The 9mm Fixed? The Straight-Walled 9mm Automatic

Figure-2-Brad-Miller-9mm-Auto

 

If you ever want to get a shooter’s attention, start an article with the following statement: “The 9mm Luger cartridge is flawed.”

At least, it sure had mine. Shooting Times has published a detailed dive and analysis by Brad Miller, Ph.D. on the 9mm Luger and the proposed modern solution, the 9mm Automatic cartridge. The good Dr. exhaustively reviews the history of the 9mm and focuses on what he contends is the major problem of the cartridge: its taper.

Figure-1-Brad-Miller-9mm-Auto

The article goes in depth into why taper is an issue, especially in single-stack handguns. Backed up with empirical evidence and easy-to-read charts, Dr. Miller shows why the 9mm Auto could be a superior cartridge design. The reasoning at first glance is compelling.

What do you think? A solution in search of a problem or the future of 9mm? Do you believe this could see widespread adoption? Why or why not?



Nathan S.

One of TFB’s resident Jarheads, Nathan now works within the firearms industry. A consecutive Marine rifle and pistol expert, he enjoys local 3-gun, NFA, gunsmithing, MSR’s, & high-speed gear. Nathan has traveled to over 30 countries working with US DoD & foreign MoDs.

Nathan can be reached at Nathan.S@TheFirearmBlog.com

The above post is my opinion and does not reflect the views of any company or organization.


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  • Matt

    Solution in seek of a problem. This is pointless. Run the correct magazines and there won’t be an issue.

    • Matt

      Err, engrish fail. I meant to say, “Solution in search of a problem”. Sorry!

      • dan citizen

        It sounded ok with seek.

        • Y-man

          Actually did sound right, LOL.

        • Robert

          Now that was funny dan. ^_^

  • Colby

    As long as it’s backwards compatible and provides a demonstrable improvement I don’t see why not.

  • 9mmhaverandreloader

    I’ve through it was a great idea for years. Tapered cases like 9mm and 30 carbine are a beating to reload. I have toyed many times with the idea of reaming out the chamber of a 9 to straight wall and blowing 9mm cases out. call is the 9.1mm and load it with an oversized lead 38 bullet.

    • sauerquint

      Ya mean like the 9 Makarov has already done?

    • Huh? I don’t notice any significant difference in effort between resizing 9mm, .38 Special, and .45ACP.

  • Blastattack

    Sounds like a good idea to me.

  • Manimal

    Appears to be backwards compatible with 9mm Luger barrels so sure, why not. Start introducing this in premium defensive cartridges where people already expect to pay more. And tout it as an enhanced reliability feature and not a new cartridge.

    • BOB

      the taper of 9 mm luger should be more reliable than a straightwall 9mm

  • Asdf

    go straight walled and you better beef up you extractor

  • David

    If the Luger used a straight wall design, someone would “improve” it with a tapered wall. Can’t win.

  • Seth Martin

    The 9mm in it’s current form has worked for over 100 years. How much of an improvement would this make?

    • ekimp252

      Or, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.

      • Jason

        Or if it ain’t broken, don’t break it

        • John Swinkels

          I like youre train of thought Jason. Give me youre address and i will send you a Phd.

      • Earl Nash

        If it ain’t broke, fix it till it is..

        • Vorant

          @Earl you could be president….

    • jdkchem

      Priorities. It looks prettier!

    • M40

      Hmmm… we like the fact that a 9mm cartridge is compact enough that a handgun can hold a LOT of them.

      BUT… we’d like a straight walled cartridge to make magazine stacking straighter, and while we’re at it, it would be nice to give it some extra “oomph”… maybe a little extra powder capacity which would bring ballistics up to .40SW type performance or better.

      OH WAIT… we’ve had it since the 1920’s… it’s called the .38 Super. It’s been the caliber of choice for many years for IPSC gunners. It’s THE choice for those who want a major class power factor to compete alongside the .40SW and the .45ACP, but want a 1911 framed race gun to hold a double-stack magazine with 15 or 20 rounds (or more).

      • asoro

        357-sig does just that, it’s a 9mm in a 40 cart, neck down.

        • Ensse

          That it does, but the problem with that is that, being a bottlenecked cartridge, it’s a bit more difficult to reload. Other than that, I like the .357 Sig.

          • asoro

            yes it does take more care when reloading, But I have been doing it for over 10 yr’s now and have the knack, Plus I can reload the 5.7×28 rd which is one of the hardest to load, that took over a yr to get it right, No room for error on that one.

      • Ensse

        The .38 Super is also a semi-rimmed cartridge, though. I don’t believe it was originally designed for double-stack magazines. While the rim is subtle and probably wouldn’t interfere with the feeding much, it’s still a possibility, and what I would consider to be the one and only flaw with the .38 Super.

      • Ensse

        Oh, and I don’t think the 9mm Automatic has a larger case capacity. I could be mistaken, of course, but the tapered 9mm Luger case is wider at the base, and tapers to the same width as the 9mm Auto, correct? This should mean that the 9mm Auto is slightly smaller, meaning it can’t hold quite as much powder as the 9mm Luger.

      • Zachary marrs

        I know this is an old post, but my local pd have to furnish their own side arms, and I know that one cop carries a .38 super 1911

  • allannon

    Is a tapered case suboptimal? Sure.

    Is it enough so to warrant putting out an all-but-identical round? I really doubt it.

    • Ken

      In the test, he ran 9mm Auto ammo in a 9mm Luger gun. It will be basically the same round, but with slightly different parameters for better reliability. I guess manufacturers could start making their self defense ammo straight walled. That will be of no inconvenience to the shooter. They get to run the same guns, buying ammo from the same manufacturers.

      • In the test, he was running “9mm Auto” (built on .38 Super Lapua brass; a rimless variant of .38 Super) through a 9mm Luger gun, using .38 Super magazines.
        .
        He runs into problems with standard 9x19mm ammo because he uses the wrong caliber magazines. As he states in his article:
        .
        “A .38 Super magazine positions the cartridge farther from the feed ramp than a 9mm Luger magazine. This condition permits maximum nosedive, which allows for an evaluation of the effect of different cartridge dimensions on feed angle. Also, some shooters (including the author) use .38 Super magazines in their 9mm Luger 1911 pistols.”
        .
        Use the proper magazines, and select a design that _isn’t_ known to be prone to malfunctions in 9x19mm, and enjoy.
        .
        I haven’t encountered this problem using a quality pistol properly designed for 9x19mm, using quality magazines designed for that pistol in that caliber.

  • BOB

    I’m a big fan of the 9×18, its straightwalled. I like the sound of a straightwalled 9mm

  • Pete Sheppard

    Nice discussion, but what happens when it’s confused with the all-but-identical tapered cartridge? Happy lawyers!!

    • Ken

      Not an issue. In the test, he fired his straight walled 9mm Auto in a gun with a tapered 9mm Luger chamber. The brass safely fireforms into the tapered chamber. It should be no different than running trimmed 9mm Luger brass in 9×18 Makarov handloads, though at a higher pressure than the Makarov.

      • Pete Sheppard

        Thank you. How would this affect reloading?

        • Jake

          Doesn’t. Just resize the straight wall to tapered. Harder to take the taper out but I’d imagine when you fire it’d fire form

        • Ken

          It could be an issue if the chamber remains tapered 9mm Luger. The brass would come out fireformed for 9mm Luger, while retaining the smaller rim of the 9mm Auto. When you resize brass, the bottom portion cannot get resized because the die does not reach that low. I feel like there will be issues with reloaded brass, which will retain that hourglass shape.

  • Jeff

    The ever-so-slight taper of the 9mm Luger is one of the attributes that contributes to its great reliability. It feeds wonderfully from the magazine into the chamber. Straight-walled cartridges are more finicky.

    • Robin

      The taper probably helps with extraction as well.

  • Esh325

    What a ridiculous article. I’m sure the author is trying to profit off of his “straight wall 9mm”.

    • Cynic

      It has a place in places where mil issue ammo is restricted especially if it can be produced in quantity and can be used in conventional guns as well. It could in theory make a nice revolver cartridge I assume

  • UnrepentantLib

    Isn’t that basically reinventing the .38 Super (just a hair shorter and rimless where the .38 is, if I recall, semi-rimmed)

    • Steve Truffer

      .38 lapua is a rimless .38 super. The maker of this contrivance admitted its nothing more than a .38 lapua case shortened to 9×19. He ran into reliability issues using 9×19 in a .38 super mag. In a gun with springs meant for a .38 super. Loooong jump from the wrong caliber mag into a short-stroking assembly.

  • MihoshiK

    Utterly pointless. As others have pointed out, using the right tool for the job (read magazine) would have removed most problems.

    Shooting the 9 mm in a pistol actually designed around it would have removed any remaining problems.
    This is entirely a solution in search of a problem.

  • iksnilol

    A tapered case contributes to reliability. Thus a tapered case is not a flaw or “suboptimal”. This is especially important for SD ammo. Pretty much only straight pistol cartridge I trust is the Makarov. Because it was designed around it (beefy extractor).

    If it ain’t broke, don’t try to fix it.

  • Beju

    I can’t say that nosediving has ever been a problem with any of my 9mm pistols, but I’ve been using 9mm ammunition in magazines that were designed for the cartridge, not .38 Super magazines.

  • Michael R. Zupcak

    I never knew the 9x19mm was tapered. I always wondered why MP5/UMP-9 magazines were curved when the .40 and 10mm Auto versions were straight. Thank you, TFB, for my firearms lesson of the day.

    • Mazryonh

      .45 ACP cartridges are straight-walled too–you would have noticed this had you looked at UMPs chambered in their original caliber.

      9x19mm magazines weren’t always curved though. Many early SMGs in that caliber, from the famous German MP40 to the British Sten to the Israeli Uzi all used straight magazines for their ammunition. The British Sterling SMG was likely the first 9mm SMG that used curved magazines (it could also use straight ones from the earlier Sten too).

      • AldanFerrox

        Early versions of the MP5 also used straight magazines with 30 rounds. And a straight magazine with 15 rounds is availabe for the MP5k.

        • Mazryonh

          Yes, but the Sterling came before the MP5, which is why I mentioned it first. It would be a telling study to determine just how much more or less reliable firing 9mm from a straight or curved magazine would be, all other things being equal.

  • Noir

    Czechoslovakia was playing with streight-walled 9mm in late 1940s for this creature: http://www.vhu.cz/exhibit/samopal-zb-47/
    Main point was to have ammunition unuseable by enemy but to be able to use enemy´s ammo. Never left prototype stage.

  • RickH

    So, this is all about nosedive? Why do I care about something that has never given me a problem in the all the 9mm handguns I’ve owned?

  • MattCFII

    Like others have said, you are gaining feeding reliability in now the smaller part of the 9mm market with single stacks by sacrificing feeding and extracting reliability in the now vast majority of 9mm market, double stacks. I’m more than fine having hand loaders and even factory ammo made in it but more called something like “9mm Single Stack.”

  • dp

    A theory of “nosediving” as a result of .010″ taper is counter-intuitive. Actually, if anything assists feeding it is tapered bullet (compare 9mm with 40SW). I do not feel attracted to the idea and it sounds to me like tinkering for its own purpose.

  • txaero

    The article does not thoroughly address of the effect of magazine feed lip angle and mag spring tension which differs between makes of pistol actions? These issues must have some bearing to the “nosedive” the article refers to. Simply a mere acceptance of feed lip angle as constant rather than a variable. No mention of tension.

  • michaeljball

    Id rather see 9×23 winchester takeoff… capacity of 9mm power of 357 sig in a very similar sized package.

  • Risky

    If you really want a straight walled 9mm… just shoot .40 S&W. There are very few single stack 9’s that don’t have a .40 counterpart these days.

    I’ll admit the feed angle on single stack 9’s, sometimes exacerbated by flawed mags like Kahr’s, do aggravate the piss out of me sometimes. But I’ve yet to have a malfunction with my PM9 even shooting hundreds of rounds of Wolf WPA without a cleaning. Simply a non-issue.

  • looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool

  • Dan

    …the shit?

    he wants to take a supremely reliable cartridge and make it unreliable?

    bravo.

  • vincewarde

    A solution in search of a problem. Chances are it won’t go anywhere. The 9mm is too well established as the worlds #1 pistol cartridge…..

  • BattleshipGrey

    “Bring me some hairs.. I must split them!”

    • Careful

      people have time on their hands…and apparently a machine shop.

  • AD

    I seem to have missed something: what diameter bullets is he loading with? If the two cases have the same length, the same rim dimensions and the same bullet diameter, how can one be tapered and the other not?

    • Bruce

      Because the base of the round is larger than the rim diameter. The 9mm cartridge was designed to ease extraction by having a slight taper, just like rifle rounds. There are pluses and minuses to both designs. Bullet set back can be a much more common issue with 9mm as opposed to 45ACP as only the rim of the case is in strong contact with the bullet. Less of a problem with new ammo than with reloads.

      I would say that he’s reduced rim diameter to match case opening diameter to make the case straight wall.

      • jimmarch

        A good bet, considering both are using .355/.356-spec bullets.

  • Marc

    Nosedive? Really? That’s something 1911 fans discuss to great lengths while everyone else hasn’t heard/doesn’t care about because it never has been noticed/an issue.

    • itsmefool

      I’m a 1911 fan and I’ve never discussed nosedive…then again, I’ll carry 9mm and even .380 ACP from time to time, too, so I guess you’d call me an equal-opportunity carrier!

    • Dr. Daniel Jackson

      I have plenty of 1911’s and I have not had a nose dive with any of them,its not really an issue with any well designed firearms.I have seen it occur in jennings firearms and hi-points though.

  • MatKep

    Can’t argue with science… Except my M&P Shield has well over 1k rounds with 0 FTFs. I think a good gun, strong spring and clean feed ramp are a simpler solution.

  • DW

    Food for thought: 1) Few early lever-action repeaters uses straight-walled ammo and 2) The ever-reliable Kalashnikov uses banana mags and rounds with loltaper.

  • gunslinger

    wait, 9mm has had a problem and we just ignored it?

    how long has the 9L been around….and this is the first we’re really hearing of a straight wall 9mm?

  • TCBA_Joe

    At this point we’ve solved the problems of a tapered cartridge 9mm. We won’t however solve the issues of adding a new 99% identical cartridge into the mix.

  • Robert

    Can someone explain to me why a straight case must use a stronger extractor? (The Makarov for example) Also, I don’t understand how tapering increases reliability as some are saying on here. Is it because it feeds better into the chamber, decreasing the chance of a 3-point bind?

    • Robert

      I found my answer for the taper, by bruce d below:

      Because the base of the round is larger than the rim diameter. The 9mm cartridge was designed to ease extraction by having a slight taper, just like rifle rounds. There are pluses and minuses to both designs. Bullet set back can be a much more common issue with 9mm as opposed to 45ACP as only the rim of the case is in strong contact with the bullet. Less of a problem with new ammo than with reloads.

      I would say that he’s reduced rim diameter to match case opening diameter to make the case straight wall.

      • Marc

        “Bullet set back can be a much more common issue with 9mm as opposed to 45ACP as only the rim of the case is in strong contact with the bullet.”

        False. The 9mm’s case wall thickness tapers to provide not only full contact with the bullet, but also supports the heel of the bullet by narrowing even further down right beneath it. The latter being something the .45 case doesn’t, which is why .45 is more prone to setback and also the reason why military ammo used to be crimped underneath the bullet.

        “Less of a problem with new ammo than with reloads.”

        Also false. A 9mm sizing die under-sizes the case, further increasing heel support. Tight sizing dies then result in rounds which resemble coke bottles, which look strange but function fine and you’ll guaranteed never get a set back bullet in one, no matter how flat the bullet, no matter how steep the feed ramp, no matter how violent the action.

    • jimmarch

      It’s about extraction reliability.

      I have been experimenting with using tapped muzzle gasses to auto-eject shells out the back of a revolver, specifically a Ruger New Vaquero. In this cycle the firing chamber ejects the previously fired case out the loading gate, which uses a split/hinged gate to allow this stunt.

      I started with the gun in stock form, just doing gas extraction with the stock barrel and cylinder (357). In 38Spl the shells barely made it out. In 357 they bounced gently off my goatee, an acceptable result to me. I then converted the gun to 9mmPara so I could add magazine feeding – the narrower shells could be injected into the back of the cylinder one position left of the hammer from the shooter’s POV using spring-loaded tube mags. 357 shells were too wide. But I found the 9mmPara shells were being gas-ejected “with authority!” – stinging me sharply on the upper cheek.

      I attribute this easier ejection to the tapered cases. I went back to my rented machine shop (Xerocraft in Tucson AZ), pulled the gun’s hammer out, drilled into it from the left side and soldered a brass pin on it to act as a shell deflector.

      I also succeeded in getting mag feeding working – once the cylinder runs dry it will start injecting fresh rounds from either a short 2rd carry mag for 7rd capacity out of the holster, or a foot-long 9rd reload mag…and if desired I can stack a 9rd on top of 5rd for 14rd capacity with no reload. See also:

      http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2014/03/03/maurice-frankenruger-magazine-fed-revolver

      My point is this: without question it is a LOT easier to get fired tapered shells out of a chamber than it is to get straight-walled shells out. In 9mm I clearly have enough leftover gas pressure at the muzzle to splice in a compensator. In 38Spl that would be out of the question and it would be iffy in 357Magnum.

    • ikuturso

      Normally, a tapered case is easier to extract, as you only need a slight initial extraction to break it loose. A straight case clings to the chamber walls for the full length of the extraction cycle.

      Open a bottle of wine with a corkscrew. You will observe that the cork tends to cling to the bottle neck walls. Drink a glass of wine and imagine having a outwards-tapered cork in a likewise-flared bottle neck. A tapered cork would require some force to break loose, but after that, would be easy to extract. Drink another glass.

      The Makarov, like most blowback-operated guns start their extraction cycle while there’s still pressure in the chamber. This pressure assists in extraction. Some blowback pistols work perfectly without an extractor. The Beretta tip-up designs, like the Tomcat, never had one. Now open a bottle of champagne. You will observe that similarly, gas pressure in the bottle will tend to push the cork out by itself. Now drink a glass of champagne.

      This applies to relatively short, low-pressure cases. Longer cases in delayed blowback guns tend to require a fluted chamber to ease extraction and prevent case head separation, like the HK G3. Drink another glass and imagine a champagne bottle having a long, hollow cork. The pressure will now tend to expand the hollow cork into the neck walls while pushing the closed end out of the bottle. A fluted bottleneck would relieve the expansion and make the cork extract in one piece.

      Please don’t conduct this experiment while handling firearms. Stay safe.

  • Mark

    So let me get this straight: the 1911 has problems feeding 9mm because it is single-stack so let’s ignore 100 years of reliability in practically all other designs and redesign the cartridge to suit the tiny number of 9mm 1911-shooters. About right???

  • asm826

    No, this is a bad idea for reasons having nothing to do with whether or not the case of 9mm should have been tapered in the first place. Buying the wrong ammo, keeping barrels and guns separate, and finally, loading the wrong ammo, in either direction.

    And for the reloader, can you imagine trying to keep the brass sorted?

  • Peter J. Kolovos

    The taper was put there for a reason. I would think more people have been killed worldwide with a 9 M/M than any other handgun cartridge. I’m also tired of people saying this round is inadequate. The proof is in the pudding. Until you’ve been shot with, or shot other’s with a 9 M/M loaded with a Bonded Hollow Point bullet, the writer’s findings are nonsense. Shooting Times and Guns & Ammo are nothing more than gun rags for Nicky-New-Guy. They’re essentially toilet paper.

    • 223rem

      What you say about Shooting Times and Guns and Ammo is totally false!!!!! They are too slick for toilet paper!!!

  • CWK

    tapered case is more reliable. That why the commy rounds are the same way. They enter a dirty chamber more easily because of the taper. Of coarse when you reload that case it becomes a straight wall and why you see the bullet “bulge” the case.

  • Hank Seiter

    Uh, how many billion rounds of 9x19mm Luger have been successfully fired in thousands of different platforms over the last 110 years? Yeah, sure, theoretically speaking ….! George Luger got it right. I do know within our lifetimes one will find faaaaar more 9×19 to feed their arms than the “straight wall 9”.

  • Jim Watson

    It might help to look at a little history, you know, the 110 year old stuff. The original cartridge for the Luger was 7.65×21, the .30 Luger. When calls for bigger bullets started coming in, Luger and DWM settled on 9mm. Maybe because it was a nice even number. But they needed to keep the same head diameter so as to not have to redesign the whole gun. Their first idea was a very shallow bottleneck, but they concluded it would be simpler just to make the case a straight taper. Why not? The only gun they cared about was already designed to feed a tapered cartridge. If anybody else wanted to compete, they could – and DID – just deal with the design. All this business about easy extraction is just attempts to make the most out of an existing situation. Browning and Steyr didn’t seem to have much trouble extracting straight cases.

    • Core

      One important thing to remember is that improving something comes through trial and error. The Europeans are more open to utilizing new technologies in firearms and better at documenting the results of trial and error at least the Germanic’s. American ideology has led to rebuilds of old platforms using new materials. This may be the safer alternative but it limits us. Colt has the technology but they choose not to release it until its acceptable by the American mind, politician, or warfighter. Hk’s 416M5 is everything you need in a ARforgery thanks to their willingness to takes leaps of faith. We are the land of the bold we should act like it and stop whining about trying to improve something that works. Thats what got us onto the moon first! Great history lesson Jim, I didn’t know that.

  • Muaddib

    the taper is there to allow the cartridge to free itself of the chamber after only 1/32nd of rearward travel.

    similar to how almost every other round is designed. from 25acp up to 50bmg all tapered.

  • Meh, people shoot 9 mm because it’s cheap, internationally available, and because it allows their pistols to hold more rounds. The only “nosedive” problem I’ve ever had with a 9mm luger was in a 9 mm 1911 and now there are better magazines and gun designs that have resolved this problem already. The pistols this nosedive problem exist in are practically obscure. Without the taper you’ll have extraction issues and in order to solve them you’ll have to “reverse taper” the chamber in the gun. Even if you think it’s a problem there are so many other calibers to choose from already… I see no reason for this. It’s just a solution looking for a problem that isn’t there.

  • aorobert

    Best way to improve it is to upgrade to .45!

    • Core

      The .45 auto was designed as a superior replacement to the 9mm. : P

  • The FACTS

    The solution is already here… the BEST 9mm is the .357 Sig! Far better ballistics, better feed characteristics… better penetration, better man killer.

    • Tucson_Jim

      Yeah… but, too unpopular, too expensive, and not available for scavanging from dead NATO Troops…

      • TexianPatriot

        Which exactly why the 9mm automatic straight cartridge will fail.

      • The FACTS

        Well… about the same price as .40 or .45… but I agree… not too popular… too bad… good round.

  • Lockmazter

    I use the luger round in 5 different handguns, ranging from 1933 to 2011, from $160 to $2000, and my JR carbine rifle. I have NO problems. ZERO! Maybe Mr. “PhD” Miller is doing it wrong!

  • tinacn

    Well….let’s see…IF you are “worried” about nosedive, or curved magazines, or any other semiautomatic issues, I have a suggestion: Get yourself a suitable revolver in 5, 6, or 7 shot capacity in whatever chambering you desire. This solves stovepipes, failures to extract, broken extractors, failures to feed, nosedive, and curved magazines. The trade off is a much slower reload, although I have seen video of some VERY fast speedloading by practiced individuals.
    This is not to say that revolvers “never fail”, as they can and do. But there is something to be said for the old words of wisdom: “A revolver is six rounds for sure”. Or 5 or 7.
    For the record, my carry handgun is a Diamondback DB9 9mm. Fierce recoil. But as long as I have a firm grip on it when I fire it, it functions without fail.

  • Core

    Chuck Norris taught me how to straighten “9mm nazi” as he called it, by rolling each round between my fingers.. Chuck doesn’t need to go through the trouble, the cartridges straighten themselves when he walks into the room, and when he grits his teeth they automatically expand to 10mm..

  • tigertank58

    I would need to see some hard test results. I didn’t know that the “9” had a problem. However, if the strait wall improves the round to a real degree, not just so a computer can tell the diff and if it will work in existing pistols then why not?

  • Andrew Marcell

    Since 1904 the 9×19 has worked quite well. Why fix what was not broken?

  • John Swinkels

    Dr Brad MILLER my advise to you is, burn your powder and stop putting it up your nose. i confess i do not have a Phd. But i do have over fifty years experience, and in that time i found the 9mm to be very consistent. Our conclusion for its inherent ability to group well. Was due to its taper so when chambered every round was in the same position before firing. People who neck size rifle cartridges are trying to archive the same thing. i’am so glad i never went to uni and profess i know everything this guy is a joke.

  • John Swinkels

    Also Dr Miller as for stacking rounds in a mag, if you slightly slant the magazine guide to compensate for the taper every round will engage the feed ramp at the same consistent angle. to prove my point, Ever head of a S&W model 52 auto in .38 special. Gee i wonder how that worked.

  • USAF_PlaneGuy

    While improvement is usually good, in this case I think it is a bad idea.

    First of all, there are already several 9mm cartridges, adding ANOTHER 9mm cartridge will confuse novice shooters.

    Second is LOGISTICS. 9mm Luger/NATO/Parabellum is already in very widespread use. I do not see people dropping their ‘old reliable’ 9s for a new ‘wonder’ 9.

  • kagbalete

    Reinventing the wheel…….

  • EstebanCafe

    This analysis is a hammer looking for a nail and makes a distinction without a merited difference. The 9mm has been serviceable for years without any changes. If they’d started with the straight wall it would have been good…otherwise, there goes all that 9mm brass I’ve been collecting !

  • Careful

    Wow – a lot of interesting comments here (especially the physics majors amongst us), but even less than expected given the noise around 9mm luger. Been shooting luger for years and never had a problem. Always willing to try something new, but to echo a few below, if it ain’t broke…

  • Archie Montgomery

    “Son of .45 GAP”

    I have several pistols in 9×19. They are historical pieces and somewhat collectible. I’m certainly not going to have them re-chambered. I am not a 9×19 ‘fan’, but even so, why would I ‘switch’ to a different cartridge requiring me to either modify or replace all my current pistols?

    Unless those rounds will safely chamber and fire in current 9×19 chambered weapons, I see no big call for it. Unless perhaps marketed in those nations forbidding ‘military’ caliber weapons.

  • Razzjazz

    Is there a 9mm lever action rifle? That’d be neat.