Excel Arms X-30R Rifle in .30 Carbine

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One of the niftiest guns I have seen at SHOT is the Excel Arms X-30R Rifle. It is chambered in .30 Carbine and accepts M1 Carbine magazines. A number of models will be available later this year, including a pistol version. The gun is blowback operated and has a heavy recoil string to slow down the bolt.

My only complaint is that the barrel of the rifle is 18″, not 16″.




Steve Johnson

Founder and Dictator-In-Chief of TFB. A passionate gun owner, a shooting enthusiast and totally tacti-uncool. Favorite first date location: any gun range. Steve can be contacted here.


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  • Paul

    The .30 caliber carbine round is sadly overlooked as a self-defense round….especially with modern hollow point ammunition. In Brazil, Taurus manufactures a nifty semi-auto .30 caliber police carbine that resembles a SIG rifle. If Taurus offered something like that I think they would have a winner on their hands. Time will tell how this Excel rifle does.

    • Tinkerer

      Yes, the Taurus CT-30 semiautomatic carbine, derived from the chilean FAMAE SG-540 assault rifle, licensed from the original SIG 540. A very interesting weapon in a very interesting caliber.

    • bbmg

      IMI make the Magal in the same calibre for law enforcement: http://forum.valka.cz/attachments/4461/MAGAL.2.jpg

      From the same part of the world comes the Hezi SM-1 which turns the M1 into a compact bullpup: http://operatorchan.org/k/arch/src/k88051_1-1-1-1_hezi2.jpg

      • Arisucka

        There is something so sexy about a mini Galil (which the magal appears to be based upon). The little bullpup has some great lines and it f its based on the m1 u know its a tried and true platform. If it was good enough for our forefathers to strap to there bellies and jump into the abyss of occupied europe then by God that gun is good enough for me.

      • mosinman

        now thats SEXY!

      • W

        wow…nice links

  • bigghoss

    It’s cool that the .30 carbine is getting attention but in a rifle the size and weight of an AR15 I might as well go with 5.56. I like the M1 carbine because it’s light and handy. The conventional stock with a 10 or 15 round magazine makes a nice package for riding behind the seat of a truck with fewer snag points.

    • Hammy Hamster

      Well not everyone is a fan of the AR15, the 5.56 round, and the price of the platform.

      My only question is how much this gun will cost. If it sells for under $800 Canadian then I am excited.

      • Mike

        From the post above describing the price as ~$800-900, you can get a good AR for less than the price of this X-30R.

        Though I agree that a side folding stock would be smarter.

      • Flounder

        gun prices are different in canada… This could be a lot cheaper than an AR. And Sometimes it is nice to have an alternative caliber that is still available. like when there is a gun scare that makes everyone go to the store and buy all the ammo. just try getting 5.56 or 308 then. Just my thoughts

      • Hammy Hamster

        AR 15s are restricted in Canada which means no hunting for us.

        Also AR15s tend to be $1000-1200+ for a budge one (and no I will not include the NORC).

      • fw226

        Hammy, I rated you down because I have fat fingers with my phone. I didn’t realize prices were that different in Canada : /

      • http://www.predatorwild.com Heath

        Isn’t there a Chinese made AR available there in Canada that’s pretty cheap? I recall it being well under $800

  • Jose Antonio

    I hope this arrives to my country.
    I have a lot of 15 and 30 round mags, and since I don’t like to abuse my 1942 M1, this would be interesting.

    I don’t like the handguard or right side bolt handle, but have no problem with the 18″ barrel.
    Any idea if it will accept the old 30 round mags?

  • H.L. Fahnestock

    I like the pistol… reminds me of the old “enforcer” pistol, only with better ergonomics. I’m curious as to what it’ll cost.

    • Jose Antonio
    • Eric S

      I too liked the pistol, but with a $7-800 msrp it’d be cheaper to buy an enforcer off of gunbroker and have a better frame milled. I’ll reconsider when it drops to the $500 range.

  • armed_partisan

    Thanks Steve! I’ve been interested in these for a while, and couldn’t find any info on them. 18″ was the length of the original M1 Carbine, so that makes sense to me. It’s disappointing that it’s a straight blow back. That will limit the pressures you can run reloads at.

    .30 Carbine can be shot indoors, which means those of us who can’t shoot in our back yards and can’t afford frangible ammo for our 5.56 can still practice. The only ranges in my area that will allow you to shoot rifles have memberships of as much as $200 a year! That’s a lot of ammo I won’t get to shoot just so I’ll have a place to shoot it!

  • slim934

    According to the website it will msrp for roughly 800 (920 for the model with included iron sights).

    My question is what kind of magazines will it use?

    • slim934

      Oopsie daisy I missed the mention of .30 MI magazines.

  • armed_partisan

    I think a side folding stock would have been a MUCH better idea. They missed the boat on that one. People should refrain from using off the self crap for ARs unless they’re building, you know, an AR.

    • JMD

      On the upside though, it looks like any standard AR stock systems will work on this thing, so there are tons of good options available.

    • Other Steve

      I agree, if it doesn’t need a buffer tube, WHY is an AR stock there? Adapting guns to that aren’t designed for AR stocks is a curiosity of mine, such an odd check weld for guns that don’t need it. Some people just like a little AR where ever they go I guess.

  • Bolter

    My concern is ammo – .30 carbine is pricey. Maybe this will drive up the supply eventually if more people want to shoot .30 carbine. I don’t shoot my M1 much just because I have to order ammo online and it seems relatively expensive. If you know of a source of cheaper .30 let me know!

    • JMD

      If reloading is an option, you might want to think about that. With that cartridge you can probably save a lot of money that way.

  • SpudGun

    I appreciate the historical significance of the M1 and the .30 Carbine round, but it’s a bit of a dinosaur ballistically speaking. Most .44 Magnum rounds will have greater power out of a longish barrel.

    I do like it’s minimal styling and I’m sure it would be very easy to shoot, but can’t really see the need for one. Not for me, but still a very practical firearm.

  • JMD

    The fact it’s blowback operated probably means that ammo loaded up to get more performance out of the small cartridge is probably not an option. That’s a shame.

    I’ve got to wonder how heavy the bolt and bolt and recoil spring are. This is definitely interesting.

    • Other Steve

      Yea, even with factory ammo though .30 carbine + blowback = not interested

  • schizuki

    Hmm. I’ve always found the .30 Carbine interesting only for the rifle, not the round. An M1 Carbine chambered in .45 interests me more than a new rifle chambered in .30 Carbine.

  • JMD

    Troll harder.

    • Other Steve

      Steve, can we get a ban going here? This is bullshit, he’s not even trying anymore.

    • Neal

      Not sure if troll.
      The consistency of his comments between here and KitUp suggests serious trollitude OR he really does have that many nonsensical opinions and terrible grammar.

      • fw226

        That’s because comments can be deleted!

        And of course I would buy one in .30 for 299, but not in 22! Usually cabelas is not the cheapest, but occasionally they surprise me.

  • Joseph

    Looks like a great comp gun. People neglect this idea a lot but it really would do.

  • TGM

    I know the M-1 Carbine originally had a 18″ barrel and no flash hider (cone flash hider came later). But why not cut it down to 16″ and add a flash hider? If it doesn’t use a buffer tube a folding stock would be great.

  • Chuck

    Does anyone know what type of magazine the 5.7 uses?

    • cc19

      I assume standard FN Five-seven mags since I don’t see how a P90 mag can fit onto there. Not too bad really; 20 rounds or 30 with the extender.

  • Charlie

    Interesting, but I’ll stick with my Hi-Point carbines for a fraction of the price and cheaper ammo.

    • Komrad

      An also a fraction of the capacity. If I’m not mistaken, a 9mm Hi-Point has an 8 round capacity (maybe it’s 10?), significantly less than the 15 round standard for an M1 carbine and much less than the 30 and 40 round mags that are available.

      Sure, you can get 15 round promags, but I wouldn’t trust a promag to do anything.

      Now, maybe a Kel-Tec SUB-2000 or similar, you might have a point, but a Hi-Point Carbine’s only good points are price and the warranty.

    • mosinman

      i love hipoints but this is probably better in most ways, except for ammo costs and the warrenty

  • W

    wtf are you talking about?

    • Some guy

      I’m no ballistics expert, but this NYPD officer seemed to have good luck with M1 carbines during his time on the force:

      “Jim Cirillo, when he worked on the NYPD Stakeout Squad, said the .30 Carbine seemed a more decisive weapon in actual gunfights than anything else in their arsenal, which included slug-loaded, 12-gauge shotguns.”

      http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3197/is_n5_v41/ai_18421767/

      http://www.amazon.com/Guns-Bullets-Gunfights-Modern-Day-Gunfighter/dp/0873648773/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1327043186&sr=8-1

    • http://www.predatorwild.com Heath

      Seriously, can’t shoot through clothing?!?!?!?

    • W

      “How is that trolling?? You need to turn down your sensitivity on your troll radar as I am not lance, and replying to every post with “wtf are you talking about”. Is actually trolling itself.”

      No, actually it is not. It is a question in response to the “korean war cartridge that cant shoot through layered clothing”, which is soldier rumors that are scientifically untrue and spawned from fears soldiers faced in the frozen peninsula.

      Idk why lance is such a sensitive issue. just drop it and the trolling fears. I never said you were trolling, but i was asking for a reason why you came to such a ridiculous conclusion about a weapon system and cartridge you seem to know little about.

      The 30 caliber was a PDW in its era…a weapon intended for second line troops rather than front line infantry squads as a longer ranged alternative than the submachine gun. Its recoil was moderate, as was its weight, especially when compared to a M1 Garand.

  • Jose Antonio
    • 276 pedersen

      The box pulls through again!

    • W

      yeah that seals the deal on the lack of frozen clothing penetrating ability, thanks for the link!

      don’t believe everything you read on wikipedia. i thought we were smarter than that by now…

  • BLG

    Some may balk at this rifle, but I think it looks fun to shoot and my wife might even enjoy this one.

  • FourString

    I mean, the 5.7x28mm is great and all, but the .45 ACP has been around since forever and it’s not exactly a terrible round simply because it’s old. On the contrary, it’s probably more effective against soft targets at self defense ranges.

    By your logic, we should throw out the older workforce just because they’re old, even if they may be more experienced than younger professionals and are just as (or even more) productive. Maybe this is why a good chunk of the American private sector practices this, because of a similar mentality: that simply because something is new it is better, even when all evidence points to the contrary.

    • W

      “By your logic, we should throw out the older workforce just because they’re old”

      This comparison between corporate economics and firearms is completely irrelevant.

      Using the logic that many resort to when justify “bringing back the 7.62 and 45 ACP arguments”, we should be using the bolt-action 30-06 because they are combat proven and have a longer range.

      The 45 ACP is not standardized by NATO. the 9x19mm was. Because American-allied NATO faced the prospect of a Soviet invasion after WWII until 1991, it made sense to standardize (which many countries didn’t do ironically). It also makes more sense to have 15 rounds (or 17 if a smart military adopts the Glock), than seven. Facing facts, 45 ACP FMJ performs similar to 9mm FMJ when it comes to “stopping power” or killing a human being. The only way 45 can become more effective is if the shooter uses hydrashok or +P whatever (of course, the same can be said about the 9mm as well)

      I find it ridiculous how we can use M885A1 and Mk 262 “improved” ammunition, but still stick with 9mm ball. The 9mm, when proper ammunition is employed, is a effective self-defense cartridge. Again, like I’ve said 1,000 times on this blog, the effectiveness of 9mm ball and the M9 is left to shot placement. 45 is no exception to this rule. Resorting to caliber size to compensate for training and marksmanship is utter stupidity.

      “even if they may be more experienced than younger professionals and are just as (or even more) productive.”

      If you worked in the corporate sector, you would understand the justification for this. next.

      “Maybe this is why a good chunk of the American private sector practices this, because of a similar mentality:”

      bingo. In the game of globalism, you take every advantage you can get and cut what you don’t need. That is one of the harsh realities of capitalism and a even harsher reality in corporate america.

      “that simply because something is new it is better, even when all evidence points to the contrary”

      Thats the problem. all evidence doesn’t point to the contrary. Younger workers, statistically, are less expensive assets due to rising healthcare costs in our country. Younger workers are also typically more adept at technical skills (such as computers) and adaptable.

      In the firearms world, new usually, but not always, means a design that has evolved. Newer technologies emerge: polygonal rifling, nickel boron coating, new rails, new cartridges, advanced polymers, evolved optics. Things change. jesus christ, using the logic of the nostalgic firearms people, we would still be using bolt action 06’s and 1911’s.

    • FourString

      I suppose from a very shrewd, Machiavellian standpoint, you make a good point. There’s different corporate philosophies but loyalty is underrated in the majority of American companies. It’s just a harsh fact, I suppose. I was merely using an analogy but if it’s irrelevant to you, more power to you. I don’t really care.

    • FourString

      Not to mention your rant against 1911s (we’d be using bolt action .30-06s and .45 1911s) is unfounded and a straw man. Modern firearms still use the 45 ACP and for good reason. USP, HK45, G21SF, PX4 Storm, to name a few. I was talking about the round, not the 1911, but nice non sequitur.

    • W

      “I suppose from a very shrewd, Machiavellian standpoint, you make a good point. There’s different corporate philosophies but loyalty is underrated in the majority of American companies. It’s just a harsh fact, I suppose. I was merely using an analogy but if it’s irrelevant to you, more power to you. I don’t really care.”

      The standpoint comes from being a private entrepreneur. In my experience, wealthy people become wealthy by listening to other wealthy people…not whining about 21st century economic realities.

      “Not to mention your rant against 1911s (we’d be using bolt action .30-06s and .45 1911s)” is unfounded and a straw man.”

      You are actually putting words in my mouth (I never mentioned the 1911 initially). YOU mentioned the 45 ACP being in service for a long time…a reality that couldn’t have happened without the 1911. It is anything but a straw man argument.

      You seem to believe that old is just as good,when it is demonstrated that it is not. Firearms and their cartridges evolve, as they should. The 1911 and 45 ACP is a perfect example of why old isn’t better, and the compelling reasons why it was replaced.

      “Modern firearms still use the 45 ACP and for good reason.”

      Yeah its called marketing. Glock, H&K, and SIG never intended their pistols to be produced in 45 ACP, though they eventually were because the firearms market is in the United States. Consider also that most American gun owners, in all their wisdom, don’t consider any other cartridge a real cartridge unless its 45 ACP (which is childish and ridiculous but a fact). There is so much mythology and bullshit surrounding the 45 ACP, though many still believe it is the end all of pistol cartridges.

      “USP, HK45, G21SF, PX4 Storm, to name a few. I was talking about the round, not the 1911, but nice non sequitur.”

      Hey wise guy, if you cannot follow my logic, then don’t open up a can of worms “that simply because something is new it is better, even when all evidence points to the contrary.” Your post, your can of worms. I addressed it.

      “All evidence points to the contrary?” thatll have to be your little secret.

    • FourString

      “we’d be using bolt action .30-06s and .45 1911s” maybe it wasn’t clear but THIS is a straw man

      I don’t know what your problem is with the 45 acp. It works fine. I’m not touting it as the greatest man stopper on earth. No firearm or cartridge is superior to another; each one is made for a specific purpose and are simply tools for one’s usage. It’s not “marketing bullshit” but simply personal preference.

    • W

      “maybe it wasn’t clear but THIS is a straw man”

      Maybe I wasn’t clear, but that is not what I said.

      “…bringing back the 7.62 and 45 ACP arguments”

      that is what i said. huge difference. It was you that first mentioned the 45 ACP, not me. Try and keep up.

      “I don’t know what your problem is with the 45 acp.”

      Nothing, I own two of them (one of which I load with 45 super). I recognize and respect 45 ACP for what it is, though it is no the end-all pistol cartridge like others want you to believe. I merely mentioned there is a reason why it was replaced.

      “It works fine. I’m not touting it as the greatest man stopper on earth. No firearm or cartridge is superior to another; each one is made for a specific purpose and are simply tools for one’s usage. It’s not “marketing bullshit” but simply personal preference.”

      And once again, you are putting words in my mouth. I never said “marketing bullshit”. If you know anything about the histories of H&K, SIG, and Glock, you know they were forced to produce pistols in 45 ACP because the American firearms market is so prolific. A company that does not offer 45 for their pistol is at a significant disadvantage. These are facts.

    • FourString

      “Things change. jesus christ, using the logic of the nostalgic firearms people, we would still be using bolt action 06′s and 1911′s.”

      How exactly did I put words in your mouth?

    • W

      ok, if you cannot keep up then never mind.

    • FourString

      I didn’t realize condescension was an effective means of persuasion.

    • FourString

      “Yeah its called marketing. Glock, H&K, and SIG never intended their pistols to be produced in 45 ACP, though they eventually were because the firearms market is in the United States. […] There is so much mythology and bullshit surrounding the 45 ACP, though many still believe it is the end all of pistol cartridges.”

      Perhaps my fault was in paraphrasing. I am not trying to put words in your mouth. Anyway, to be fair, I actually prefer a nine milly. Hence the earlier statement that there is no one cartridge for the job. I have no misplaced nostalgia of any sort. I am not an old timer, if you graciously assumed I was one. In fact, I’m plenty young and am taking my minor in Business Management, and so I may have shown my concerns for the aging population because despite margins, laying off older workers is highly problematic for consumer spending and the economy at large (not just a moral issue). I predict that more progressive companies like Google will treat their older workers well, as universities do their professors right now. A lot of the business practices today are not looking at the bigger, long term picture. They operate on a quarterly basis and react to the market rather than anticipate it. Anyway, what do you care, this is all irrelevant. And your condescension is duly noted, as always. :)

      And with your logic that when I spoke of the 45 that I must be automatically speaking of the 1911, well no you brought it up first. I never included the 1911 in my premise, although even then, special forces and SWAT teams employ the 1911 in their arsenal for their reasons. Then again the same teams use P226’s. Firearms and cartridge sizes are just tools tailored to specific tasks. Come to think of it though, yes, the 45 is predominant in American culture, maybe even a little unhealthily.

      But here’s one example where a 45 would be more practical than a 9mm: California’s ten round limit. =/ Although I like the cost of practicing with a 9mm, I’m not a hundred percent positive that firing 9mm at an assailant will stop him. Shot placement counts, but how do you know you will get that optimum shot off? The range is different from a real world emergency. Shit happens. I’m probably more confident hitting a threat with 10 rounds of 45 loaded to a comparable pressure and load than with only 10 rounds of 9mm to work with (damn those extremists in California legislature). Am I a bad shot? Hardly. The 45 makes bigger roles (that’s pretty objective there), so if I’m off by a centimeter (due to various conditions), I may have less chances of getting killed by a returning shot.

      Perhaps you may or may not have referred to +P loads in a 9 milly, and yeah there’s that, but then there are +P loads in a 45 ACP too. Again, to each his own. I respect your arguments for 9mm, but honestly the military’s decision to switch from 45 to 9mm is a poor reference: soldiers complain about stopping power since under Geneva Conventions they cannot use hollow points. It’s one of the attributes that the current search for a new service pistol is trying to address. I mean, 10mm is perhaps the more viable “manstopper” pistol cartridge out there, but 45 isn’t that much worse than a 9mm to begin with.

      Apologies if I don’t analyze or pick apart your argument line by line, but I find that kinda tedious. It’s not that I “can’t keep up”, it’s just when you start being condescending I kind of really don’t care anymore. It’s not like you’re giving me a degree or a job, either, so I have no obligations to impress you, diss you, or anything like that. And off I go to studying again.

    • FourString

      To clarify. Yes I prefer a 9 milly on the range for cost and the shooting experience, but for a home defense situation I would hope to have a stronger punching firearm on me, be it 45 ACP or .357 Magnum. And that’s just my choice. I’m not saying you should too.

      Annnnd all of this goes back to…
      Sally’s ridicule of the .30 as old and outdated. It’s not the age that determines the effectiveness, it’s just the purpose you have for the cartridge. It’s like picking from a toolset. You don’t take the flathead screwdriver for a phillips screw.

    • W

      “Perhaps my fault was in paraphrasing. I am not trying to put words in your mouth.”

      If thats the case, no harm done :) I am a very social, extroverted person with a unusual sense of humor so don’t mistake my remarks as angry.

      “Anyway, to be fair, I actually prefer a nine milly. Hence the earlier statement that there is no one cartridge for the job.”

      haha, there is nothing wrong with the 9mm. I carry a Glock 19 Gen 4 loaded with Winchester Ranger 124 grain +P, which is extremely adequate for self defense.

      “I have no misplaced nostalgia of any sort. I am not an old timer, if you graciously assumed I was one. In fact, I’m plenty young and am taking my minor in Business Management, and so I may have shown my concerns for the aging population because despite margins, laying off older workers is highly problematic for consumer spending and the economy at large (not just a moral issue).”

      Oh absolutely, I was more or less speaking from a corporate view and in an essence, playing devil’s advocate. There is immense pressure from wall street on major corporations to outsource production for the benefit of the stockholders. Without a middle class, a country’s tax base becomes severely threatened, not to mention implications of rising health care and many, many other factors. Personally, I view job experience as immensely more important than age or college education even. Looking back at my posts, I could be mistaken for a corporate shill (which i am not LOL).

      “I predict that more progressive companies like Google will treat their older workers well, as universities do their professors right now. A lot of the business practices today are not looking at the bigger, long term picture. They operate on a quarterly basis and react to the market rather than anticipate it. Anyway, what do you care, this is all irrelevant. And your condescension is duly noted, as always.”

      Like I said before, their is a drastic shift in the global economy right now and we are facing problems that we do not even recognize as problems right now. Its the name of the game…and this reality bites.

      “Come to think of it though, yes, the 45 is predominant in American culture, maybe even a little unhealthily.”

      The 1911 made the 45 ACP, that is why i included it in my example. It would be marketing suicide for a foreign based company not to produce a new handgun in 45 ACP.

      “But here’s one example where a 45 would be more practical than a 9mm: California’s ten round limit. =/ Although I like the cost of practicing with a 9mm”

      aaahhhh, yes. that is a entirely different issue :( california. If I lived in California, it would make perfect sense to have a 45 since the advantages of the 9mm’s high magazine capacity is nullified with 10 round magazines.

      “I’m not a hundred percent positive that firing 9mm at an assailant will stop him. Shot placement counts, but how do you know you will get that optimum shot off?”

      Statistically, there have been cases of 45 ACP failing to instantly stop a assailant. That is why I continue to preach that shot placement is everything. Improper shot placement with a 357 will even fail to stop a assailant. Assailants shot a point blank with a 12 gauge 00 buck in the chest can still maintain their motor movements for a limited amount of time.

      I believe that 9mm is more than adequate for a self defense cartridge, though its a matter of preference. I would rather have 17 rounds in 9mm than even 10 in 45. That is just me.

      “The range is different from a real world emergency. Shit happens. I’m probably more confident hitting a threat with 10 rounds of 45 loaded to a comparable pressure and load than with only 10 rounds of 9mm to work with (damn those extremists in California legislature).”

      In the case of california, it would be sensible to use a 45 ACP. Your logic is sound there.

      “Am I a bad shot? Hardly. The 45 makes bigger roles (that’s pretty objective there), so if I’m off by a centimeter (due to various conditions), I may have less chances of getting killed by a returning shot.”

      If you can accurately and rapidly engage target with the 45, then I wouldn’t blame you for wanting to use it. I concealed carry a 9mm, but i take by go-bag, i carry by HK 45.

      “I respect your arguments for 9mm, but honestly the military’s decision to switch from 45 to 9mm is a poor reference”

      You have to understand what the military deals with in order to explain the justification for a switch. Soldiers, like policemen, may not be necessarily the best trained when it comes to handguns (i have seen some scary shit). I can understand the advantages of having a larger magazine capacity (9mm). For more highly trained special operations, it is not surprising that they utilize 45 ACP, which requires for more training to operate effectively.

      “soldiers complain about stopping power since under Geneva Conventions they cannot use hollow points. It’s one of the attributes that the current search for a new service pistol is trying to address. I mean, 10mm is perhaps the more viable “manstopper” pistol cartridge out there, but 45 isn’t that much worse than a 9mm to begin with.”

      for FMJ, no. I believe that its disingenuous to field more effective 5.56mm cartridges (like the M885A1 and Mk 262) and not field a more effective 9mm. We certainly have the technology to make 9mm more effective as a combat cartridge to soldiers, though pistols are still rarely used in direct combat.

      “Apologies if I don’t analyze or pick apart your argument line by line, but I find that kinda tedious. It’s not that I “can’t keep up”, it’s just when you start being condescending I kind of really don’t care anymore. It’s not like you’re giving me a degree or a job, either, so I have no obligations to impress you, diss you, or anything like that. And off I go to studying again.”

      i don’t expect you to. I remain empathetic.

      “To clarify. Yes I prefer a 9 milly on the range for cost and the shooting experience, but for a home defense situation I would hope to have a stronger punching firearm on me, be it 45 ACP or .357 Magnum. And that’s just my choice. I’m not saying you should too.”

      If you live in california, then it is understanding to use 45 and 357.

      “Sally’s ridicule of the .30 as old and outdated. It’s not the age that determines the effectiveness, it’s just the purpose you have for the cartridge. It’s like picking from a toolset. You don’t take the flathead screwdriver for a phillips screw.”

      I know many people that use M1 carbines for home defense, simply because they are simple to use and accurate. the 30 caliber cartridge is actually powerful, especially with hollow points.

    • FourString

      Yeah, if I lived in another state, I would definitely snatch up a 17-20 round magazine from mec gar or factory and use it in a 9mm for self defense. For now I’ll content myself with the FNP9 and USP45… xD

  • mosinman

    30 carbine is like a hot .357load, which isnt anything to laugh at

  • El Freddio
    • El Freddio

      dammint, should have read down this had been posted already :P

  • mosinman

    i think the only way that would EVER happen is if you shot at someone at 1000 plus yards and managed to hit them,with the target frozen solid winter clothes

  • bullzebub

    shot placement.

    • Sally scrotpuncher

      I like how your questioning battle tested marines’ shot placement. A corps known for their emphasis on marksmanship. It’s a terrible combat round. A good HD and police round maybe but has no place on the front lines as it was designed for rear echelon supply troops. Either way it is defiantly a step up from pistol cal carbs.

    • W

      yep…shot placement is fundamental to stopping a assailant.

  • El Freddio

    Sounds like shot placement issues if you ask me. This round went through body armour on WW2 Japanese soilders.
    “Lt. Col. John George, a small arms expert and intelligence officer serving in Burma with Merrill’s Marauders, reported that .30 carbine bullets would easily penetrate the front and back of steel helmets, as well as the body armor used by Japanese forces of the era” Wikipedia
    Although the .30 round has had issues with ‘stopping power’, it would have a lot less compaired to a .30-06 rifle. I could see this weapon being a great home defence carbine, but I’m no expert. Light and having low recoil would be very handy if some punk has just woken you up by getting up to no good in your house, plus it’s a step up from a pistol carbine, and if someone has problems with more powerful weapons (12 gauge, .223 etc), this would be just the ticket.
    I do argee this rifle probably won’t go too far, but you never know.

  • http:cmblake6.wordpress.com cmblake6

    That blowback operation gives me pause. It might not be a radical cartridge, but it still has a lot more c.u.p. than I want to trust to plain blowback.

  • somebody

    The .30 carbine isn’t good because according to rumor it wouldn’t go through the North Korean/Chinese coats, but the .45 acp is good because why? If the North Korean/Chinese coats could stop .30 carbine, then they defiantly would have been able to stop .45 acp, so why is the .45 acp good but the .30 carbine isn’t, and if you are going to say that isn’t true then look at this:

    http://www.brassfetcher.com/index_files/Page1242.htm

    That is the 7.62x25mm tokarev going through a vest that can stop .45 acp, the .30 carbine fires a heavier bullet of the same diameter at a higher velocity.

    • W

      oh stop it stop it! you are citing facts with references! youll make heads explode doing that ;)

  • cc19

    Anyone can play the, “who said what,” game, but finding an expert source is another:

    http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?50783-Carbine-Effectivness&s=0b26be9d5f7d91869675940a93034daa&p=669243#post669243

  • W

    and nobody said you were trolling, i was asking what the f–k you were talking about with the 30 caliber unable to penetrate thick clothing.

    besides what you’ve read on wikipedia, the 30. caliber was well liked in the pacific theater, though disliked in extreme cold weather (like Belgium or Korea). Like other smaller caliber weapons, it would have less consistent reliability than the ’06. Considering the 30 carbine cartridge produces about 1,200 joules of energy, i remain dubious of lack of penetrating ability claims.

  • http://www.predatorwild.com Heath

    String = Spring ?

  • W

    oh, you obtained your information from wikipedia LOL. ok whatever. Like i said before, the M1 performed admirably in roles it was intended. As a frontline combat rifle, not so much.

  • Brian P.

    And you’re complaining about an 18″ barrel, as opposed to a 16″ barrel…why? I’ll take an 18″ barrel over a 16″ barrel, any day.

    • Letel

      Stop the gun talk. Why would someone other than law enforcement use the killer equipment as toy, game or hubbie? Get a life guys. This cannot be good for hunting usage. So, if not why does it make sense to have one of these GUNS that, if place into the wrong hands (and there are many), innocent lives are lost. Learn my brothers & sisters learn. The facts are clear for everyone to see.

      • FourString

        @Letel: Hi Letel, I’m essentially what you call a gun totin’ liberal. I’m all for liberal policies except for gun control. You’re gravely mistaken with your generalizations. It’s not only bad guys who use guns. Good guys, perhaps in greater numbers, use them daily to defend their homes. It also depends on where you live. Some need protection in outlying areas where cops are more than 10 minutes away. You can’t just generalize that civilian gun ownership is bad. Not to mention in places like South Korea or Japan, the mafia get ahold of guns despite the laws banning ownership among civilians. Open up your mind and think about all situations before thinking that guns are unnecessary.

  • Charlie

    All this talk made me look at M1 Carbines on Gunbroker.com, both real and commercial. I sort of like the old ones better, but right now price would be controlling, although I would prefer a normal but stock configuration. On the other hand, I just picked up an old Marlin 30AS that looks brand new. It’s sweet.

  • MrBlackJack

    Interesting concept—old round in a modern layout. Idk if I agree with it (i’ll postpone judgment until I actually fire one), but it certainly IS different.

  • Charlie

    Letel: hunting doesn’t have anything to do with the 2nd Amendment. You don’t need to have a good reason to posses a rifle. M! carbine rounds are fun to plink with IF you re-load, otherwise a bit expensive. However, small game may be taken with this round. Also, in a hollow-point, it is a great home protection set-up.

  • easygoing

    The FRS-15 California ”Featureless Stock would look cool on this carbine.

  • http://www.facebook.com/james.c.gilbert.3 James C. Gilbert

    And with Hornady’s new 30 carbine S.D. Ammo, this would be really, really nice for an H.D. for the whole family……And cheap mags too…..

  • Silverbullet404

    I just finished watching a vid on you tube. It was a .30 carbine of the military vintage. Not scoped. He was consistently hitting the targets @ 250 yards. Looked like about 2 3/4″ MOA. I have been a gun guy for over 50 years and heard all the rumors about the .30 carbine. I was totally impressed, astounded actually after hearing nothing but bad stuff. With reasonable bullet weight at closer range, this gun is a shooter. Nobody ever seems to want to try one because of all the bad rap. And with the velocity, Im not going to stand in front of one of these little beasts, are you? Strange to me how my grandson constantly bags deer with his little .22-250 but this .30 carbine wont kill deer? Something is seriously wrong with this picture.

  • Douglas Self

    Barrel has to be 18-1/4″, else it’s a pistol and subject to Federal and State regulation as such. This seems to be more of a PDW anyway. I have an M1A1 (paratrooper) carbine, it shoots so sweetly that with the stock removed (which is ILLEGAL in California) it can be easily handled one-handed. That’s why I never understood why the .30 cal M1 cartridge isn’t more used as an intermediate assault rifle round; especially as a hollow-point it’d had better hitting power than the NATO 5.56 mm and the weight per round is about the same. You’d just lose a bit on accuracy beyond 250 yards but most small-arms engagements, outside of sniping, are less than that.