies won’t argue with the customer. It’s too late for that to possibly work. Smart companies own the problem and work to resolve the problem. For every customer who contacts you, there are a hundred who don’t but feel the same way.

    PS – I’m sure it’s not the same in Australia, but here in Kentucky, specifically for the sake of firearms, the employer’s parking lot is their property but the employee’s car is his property. This law was written to prevent an employer from instituting an anti-gun policy at work that effectively disarms an employee on his way to and from work. There aren’t many employers around here who would be upset by a rifle at work during an employee’s lunch break as long as it wasn’t pointed at the boss’ window.

  • Steve Cooper CMP North Gen Mgr

    It’s an absolute shame that Goodyear Australia has dragged David Waters under it’s own public relations bus. David and his fellow competitors, who spend a great deal of their own money to travel each year to participate in our historic National Matches, and the World Championships, are among the finest individuals we could hope to encounter. David is a proud Australian, a fierce competitor and a true ambassador of the shooting sports. Any level-headed business person who takes the time to gather the facts and make a judgment based on them, would have, at most, counseled David and moved on to far more important matters. To dismiss a valued employee over this incident is absolutely ridiculous. Ironically, I have scheduled tire replacement for a family vehicle this week – Goodyear is now permanently out of the running.

  • Jamie Clemons

    It is a good bet that with a good friend who is a senator he will find a better job and come out ahead especially with his experience.

    Senator

  • Larry Neufeld

    I will not be buying Goodyear or Dunlop products.
    I will be encouraging my friends and collogues in Canada to do the same.

    • Mustascheo

      Buy some Contis. Or some Michelins (even though they’re French owned). Much better tires anyway.

  • Dai

    This seems like a whole lot a needless arguing. I am Australian I am also a gun owner in Australia. Both handguns and rifles which I shoot competitively. There is no use comparing our laws to yours. For australians gun ownership is a privilege not a right ( at times we wish it was a right) We complain a lot about how strict our laws are but at the end of the day if we really want to own guns we suck it up and go through the red tape. For those who say Australia is fascist is down right offensive I fought for my country and represented it in a war that was yours and will be happy to do so again. We are allies with you and have fought side by side. You wanted a marine Corp base in Darwin we didn’t have a whinge we welcomed you with open arms. Our gun laws (most of which we don’t agree with) don’t make us a fascist country. It’s a great country to live in, free health care, college etc. just because our gun laws are nonsense doesn’t mean we are fascist

    • Mustascheo

      Do you advocate for a repeal of any of your firearms laws? Rather than just suck them up?

      • Dai

        I personally do advocate for repeal as do most shooters. But unfortunately we live in an anti gun nation with the majority uneducated about the firearms we use. Most of our petitioning to parliament for reform falls on deaf ears.