Kingsman Pistol

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Did you watch the film Kingsman: The Secret Service? In the film, the Kingsman Agents use a modified Russian Tokarev TT-30 pistol. The prop master added a shotgun barrel. It was never used in the film but it was explained that it can shoot shotgun shells. Do you think it could work? It would be interesting to see a working version. But I do not see how you could fit a working firing pin in such little space.

800px-KingsmanPistol 800px-Kingsman-ColtHammerless

 

 

Here is a picture of a stock Tokarev TT-30 for comparison.

 

 

Russian-Pistol-Tokarev-TT-33-left



Nicholas C

Co-Founder of KRISSTALK forums, an owner’s support group and all things KRISS Vector related. Nick found his passion through competitive shooting while living in NY. He participates in USPSA and 3Gun. He loves all things that shoots and flashlights. Really really bright flashlights.

Any questions please email him at nicholas.c@staff.thefirearmblog.com


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  • TheNotoriousIUD

    I could see possibly having a spring loaded zip gun style firing mech. with a finger hook on the left side that you could pull back and then release to fire a single shotgun shell while aiming with the right hand.

  • Sulaco

    When I was stationed in Thailand a lot of the city cops who had to buy their own guns and had piss all money to do so, bought single barrel .12 ga shotgun pistols cause they were way cheep. Made locally and sold only to cops you had to be a capt or above to have the graft level to afford a Colt or Beretta. Thai army/AF had a better deal as they issued WWII Colt gov .45s to their troops, the ammo looked to be of the same era as well…never saw one (.12 ga) used or fired and glad of it.

    • Sanchez Dangerballs

      Your comment piqued my interest. I was wondering, were the guns built from the ground up as a single shot SBS/ pistol, or were they little more than some old single shot H&R or Baikal that with a sawn down barrel and stock?

      • M.

        there’s no way they were built up if they were that poor

      • Sulaco

        Boy that was soooooome time ago but as I recall they were cut down single shot shotguns where basically only the action was left and mounted in a pistol grip hand carved out of teak wood. Town patrol in that city working with our SP’s got respect…

  • Tyler Horne

    I’m pretty sure Colin Firth’s character uses the shotgun to kill the Westbor..I mean, er, the Kentucky hate-church woman.

    • Damn! I counted the shots in that scene just the other day, to see how many shots this “TT” is supposed to hold, and got 11-reload-10 (guessed he had one in the chamber). Checked just now – he does use the shotgun to blast the lady! Thanks.

      • iksnilol

        From what I saw he had 10 round magazines (+ the one shotgun shot).

    • Here it is.

    • SP mclaughlin

      /spoilers
      There needs to be a beserk device activated on the real establishment…..

  • Axel

    Looks like something from bladerunner. I’d love one that had a light or something instead underneath.

    • iksnilol

      This is scientifically proven: A single shot shotgun is way more effective for SD than a flashlight. + those underbarrel flashlights are dangerous, people shoot after the light.

  • Michael Anthony Canizales

    How about a hook shaped firing pin? Something that runs along side the barrel, turns 90°, runs down to behind the primer, then turns another 90° to form the actual striking point. It would have to be incredibly stiff/well tempered metal to transfer the required energy to the primer without torquing the hook/pin out of shape, and the spring pressure for it would need to be considerable with how short the striker travel would be, but I think it’s doable.

    • The shotgun’s trigger is already set deep into the frame (the actual pistol trigger is behind it, it’s shortened a lot), maybe the hammer also strikes downwards from inside the frame? I mean, the travel is still short, but there is at least room for a powerful spring and arm.

  • Cal S.

    Oh, man, can’t wait for Heizer Defense to take this project up!

    • El Duderino

      Not a gun law expert (heck I’ve been corrected here before) but would it not have to be at or less than .50 and rifled as well to avoid that pesky AOW stamp? An underbarrel .410? Mounted on a .22 revolver for trail use, might be kind of neat, or a .44 Mag — .410 for rattlers and .44 300gr pills for big critters. Shucks pardner.

      • J-

        I’d figure something more along the lines of a cartridge firing version of the Le Mat revolver.

        • El Duderino

          But the LeMat is an antique and fires black powder, it gets around the NFA rules. You can also buy a new production black powder double barrel coach gun with 12″ barrels right from a catalog and delivered to your doorstep, no FFL. Adapt it for shells and get set for federal prison time. Stupid, but that’s how it is.

          • J-

            Yes, I know.

            But if you used a .45 LC rifled barrel with a 3 inch chamber for the shotgun, (e.g. Taurus Judge, S&W Governor, T/C .45/410 pistol), with 22 LR or 22 WMR around that, it would be perfectly legal and non NFA.

            Or do a NFA version with a 20 gauge surrounded by .357 mag.

          • El Duderino

            If you have to go NFA, go 10 gauge under an X-frame in .500 S&W. 🙂

          • iksnilol

            but 20 gauge (though I would prefer 12 gauge) surrounded by .357 is way more practical and useful.

          • J-

            Have you ever torched off a Serbu 6.5″ 12 gauge? It’s a lifetime of carpal tunnel from one pull of the trigger. A 20 gauge would do just as much damage from a short barrel without breaking your wrist.

          • iksnilol

            Yeah, but I like the ammo commonality. You can always use low recoil loads, or handload for it. That way you retain the ability to use all the other 12 gauge rounds (like flares and whatnot).

            Wonder how bulky an underbarrel 26.5mm attachment would be? I really like those flares.

            Also, 12 gauge out of short gun is better than 10 gauge. Though 20 gauge would be the best for the wrist. Though 12 gauge with a good rubber grip and low recoil loads should be GTG.

          • J-

            One of my favorite guns (and cheapest) is a H&R Pardner single shot 12 gauge. I had the barrel cut to 19 inches and crowned. Then I had a set of Marbles fiber optic sights (Uni-Ramp front, Universal #30 rear) installed. Put a shot shell holder on the stock and a Limbsaver slip on buttpad.

            Whole thing weighs about 4 lbs, is a cylinder choke, patterns well and can put Winchester Super-X slugs into a paper plate at 50 yds.

            Great gun to strap to a day pack. Only thing is it recoils like a bastard.

          • iksnilol

            Great for hunting I bet. I know a friend of mine sold his pump shottie after trying his brothers single barrel (for hunting). He got way better results with the lightweight gun since it didn’t tire him out carrying it.

          • Phil Elliott

            Ithaca made a 20 ga. dbl. bbl. pistol, called the Home, Auto, and Burglar gun. I have actually fired one, not too bad if you hold onto the top of the bbl.

          • Swarf

            Pretty sure he knows that.

          • J-

            I’d be more for somebody doing an Arsenal 2011-A1 double job on a Desert Eagle .50 AE.

          • Giolli Joker

            Watch The Green Hornet. 😉

          • J-

            NO!

          • Swarf

            Nuh uh.

  • Stanti

    Looks perfect for retiring some frakkin toasters.

    • Porty1119

      Definitely reminds me of the HE underbarrel mounts from NuBSG…

  • ostiariusalpha

    Out of left field, but it might use a small electric jolt to activate the primer. Would only require a very small battery.

    • iksnilol

      + the battery would last a long time.

    • Yallan

      The shotgun would be useful primarily to shoot door locks off and smoke shotgun shells would be very useful for instant cover, if they exist. Hopefully they demonstrate it’s utility in the sequel.

      • iksnilol

        Or, hear me out, we use those fancy frag-12 rounds. I don’t know how to justify it but I will come up with sometihng.

        Will admit, didn’t think about smoke or explosive rounds. Thought just to load it with Hexolitt32 and call it a day.

        • wetcorps

          Or make that a dragon breath so he can set things on fire.

          • iksnilol

            + those don’t have much recoil due to not launching stuff.

      • Phillip Cooper

        I wouldn’t count on a sequel of that steaming pile…

    • Nick

      Unless the shells are made with a special primer, then no. To detonate a traditional 209 primer with electricity requires A LOT of current. You basically need a short circuit through it to generate enough heat to pop it. A small battery (small enough to fit in the gun) simply would’ve have the juice required.

  • Swarf

    As a prop builder, I have to say, that is very nice work.

    Would have been a hell of a fun project.

    • Yallan

      Seriously? Kind of lame compared to the guns in the Blade films and Equilibirum. But it is a stepup from the pathetic Bond dumb gun in Skyfall.

      • Swarf

        I’m talking specifically about the craftsmanship– what I can see of it– not whether it’s more space wow than some other gun.

      • iksnilol

        The blade runner gun IIRC used a bolt action rifle. Personally I found the guns from the Blade films to look toylike (with all those boxy parts bolted on). The Berettas from Equilibrium were cool, though I liked Leons Berettas better.

        We don’t mention the Bond gun from Skyfall.

    • Casey Baker

      I was honestly just glad to see something other than a Walther, Beretta, Glock, etc. The Tokarev is an interesting little gun, so it was nice to finally see it get a little love on the big screen.

    • Iggy

      I’d have gone with Tokagypt grips for better ergonomics, but otherwise I really like the design.
      You often get the impression prop armorers deliberately go for outlandish stuff just to have fun.

      • Phillip Cooper

        Well, it IS their job after all…

  • Bj

    A 629 with an under barrel 12 gauge single shot was built for the movie Red, though john Malkovich never fired it

  • duho7761

    It might be effective in a last-ditch-oh-my-God-how-did-this-get-so-bad kind of thing.

    The LeMat Revolver had a similar device, but I can’t find any record of somebody using it.

    Can anyone else find one?

    • Swarf

      Man, I would love to have a modernized version of the LeMat! 8 rounds of .357 around a 20ga “oh crap!” barrel.

      But yes, as noted above, if the shotgun barrel was smoothbore, I believe it would be an AOW.

      • You can buy functiontional replica Lemat revolvers. Ball and cap rounds still kill you.

    • iksnilol

      Load it with a hexolitt32 and you could stop a goshdarned bear if you had to.

      Wonder how well slugs work out of such a short barrel?

  • iksnilol

    Make a doublestack tokarev with 20 round mags (shouldn’t be problematic considering singlestack Tokarev holds 9) + this shotgun thingy under and I am sold.

    It would be beautiful.

    Time to get a Tokarev, measure it and then get my machinist friend to make a double stack frame for it. Would I need to fabricate my own mags or are there mags that I could use?

    • Dracon1201

      You’d have to fab your own. I don’t know of a double stack 7.62×25 pistol out there.

      • iksnilol

        Well, there’s the Norinco SIG clone chambered for 7.62×25.

        So, making a Tokarev frame that accepts Norinco SIG clone mags. Then, make an extension to get to 20 rounds. After that make the underbarrel shotgun thingy since I want underbarrel something but don’t like flashlights on my pistols.

        Oh, and of course a threaded barrel. Have to have that.

        • Dracon1201

          Okay, if you can get the mags, perfect. Underbarrel shotgun could be made with a spare .410 rifled barrel for less than $100. I have an idea for the firing pin, but it would take too long to explain here.

          • iksnilol

            I am interested in how the firing pin would work.

            Was thinking about just using a 12 gauge barrel since the legality isn’t that much of a problem (+ I don’t really like .410). But from legal reasons I see why someone would want to use a rifled .410 barrel.

          • Sianmink

            throwing all caution to the wind, I’d go with a 20 or -28 gauge and hand-made shorty rounds like the aguila minis but tuned for basically no barrel length.

          • Dracon1201

            If you can get away with a 12ga, then do it.

          • iksnilol

            Oh yes, though like everything it’s gonna have to wait. The irony of having much time, much time that you will have to wait.

          • roguetechie

            there’s a way cheaper barrel solution… Saginaw adApters for flare guns…. Then the hard part is even done. I could turn it down to size real quick after.

        • ostiariusalpha

          Sounds like a plan; and if the new frame doesn’t measure up, you could maybe settle for putting the underbarrel shotgun on that Norinco P762. If you can get ahold of one.

          • iksnilol

            Funny part is, I could actually get ahold of one in Norway (legally if I might add). Only thing really stopping me is that 7.62×25 is uncommon in Norway (haven’t heard about anyone using it).

            Though I can import Norinco ammo so it shouldn’t be a problem (18 CAD for 50 rounds of steel case stuff). Which compared to Norwegian prices is between the cheapest 9×19 and .45 acp. + reloading Tokarev ammo isn’t too hard from what I have read. You can convert 5.56/.223 brass into 7.62×25. So I can reload some nice for comps.

      • Sianmink

        Would a modified .38 super mag work?

        • Dracon1201

          Actually, a custom 2011 frame in .38 Super would be amazing for this project.

          • roguetechie

            If someone has the barrel print and knows whether 2011’s have the feed ramp separate or not you guys could swing by my house and we can have the first annual TFB west coast build party… If 5 or 6 of you came I’d totally profile a barrel for each of you and set up jigs and the like if you guys chip in for my 2011 kit rofl!!
            hell bring your AK kits with you too, I’d be happy to bust out the jig sets so we could put together a few of them too!!
            plus I have something even cooler than the stuff I already mentioned…. A wife that doesn’t care if I put gun parts in the oven to bake finishes on!!
            LOL

          • Dracon1201

            Excellent. I’ve been wanting to see the West Coast 🙂 Lol

          • roguetechie

            LOL y’all better bring your own rivets rails flats and fcg’s!!!!
            and… NO it’s not just a ****Ing stock screw!!
            I have the Pie tins and dot3 covered though LOL!!!

          • Dracon1201

            BWAHAHAHA Good.

    • roguetechie

      iksinol,
      Funny you should bring this up….I’m in the process of creating myself nearly exactly what you specified…
      Except not based on TT. And 18 not 20 standard capacity…. Did I mention I’m building it to easily go beyond +p+ safely? What about the limbo low bore axis? Did I mention that?
      Looking at the features I’ve mentioned, it should be pretty easy to figure out what existing pistol is my inspiration.

      • iksnilol

        Are you basing it on the Arsenal Strike One?

        • roguetechie

          close oh so close….
          I’m actually basing it on a gun that will never be imported into the U.S. due to stupid treaties. The gsh-18, and I’m sure several people would be pretty gobsmacked at how EASY the mags were to get right….
          though I will say having several different nation’s tt33, an M57 yugo, a large quantity of cz 26 mags, and multiple cz52’s to cross reference was helpful heh.

          • iksnilol

            The GSH!? You have access to one of them?

            I have seen its insides through Gun Disassembly 2. Recently I bought the Lifetime Access. It is an interesting gun for sure. What’s your source for the mags?

            NOTE: It not being imported into the US is no problem for me since I am not in the US.

          • Sianmink

            2? They’re working on that already?

          • iksnilol

            Gun Disassembly 2 has been out for a while. I had luck, I bought the Steam version for half the price. Then I had to email the developers to get it transferred to the offline version (Steam version requires you to be online at all times, to prevent piracy).

            I friggin love it, I have access to over 100 different guns. Sure, you don’t have exact dimensions but you can get close through seeing how long a case is then compare it to the grid. It’s been really nice, + it relaxes the nerves which is useful considering all the stress lately.

          • roguetechie

            LOL…. Oh that would be friggin awesome if I had one to actually copy roflmfao!!!
            what I do have is every measurement for every part from end to end, multiple supplemental sources that should keep me out of the water hazard, but I’ve already hacked my way out of a couple sand traps. Honestly its not a fast process, or pretty, or the way sane people would do it. But I’ll get it, and honestly I’m having a serious amount of fun in the process.
            Now the magazines…. 😉 I guess that’s the cool part of being nuts… You see solutions that any sane person knows better than to even consider LOL

          • iksnilol

            Well, good luck in your endeavors.

            Nice to know not everyone is sane here 😉

          • roguetechie


            I’ll have something I’m happy with before Halloween estimating conservatively. To be completely candid I could finish by August easily, but the gsh replication is just the first step, NOT THE DESTINATION. (the projects after gsh make round 1 seem like “assembling” an AR15 you bought as a complete upper and complete lower….) However, I feel like I’m pursuing a very good development path with real potential.
            my confidence is based entirely on who else believed that this is THE next step in pistol evolution…
            I mean Shipunov, Stoner, Knight, Robinson, and Uzi Gal all believe(d) that this is the future of pistols and the last semiautomatic service pistol each of them worked on used the approaches I’m pursuing.
            Plus, realistically the current generation of this system in pistols are really the first big improvement in pistols in a long time.

          • Phil Elliott

            Before I read the comment I was thinking The GSH might be what you were thinking about, Just read about it yesterday. Had to look it up.

          • roguetechie

            The GSH-18 is an amazing pistol…
            More than that though, for me it was a revelation.
            I wish I could say it was a good revelation all trumpets and a capella choirs….
            But it wasn’t.
            Instead, in an instant, every misgiving I’d ever had about the western small arms community dog piled onto me at once… It instantly became clear to me that not only were things not the way I had believed because the people who were in a position to know the real state of western small arms development have been telling us that we have the most advanced and well suited for their intended role small arms f whole !

    • snmp

      the Norinco M213 is double stack mag

  • roguetechie

    it’s very possible… Heck you could even make it auto eject and run off the same trigger as the pistol OC-14 GROZA style…
    I even know exactly how you’d do every bit of it lol.
    It’s even simpler if you use a 410 shell or a 444 Marlin based shot load so you can compensate slightly for reduced payload with velocity.
    It’s easiest to pull off if you do a pretty aggressive choke and a PM-63 RAK style downward muzzle blast diverter. (extra points if you take it all the way and go Vietnam DUCKBILL spreader)
    also who can tell me what existing through hole I’m using for the groza based trigger mechanism switchplate.

  • M

    What about a small stud attached to a bolt face (like an open bolt gun) that would fit. Just make the bolt face spring loaded

  • Douglas Wojtowicz

    I had thought that under barrel attachment was a laser module. Hmm.

    • iksnilol

      Like I told that other guys, shotguns beat lights anytime.

      • Douglas Wojtowicz

        Not gonna argue there. Nice having a 19-20mm backup to a 9mm pistol.

  • Treiz

    Movie was awesome! Just came out on Blu-ray yesterday. They have some special features clips and one of them focuses on the fire arms used in the movie. It’s a must see for any gun or Bond etc etc fans.

  • GUNxSPECTRE

    I haven’t watched the movie yet so I’m pretty curious why they’d use a TT. Do they explain it in the movie, or did prop people put it in because they thought it was cool?
    I mean they’re Brits, so wouldn’t they stick to the Browning?

    • Nicholas Chen

      Prop master probably thought it was cool. Sometimes, in movie making, the Director will sit down with the prop master. The Prop Master will contract companies that loan firearms for films. They probably sat and looked through a catalog and picked out what looked appealing. Not sure who came up with the shotgun idea, if it was the director or the company that loans out the guns.

    • Fed24

      My gut feeling is they are intentionally mirroring an aspect of the 007 franchise. Bond uses what in modern terms an obsolete pistol in the form of the PPK but in that it looks iconic.

      A bit of a spoiler but the Front for the Kingsman is a Gentleman’s tailor shop in London and the Kingman’s dress and behave like Gentleman. It kind of fits with their image that their main hero pistol with its lovely refinish work is an older obsolete design. It just looks right amongst all the other tailored accessories they wield. The could of just gone with a Glock or SIG but it is a nice touch and homage to a detail of the 007 franchise. The makers of the film have put real effort into fleshing out these subtle details giving it a nice throw back feel without becoming pastiche like an Austen Powers movie or just another Bourne rip off.

      Clearly us shooting enthusiasts have given a massive thumbs up to the idea going on the comments. I wonder if there will be a upswing on TT-30 sales stateside now?

      Definitely watch the film, it is a joy to watch and you won’t think about the Swedish Royal family in the same way afterwards 😉

  • Jeff

    All I need is this and a Scandinavian princess and I think I can save the world. Just saying…

  • Jonathan Ferguson

    Your image of a ‘stock TT-30’ is actually a TT-33. Likewise, the base pistols used in the movie (though the images don’t allow definitive ID) are statistically much more likely to be 33s.

  • LCON

    Guess Hollywood is trying to Resurrect the Lamat.

    • wetcorps

      It’s Lemat actually.

      • LCON

        Okay I can’t spell to save my life. The point is the Civil war era revolver that had a 9 shot cylinder and a .20 gauge smooth bore secondary barrel

        • There were different caliber Lemat revolvers. It was a single action revolver hence why you could change to fire from the shotgun barrel.

          You can buy functional, legal Lemat revolvers today. Unlike the old Lemat revolvers these will not blow up if you use them.

          • LCON

            sure but that is not what my point is. The Prop makers for the film were commissioned by the Producers, director and writer to build a pistol that resembles a Lemat in general intention. a medium capacity low caliber handgun with secondary smooth bore short barrel single shotgun feature. compare the model features shown in the film vs Lemat. a 10 shot capacity magazine or a 9 shot magazine with chambered round vs the Revolvers 9 shot cylinder. very comparable in those terms the major changes of course being that the movie gun was based on a 1930s era Short recoil single action semiauto vs a 1850’s era single action revolver

          • I would say the tokarev is more mid caliber due to the muzzle velocity of the rounds. Its not for nothing it looks like a fireball going off in the daytime.

  • Strongarm

    Comparison photo is not TT30. It is a TT33. Top corner of TT30 trigger is not rounded.

  • Mike

    Please can we have a modern hi cap pistol in 7.62×25. I believe Norinco make one, but not importable from China

  • Sanchez Dangerballs

    This is pretty cool, but one question: why 16 gauge?

    • So you don’t break your fingers when firing plus 16 gauge is common in Europe.

  • Fed24

    I rather like the concept of them using a dated pistol design alongside the more modern equipment. It mirrors the 007 franchise where Bond using an obsolete (please don’t flame me) pistol design.

    In the context of the film I like to imagine when the organisation started in the 1920’s they went out and developed their equipment and decided they wanted some form of custom automatic pistol in keeping with the era and then never replaced it.

  • scaatylobo

    I enjoyed the movie as it was a reminder of the early James Bond flicks.
    As to that pistol,the recoil from a pistol 12 bore [ or even a 20 ] would be fearsome.
    I have fired sawed off’s a few times [ as an LEO ] and they are NOT fun and I was MUCH younger too.
    And remember that a saw’ed off 12 bore is still MUCH heavier than a Tok with an under the barrel 12 bore.

  • Steve R

    Looks like another propaganda hit piece featuring “justified” killing of American citizens. They are brainwashing you to find this acceptable. I have 6 toks and they will be pointed in the other direction at the proper time..