Can you identify this AK

A reader emailed me a scan of a photograph in a recent issue of the Economist. He asked if I could identify the rifle being held by an Indonesian soldier. I quite certain that the rifle is a 5.56mm chambered Norinco Type 84, but the Type 84 is supposed to be a civilian export model, not a military rifle. Also, I don’t know of a Type 84 being produced with a Type 56-2 style folding stock or with a AKS-74U/AK-100 style gas block. Can anyone identify this rifle?

UPDATE: That was quick. Nic identified it as a AK-2000.

[ Many thanks to Richard for sending us the photo. ]





Steve Johnson

Founder and Dictator-In-Chief of TFB. A passionate gun owner, a shooting enthusiast and totally tacti-uncool. Favorite first date location: any gun range. Steve can be contacted here.


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  • It’s airsoft, look at that orange muzzle!

    (Just kidding… I think that’s just tape around the barrel.)

    • Teknix

      No reason to be afraid of this guy…he is no harm…he has an orange muzzle. Now let’s go find someone with a gun that is completely black and take him down because he is a danger!

    • Bob Z Moose

      I was gonna say the same thing. Cops in Indonesia have it real bad to be using BBs.

  • Jake Barnes

    Quite likely that it’s a Type 84 Norinco. I have a select fire 56 with the exact same stock (in brown though, not black). I’ll take some pictures of it next week.

  • DZ

    Chances are they were put together after the 89 import ban with parts from the 84s and other parts laying aroud. I would geuss a limited production run.

  • Riot

    Looks like a 5.56 QBZ 56C. Probably a cross between the type 84 and the 56C

  • Yep this is a Norinco Type 56C. It’s simply the Chinese take on the AK105.

  • Poor-guy

    We only see one rifle. Might be a unique build by the issuer. Isn’t Indonesia and that area of the globe a hot spot for one-offs? Think I’ve seen several entries on here about that. Seems like the simplest explanation would be they had it pieced together from broken rifles and re-issued it to keep a rifle in the cop/soldier’s hands.

  • Guys – Worldguns.ru has a clearer picture of this 56C: http://world.guns.ru/assault/ch/type-56-e.html

  • Doug

    Must be 5.56, but I don’t even bother trying to keep up with all the AK model names/numbers.

  • I think it’s an optical illusion because of the angle it’s being held at – the 56C is 7.62×39 BUT has a more compact 20 round AK style magazine.

  • Billy Bones

    Looks like a standard 56-2 to me in 5.56 using black polymer forearm and stock piece as provide for the Finns.
    Definitely a 5.56 mag.

    Though I am on a itouch and pic is grainy.
    What issue of Economist, we recieve the magazine.

  • ruben

    its 5.56 origin chinese

  • Big Red One – Ramadi

    Without a doubt Chinese from looking at the buttstock with the integrated handle. Not sure if its type 84 or 56c.

  • As far as I am aware the 56C *only* comes in 7.62 – the Chinese did make two export versions of the Type 56 in 5.56, but these were not available in the distinctive compact 56C (black polymer) format. BUT, I would not be surprised if Norinco did knock up a batch of their 5.56 Type-56s (normally known as Type 56S or the Type 84) with the black polymer stocks if they got a reasonably sized order…

    It’s without a doubt a Type 56 variant – Nobody else uses that distinctive folding stock (which was designed to allow the soldier to better use his bayonet).

  • mechamaster

    It’s Norinco (maybe 5,56 cal from the curved magazine ), because Indonesian Brimob deployed both original AK-101 and Norinco- AK clones in their arsenal, and I saw it recently.

  • Nmate

    That is definitely a Chinese-type folding stock. Few people have seen them and I’ve only seen them in wood, not polymer. Definitely chambered in 5.56 due to the magazine’s nearly complete lack of curve.

  • Esh325

    Has to be a Type 56 variant in 5.56×45. The rivet pattern and the folding stock are a dead give away that it’s Chinese. The magazine is definitely 5.56×45.

  • Lance

    Its a Type 84 in 5.56mm and the stock and front sight give it away that its Chinese. While LE around the world may use 5.56mm AKs most SE Asian countries use 7.62mm AKM and Type 56s now.

  • snmp

    Norinco Type 56S (56-2) or Type 84 (civil/sport version)

  • Mike Knox

    Meh, more likely a police armory’s custom. I’m more occupied with the ‘engrish’ sign in the background..

    • Mike

      It’s not Engrish, it’s in Indonesian. The funny thing about Indonesian is that it uses a lot of English loanwords while sounding totally bizarre.

      • Mike Knox

        Brother, is that you?

  • I don’t think it’s an AK2000. Take a close look at the gas system and you’ll note that it is not on a slant. Instead it’s perpendicular. Looks more like an AK74M with a 2000 stock

    • JonathanF

      It’s clearly chambered in 5.56. The profile of the gas block is obscured by an object behind it.

      Nic’s right, it’s the Chinese AK-2000.

  • Payce

    Isnt’ there a 9mm AK variant? I can’t remember what it’s called but the magazine length looks like it might be a little small for rifle caliber.

  • Alpha Roger

    Hi guys! We can stop the bickering. It is a Chinese copy of the AK originally but now modified locally with whatever suited them.
    In the past, the Indonesians were given Chinese made AK (donated if you want) to the Sukarno’s administration which many are now modified beyond recognition.
    However, some AKs still use the M1943 rds and with so many AKs modified with both NATO and Russian parts that the AKs are a mixed bag of all the designs that are beyond recognition.

  • bima

    the military and law enforcement in Indonesia used to be under one body (ABRI : armed forces of indonesia), the army keep ending up with whats “left over” of the military. then later they were seperated to their own individualy body military (TNI) and police (POLRI), and start their own rearmament program.

    the military is mainly supplied by PT. Pindad (local armory) using the SS-Pindad series rifle (localy licenced and modified FNc rifle). unable to fulfil both the military and police demand. the police seek other suppliers for their armament, ending up with HK (MP5’s) and Izhmash (AK variants).

    officialy its suppose to be a real AK variant (not chinese clone). but I don’t know how far the corruption in the government is, to replace it with chinese clones.

    so, it does look like an AK2000. but not suremif its a chinese clone or not.

  • Yo

    The Police procured around 3000 Chinese AK during President Gus Dur time and there are some rumors saying those Chinese AK’s barrel wouldn’t last 1000 rounds. Therefore they’re mostly kept in the armory or scrapped.

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  • RD

    Definitely an AK-2000.

    I remember some articles at the time also suggested that there was corruption involved and the arms brokers included some of these guns in shipments of Russian AK-101s.

    Took a photo of one a couple years ago during a Police PR event:
    http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:AK-2000P.jpg

    It had the words “AK-2000P” stamped on them. No stamp of any manufacturer.

    We were not even allowed to shoot these because they were deemed too dangerous. Shot 40-year-old M16A1s instead.

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  • Survivalist

    As Type 84s manual says, this is Norinco Type 84S-2 which is made with side folding stock.