Navy to buy additional FN SCAR Mk. 13, Mk 16, Mk. 17 and Mk. 20

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The Navy has announced its intention to buy additional FN SCAR Mk. 16 (5.56mm), Mk. 17 (7.62mm) and Mk. 20 (SSR / Sniper Support Rifle) along with FN Mk. 13 grenade launchers in order to sustain inventory levels.

From Solicitation Number N0016412RJN25

The Government intends to procure Combat Assault Rifles (CAR) and Enhanced Grenade Launcher Modules (EGLM). The weapon systems consist of MK16 Mod 0 (CAR-L), MK17 Mod 0 (CAR-H), MK20 Mod 0 (SSR), MK13 Mod 0 (40mm EGLM), PPL and engineering services. The requirements are in accordance with a government statement of work and technical product specifications. These items have been determined to be non-commercial and intended to fulfill a sustainment of modular weapons.

The North American Industry Classification System (NAICS) Code for this procurement is 332994. Naval Surface Warfare Center, Crane Division intends to enter into a Firm Fixed Price, IDIQ (5-year) type contract. The contract will be F.O.B. Destination with Inspection and Acceptance by DCMA Northern Europe. This anticipated procurement will be solicited on a sole source basis with FN Herstal SA, Rue Voie De Liege 33, 4040 Herstal, Belgium, CAGE: N0017, in accordance with FAR 6.302-1 only one responsible source and no other supplies or services will satisfy agency requirements.

[ Many thanks to Rijoenpial for emailing us the tip. ]




Steve Johnson

Founder and Dictator-In-Chief of TFB. A passionate gun owner, a shooting enthusiast and totally tacti-uncool. Favorite first date location: any gun range. Steve can be contacted here.


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  • http://gdziewojsko.wordpress.com Pawel K. Malicki

    Interesting that they will buy both Mk-16 and Mk-17, not only Mk-17 with caliber conversion kits.

    Anyway Seals will use SCAR!

    • 18D

      We have to remember that SOCOM didn’t ditch the MK16 because it wasn’t capable. They pitched it because it wasn’t enough of an improvement (i disagree) over the current 5.56 systems to spend the money (precious defense budget $). SOCOM operators actually loved the system. So it doesn’t surprise me that the Navy is picking up the MK16. The 16 has been used for the last 3 or 4 years with a number of SOF units with great success.

    • Other Steve

      Is there any real world use of that ‘kit’ by anyone? I’ve never seen it, seen it in use, or even heard about other than as a design goal. Are you even sure the 556 into a 17 kit exists?

      • 18D

        The 5.56 to 7.62 SCAR kit is a NO GO. While the two “upper” receivers are identical in operation, they differ in length. Specifically the ejection port. Obviously the MK17 has the larger opening. I’m pretty sure that you couldn’t run a battle rifle cartridge like the 7.62 with a 5.56 EP and still have reliable functioning.

        The other way around is GTG. As a matter of fact, the only components required to make the change is a new barrel, bolt, “lower” receiver, and magazines. Yes there is a prototype kit currently being tested with SOCOM. There are some SOCOM units like the Army SF, that are hoping the conversion will be the answer to replacing other weapon systems currently in use.

        The conversion kit gives SOF units the ability to have the SCAR in 5.56 and 7.62 as opposed to just the latter. Not every Special Operations command will spend the money to buy the MK16 like the Navy. These other commands will be able to save money and still get the weapon they need. In other words, the kit allows units to have their cake and eat it too.

    • Other Steve

      That MK20 is pretty damn cool.

      Needs a realistic civ price and Pmags for it before I’d jump. Just the Pmags would be huge considering how rare 17S mags are.

  • Al

    I wonder how many they’re buying…

  • 18D

    As a former

  • 18D

    As a former SOF soldier and current RDAT&E contractor for Crane, I have followed the SCAR since it’s inception. One thing that was clear from the beginning was that the SEALs were one of the biggest supporters of the weapon system. About a month ago I talked with some former team mates that are currently operational in Afghanistan about the who was currently using the SCAR. There were rumors that

    • 18D

      (cont.) SOCOM was pitching the system, so I wanted to find out the scoop. They said that the SCAR was still in heavy rotation and that units were even looking at purchasing more MK16’s despite reports of its demise. This article confirms my information, and I’m glad to see the SCAR’s continued success overseas. It’s a great weapon system!

      Hey Lance, still think I’m making up my own info? ;)

      • FAL FAN

        Yeah, I have seen Lance ignorantly trash the SCAR rifle as well, so it is good to see him proven wrong again. Larry Vickers and Monty LeClair both seem to disagree with lance, too.

        BTW, the HK416 system is a complete bust and when the contracts are up they are going away. The SCAR might be being bought in 556 to replace the HK416, which would not surprise me.

      • Lance

        I know some units use the SCAR H BUT it it didn’t replace the M-4 and other weapons in service. The Navy buy is to replace worn out SCARs but most SEAL Ive seen use M-4s still and don’t need plastic junk like your loved SCAR.

        If you keep trying to be nasty to me w/o me even reading the article id have Steve remove you from the blog pal. Keep it on subject instead of personal attacks.

      • W

        yes, this assertion is correct 18D. the most damning case against the SCAR is the so-called budget cuts being applied to the military. In the words of ex-CIA operative Barry Eisler

        http://my.firedoglake.com/barryeisler/2011/12/06/leon-panetta-is-full-of-shit/

        “…In fact, even the most massive cuts currently under consideration would return American military spending only to 2007 levels…”

        ohhhhh…what a tragedy! (sarcasm) our military was so deficient in 2007…

        Credible experts praise the SCAR rifles. With the introduction of the Mk 20, i would enjoy seeing the future of the M110 in peril.

      • Brandon

        What is it specifically that operators love so much about the SCAR? Reliability? Accuracy? Ergonomics? Reciprocating handle?

      • http://gdziewojsko.wordpress.com Pawel K. Malicki

        Can you please provide any information on Mk 20 performance, and how does it compares with M110 / Mk 11 ? What is reception of this weapon platform? Is accuracy there?

      • 18D

        @Lance- First of all, I know some units use the MK17, what’s your point? That’s what I’ve been saying.

        The SEALs use the M4, MK18 MOD0/1, MK12 MOD1, Recce, HK416…….again, I’m not sure what your point is?

        They don’t need plastic junk? There’s plastic on the M4 pattern guns also! It’s called use of modern materials to make a gun lighter, stronger, more durable, take your pick.

        Lastly, my last comment isn’t “nasty” to you. It’s not even mean. It’s a lighthearted poke at comments you made to ME on a previous thread about the SCAR. It has nothing to with you reading this article. A normal male adult would have looked at that comment and said something like ‘touche'” or “yeah,yeah,yeah, you got me on this one”, but you take it out of proportion.

        Keep it on subject? Did you even read my entire comment or did you just skip to the part where your name was? If my comment is off topic, then what’s that say about yours?

        I didn’t know you and Steve were such good friends that you can get anyone you want kicked off this blog. I guess the only thing I have to say about that is…………Do it then……..I mean since you and Steve are so tight.

      • 18D

        @Brandon- When guys pick up the SCAR for the first time I almost always hear the same thing. “Man this thing is a lot smaller than I thought it would be. It looked bulky.” That’s usually followed by. “The cheek weld is nice on this thing and it really feels good.”

        Once those guys run the gun, they find out its more accurate than their previous M4’s. I think that’s due in part to the systems inherent accuracy, but I think its also due to the fact that their M4’s were worn out too.

        So to answer your question, guys are liking not having to clean their guns as much and that the system runs cooler during sustained fire. Many say that they like the charging handle better as well. I hate to use the same old explanation but guys like it for the same reason they like any gun. It’s really accurate, ergonomic as any M4, reliable with and without a suppressor (this is a big one), and doesn’t require as much maintenance. Recoil impulse is very soft and the SCAR is much more user friendly when using night optics (another big one).

        This is what guys that have used it overseas have told me. My opinion of the gun is pretty much the same. Although I have never had the pleasure to use the SCAR in combat.

      • Lance

        The new SCARs will not replace other weapons systems after 4 years of combat and intense training they need to be replaced since that much action would wear out any weapon. The main fact is the Mk-16 will be phased out by the Mk-17 and official SOCOM plans on Military.com show this.

        The Major down side I mentioned is the crappy butstock and lower plastic receiver on the SCAR series the MK 20 is the exception many reports of them breaking in combat.

      • W

        To Pawel:

        “Can you please provide any information on Mk 20 performance, and how does it compares with M110 / Mk 11 ? What is reception of this weapon platform? Is accuracy there?”

        “The FN SCAR Sniper Support Rifle (SSR) is a tailored design for long-range precision fire applications while also providing capability to fight close in. Based on the MK 17 SCAR, the SSR is capable of sub-minute of angle accuracy out to and beyond 1,000 yards.”

        There is no official data on the field comparisons between the Mk 20 and M110, though based on a phone call from a old friend, I would certainly say the Mk 20 is superior in many aspects. The Mk 20 was only fielded as of six months ago, so data is currently materializing. Expect more information within a year. I stand by my contention however. Given what little data is available on the Mk 20, I can already see it as more ideal and superior to the M110.

        http://www.fnhusa.com/mil/products/firearms/model.asp?fid=FNF065&gid=FNG020&mid=FNM0005

        http://www.fnhusa.com/mil/press/detail.asp?id=98

        here’s one for lance:

        “The objective of the SCAR program was to develop a single weapon capable of complete caliber modularity. USSOCOM will complete development of a conversion kit that allows the operator to fire either 7.62mm or 5.56mm ammunition from the Mk 17 which meets the objective of the program. The system was designed and manufactured especially for special operators to replace the M4, Mk11, Mk12 and M14.” (emphasis on last paragraph)

        Wes Ticer, Major, USAF
        Media Relations Officer
        USSOCOM Public Affairs

        Take it for what it is, the sources come from FN. Since they deal specifically on a face-to-face basis with USSOCOM, I remain dubious of claims that they are dicking America’s special operations forces out of a product. I seriously doubt a firearms company that grows as powerful, wealthy, and influential by screwing over their customers…

      • 18D

        @Pawel K. Malicki- W described the MK20 very well. I’ll add to that by saying that I’ve had the chance to run the SSR and it’s absolutely awesome! Compared to the M110, the SSR has equal or better accuracy, and felt to me like the recoil impulse was a little heavier. A little heavier that would probably go unnoticed to most shooters. During recoil was interesting. The SSR seems to track straight back with no felt “mechanical” impulse, while the

      • 18D

        @Pawel K. Malicki- W described the MK20 very well. I’ll add to that by saying that I’ve had the chance to run the SSR and it’s absolutely awesome! Compared to the M110, the SSR has equal or better accuracy, and felt to me like the recoil impulse was a little heavier. A little heavier that would probably go unnoticed to most shooters. During recoil was interesting. The SSR seems to track straight back with no felt “mechanical” impulse, while the M110 seems to have more torque. I’m not sure why, but its something I noted.

        The SSR’s trigger is noticeably better than the MK17 and the stock brings the shooter right on the scope. The NF 3.5-10 NXS gives the SSR the ability to hit with precision out to the maximum range of the system.

        Operators say it’s super accurate, 100% reliable, and easy to handle. I know the SEALs love it and are looking at replacing the MK11 and MK14 weapon systems. I think they are making the right choice.

      • W

        Ill add that the mk 20 has a “forward assist”, which the M110 doesn’t have (trust me, all rifles need one). They sure can be reloaded much quieter and clear malfunctions faster than the M110.

        Adding even more (im getting tired LOL), the M110 is not a common platform and the “AR10″ parts not interchangeable with different manufacturers. My point? the Mk 20 features 60% parts commonality with the SCAR 17. Still want to keep the M110?

      • http://gdziewojsko.wordpress.com Pawel K. Malicki

        Thanks W and 18D. I really appreciate your information’s.

        For me the whole SCAR concept of modularity was great but the question was will it work well in the field (it looked too good to be true)? Now it seems it is as good as legacy platforms and sometimes even better, and it adds this whole modularity thingy :)

    • Lance

      Most SOCOM users are using the H model mostly due to the fact most M-14s and M-110 where snatched by the regular Army and Marines years ago. The L model was capped off and these new shipment will replace no other gun but to get new gun to replace older worn out weapons do SOCOM also stated the L model will e retired in 2014 but he H model will be used much longer.

      Not all users are won over the HMAR lost to the HK 416 and Marines didn’t like the charging handle and ergonomics SEAL where different are the main user of the SCAR with H models also in some other SOCOM units.

      • FAL FAN

        SEALs and Delta are going to end contract with HK 416 soon. They hate it now because it is a reliability nightmare and HK customer service is horrible. The Marines will end up thinking the same way once they get beyond a few handbuilt models for testing. The HK416 was great in very limited numbers, but when they had to start producing it in large scale the quality turned to crap.

      • FAL FAN

        And no, the SCAR gets picked over the M14 and the AR 762 rifles because it is far more reliable. It isn’t because they were already taken by the army. That is a silly argument. The Navy could have bought more Knights Armament ARs if they wanted, but the SCAR is superior because it is lighter and it is far more reliable.

      • Lance

        No FAL man the M-14 did win over some AR-10 style guns ten years ago. Yes SOCOM dose use the H model BUT its due to modularity not relighability both AR 10 and M-14 are BIG weapons compared to a Compact SCAR H.

        As for the 416 I dont know ehere you got that from MARSOC and Delta have been using the HK 416 for years and they are buying more of them.

      • Lance

        And the M-27 has gotten really great reviews and more are being bought.

      • 18D

        As stated by others previously, the thought that the SCAR is being bought because the Army and Marines took all the M14’s and M110’s is ridiculous! That’s not even close to being true. The M110 is not a SOCOM standard gun. SOCOM never adopted the M110. As for the M14, there are very few M14’s and MK14’s in circulation in conventional units. The SEAL teams use the MK14 EBR more than any other unit in the military. Why would they have less than the Army or Marines? What’s wrong with the ones they have?

        Worn out SCAR’s? Come on! The SCAR systems currently being used have not yet reached the end of their service life. They’ve only been in use since 2004-2005. To wear out a SCAR receiver would take decades of hard use. Nobody has worn out their SCAR to that point. If anything is worn out, its the barrel or small components, which can easily be replaced due to the modularity nature of the gun.

        The MK16 was not “capped” by NAVSPECWAR. Hell, it wasn’t “capped” by any of the SOCOM subordinate commands, including JSOC. That means that any branch of service is welcome to buy MK16’s on their own if they so deem necessary, just like the Navy.

        Retired in 2014? Negative! In 2014 the plan is to switch to the MK17 IF the 5.56 conversion offers the capability needed to run both calibers. That is not a SOCOM initiative. That is an ARSOC initiative and more specifically an ARSFC initiative. There is nothing that says those plans won’t change, and there is absolutely nothing that says any other branch of service will have to follow ARSOC’s lead.

        Who cares about the HAMR? That’s not even a good argument. Besides, the

      • 18D

        Something that I didn’t mention before was that SOCOM does have plans to stop using the MK16. However, this will NOT “retire” it. Operators will more than likely have the option of using the MK16, but the plan is to stop buying them in 2014.

        We have to remember that the original solicitation was for a weapon system that used a “common” receiver for the 5.56 and 7.62. Operators scratched that idea because they didn’t want to add weight to the 5.56 platform. So, they changed the requirement to two separate platforms.

        Fastforward to just a few years ago and operators have changed their mind. They asked for a conversion kit to convert the MK17 to 5.56. This kit has been in development for the last few years and has already been tested and fielded. Former team mates of mine said these kits have already been ordered as well.

        With the “common” receiver concept having success in the field, the MK16 will likely have no use for MOST operators. However, MK16’s will REMAIN in inventory for operators that absolutely need the lightest 5.56 gun for the mission. The SCAR is here to stay and the 5.56/7.62 MK17 will be the answer! It will most likely replace a number of weapon systems in SOCOM inventory.

      • Lance

        We can argue over this forever. The official plan is to stop using and mostly get ride of Mk-16s by 2014 and Mk-17s will stay in service. However the SCAR will not be standard issue for all US forces like you hoped for. The USMC rejected the HMAR and Mk-16 for IAR and infantry rifle test. The Corps is planning on a M-16A5 and possibly buying Army improved M-4A1 once the army makes them. The SCAR 17 and Mk-20 will also NOT replace the M-110 with the Army pleased with the weapon and even plans a CQB version with shorter barrel and collapsible buttstock. Most SEALs and SOCOM ops still use a M-4 type weapon in service you can argue it complements other weapons well but NOT the be all and end all in small arms.

      • W

        “SEALs and Delta are going to end contract with HK 416 soon. They hate it now because it is a reliability nightmare and HK customer service is horrible.”

        i call BS. Consider that these are the kinds of people that bin weapons that cause problems for them. I have personally dealt with the 416, specifically ones that have remained in combat environments and use for years, and the only problem i have experienced is the folding front sight. BFD. Funny thing, on account of H&K’s “customer service problems”, i have had no issues with their customer service. Funny…

        “…but when they had to start producing it in large scale the quality turned to crap.”

        not hardly. try next time.

        “And no, the SCAR gets picked over the M14 and the AR 762 rifles because it is far more reliable. It isn’t because they were already taken by the army. That is a silly argument.”

        its ok 18D, ill go ahead and say its a stupid argument :) If anybody is going to give up equipment, itll be the regular army and not USSOCOOM (remember your history boys and girls, the US military wasn’t in prolonged war in the 90’s, yet USSOCOM continued to be deployed in combat operations). The M14 was replaced by the M16 and M21 was officially replaced by the M24 in 1988, yet, puzzlingly, they remained in service with Special Forces (accuratized M14s like the M21s and M25) throughout the 90s.

        “The Navy could have bought more Knights Armament ARs if they wanted, but the SCAR is superior because it is lighter and it is far more reliable.”

        In a nut shell yes. The Navy listens to input from important people (like SEALs) far better than the Army does. Sad to say, but, unfortunately, that is true.

        “No FAL man the M-14 did win over some AR-10 style guns ten years ago. Yes SOCOM dose use the H model BUT its due to modularity not relighability both AR 10 and M-14 are BIG weapons compared to a Compact SCAR H.”

        I would like more information on this “competition” with the M14 winning…I would have to say, given the facts, this assertion is bullshit. The M14 wasn’t rapidly re-fielded until after the involvement in US troops in Afghanistan and Iraq, circa approximately 2003. The Knights Armament SR25 has been in service since 1990, designated the Mk 11 mod 0. Again, something is still not adding up…

        “The M110 is not a SOCOM standard gun.”

        Here are the standards for a SOCOM standard, precision rifle:

        ttps://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity&mode=form&id=8d443a1c66be88df1e9f29112e711e8a&tab=core&_cview=0&cck=1&au=&ck=

        And the M110 does not meet those requirements (or else, ipso facto, it would have been in adopted in 2008 by USSOCOM). it meets Army requirements, though is faltering in maintaining that standard,

        https://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity&mode=form&id=224ffff679ab52b0333e79077372c757&tab=core&_cview=0

        “As for the M14, there are very few M14′s and MK14′s in circulation in conventional units.”

        Yes, interestingly enough, there are even fewer numbers refurbished by smith enterprises (only their Mk 14 and M14SE), which are vastly superior than the dusted off ones. This means, logically, the M14 requires expensive, aftermarket refurbishment to be even a decent DMR, when the SCAR comes with these features stock. No wonder the Navy is ordering more SCAR battle rifles…

        “The SEAL teams use the MK14 EBR more than any other unit in the military. Why would they have less than the Army or Marines? What’s wrong with the ones they have?

        they are obsolete, that is the problem ;) but im glad somebody logical understands the problem the military is facing with its current line of battle rifles. Sorry, “bringing back” the M14, when the fine print is magnified, doesn’t seem very logical now does it?

        The funny thing is that “piece of junk plastic gun”, with superior reliability, plug and play parts, modularity, and numerous other features is becoming more and more attractive. To me, the continued use of even decent M14s and AR10 platforms is far outweighing the costs of adopting the SCAR battle rifles. Funny how that happens.

        Thank you 18D for covering the bases!

  • MrSatyre

    Hey, does anyone know why the grenade launcher-only version doesn’t have a redesigned grip that puts the trigger finger more in line with the…uh, trigger? Seems that when not attached to a rifle, it doesn’t make much sense to pull with your two weakest fingers.

    • 18D

      They did that to keep the method of operation consistent for the operator, reducing training time. They also wanted to keep bore height to a minimum so that current electronic sighting systems would be more compatible. It does suck a little bit to have to pull with your middle finger, but the EGLM is awesome to operate when its mounted to the rifle, and the stand alone works great as well. It’s much more user friendly and accurate than the current M203 and M203 A1.

      • MrSatyre

        That makes sense. Thanks.

      • Colin

        How does it compare to m320? Does the trigger extension over the mag well hinder mag changes, or is it still easier (overall) than reaching forward for a different grip?

        BTW, cant really see the point of the folding grip on the 320 when mounted on a rifle, but thats just me :)

      • W

        i personally favor the mk 13 over the M320 simply because the former cants either left or right depending on the user’s dominant hand. As far as performance goes, the two are virtually identical, though i was faster with reloading the mk 13.

      • Alex-mac

        To use your index finger to aid in point shooting, haha.

  • BrianB

    SEALs may like the SCAR 16 but I heard several Green Berets refer to it as the Generals Pet project. None I spoke to liked it and mentioned that they would much rather have the HK416.

    • Lance

      True the HK 416 is in Spec Ops use as well.

      • FAL FAN

        HK416 won’t be in service with certain units much longer.

    • Lance

      Sorry FAL fan man

      Your wrong the USMC will be using them for a long time So dose Delta Force and Reviews from the Norwegian army show it is a reliable and good weapon system. The 416 is seeing alot more use than you beloved SCAR L FAL MAN.

      • FAL FAN

        If you don’t know about how the HK416 is viewed currently by its two biggest government customers, then that completely discredits you as being some sort of expert like you pretend.

      • Lance

        Going to personal attack prove your scared your little scar wont be used by all US forces. Sorry it wont be SEALs use them yes. But here like other proof I have that your wrong about the HK 416/ M-27 IAR

        http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/2011/07/marines-m27-iar-wins-skeptical-infantry-afghanistan-071911/

        Your hatred of US gun is unfounded not every body love your precious SCAR. NOT all U forces will use them be thankful the SEAL do.

        I can easily find more success stories about the 416.

      • FAL FAN

        http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=92876

        Those are actual tier one special forces posting with yellow screen names. See for yourself what they have to say about the HK 416.

      • Lance

        Sorry I don’t see an unofficial tip by a man on some hack thread evidence when all the brass and professional reporters say the opposite.

      • W

        I believe the 416 will be in service for a time to come. It is a fine weapon, though has flaws characteristic of a AR15 platform when integrated with a gas piston (meaning all gas pistons have been affected on a very limited scale).

        The 416 is a superior weapon than the DI M4 when utilizing a sound suppressor. Besides having advantages in increased reliability, critical parts within the bolt carrier group remain properly lubricated. DI guns using sound suppressors create huge issues in the long run.

        There have been a few isolated incidences of so-called carrier tilt, which is a characteristic of a few isolated gas piston AR15’s. The platform was not intended to use a gas piston, though I have yet to see a 416 that is crippled or worn down due to carrier tilt (and the ones i have seen have had four years worth of operational environment and regular range use beat into them). The carrier-tilt “problem” (which has been blown way out of proportion by the pro DI crowd) is easily remedied with a different buffer spring.

        The H&K M4 (back before colt threw a fit about the “M4″ designation, forcing H&K to rename it the “416” for, i believe, a F— you sake to Colt) was contrived before the massive aftermarket accessories to DI Ar15s, which substantially increased their reliability. It is well known that Mk 18’s have their own fair share of individual problems (such as increased wear) that the 416 is unaffected by.

        Technologically, the 416 is superior to the Mk 18 in every aspect. When your mission is lightning fast raids (like what “special” units do), the weights between the two rifles is negligible.

        I cannot agree that the 416 is superior to the SCAR. The 416 has introduced in 2004 to 1st SFOD-D, a full five years before the SCAR variants saw operational use. Comparing the two when it comes to service record is flawed, since five years is a disproportionate advantage given 21st century defense acquisition patterns.

        The SCAR features a superior design and reliability. Given the plethora of information i have provided countless times, im not even going to bother stating any more of it.

    • FAL FAN

      But the main two groups using the HK416 right now are wanting to get away from it and will be doing so soon. One of those grass is always greener things I suppose.

      • Colin

        @Lance
        “Your hatred of US gun is unfounded not every body love your precious SCAR.”
        Could you explain that a little, as they are both designed and built (to a degree) in europe…

      • Lance

        Sorry FAL MAN but your wrong on that since all reports on official sources show that the HK 416 is liked and preforms well. It would have never passed USMC IAR test is it was a piece of junk you stated.

      • W

        honestly, it was shortsighted to adopt the M27 IAR. the platform has not been officially adopted yet, it marginally (meaning less than ideally) accepts GI magazines, and it has its own individual parts. In addition, the only USMC authorized magazines are 30-round USGI mags, not even the HK steel magazines that come with the 416 as a kit (utter stupidity). the M27 needs a 45-60 round magazine.

        Considering it is a unique weapon, the marines are making a lot of assumptions on what the next service rifle will be (which will, as history proves, surprise everybody for the worse). I believe they are putting the idea cart before the capabilities horse. If something drastically different is adopted, then they will be forced to replace the M27.

        I am not bashing the concept of the IAR. The concept should have outlived the BAR but didn’t, due to stupidity, and now we are re-learning 60 year old lessons.

    • 18D

      This is actually true. Army SF operators have not been nearly as receptive to the SCAR as the SEALs have. However, one thing you gotta understand is that the SEALs have always been the most innovative unit when it comes to weapons selection. Just look at the MK18, SEAL Recce rifle, SR25, MK11, etc. The Army SF are generally speaking not big “gun” guys. Hell the entire military is not made up of very many “gun” people. Most tend to be “beginner” level shooters with very little knowledge and experience on different weapons and their manipulation. My point is that those kinds of shooters tend to just stick with what they know best. That’s probably going to be an AR of some sort.

  • MarkM

    It’s got a reputation from those who know that it does work. That leaves the why?

    It’s different. That ID’s the user to his fellow team members, and doing things right, the BG’s don’t ever know where they are coming from. The SEAL’s don’t make a habit of lounging in a Green Zone to be scoped out.

    Historically, special units are more likely to not use general issue weapons. It really doesn’t mean the SCAR is some awesome better bullet launcher – it still uses the same ammo, same mags, same optics. Control layout is largely Stoner.

    It’s just different.

    • Alex-mac

      More accurately it’s the same, but better.

    • mosinman

      ^ -_-

  • Lance

    Most of the buys will be to replace weapon worn out over a few years in service.

    The Navy SOCOM in anyway is the only real champion of the SCAR and SEAL brass was the main reason the rifle was made in the first place.

    • W

      “The Navy SOCOM in anyway is the only real champion of the SCAR and SEAL brass was the main reason the rifle was made in the first place.”

      Rightfully so. Out of the entire collection of military brass, it is the contention of anybody with any common sense that SEAL brass are the most credible experts when it comes to acquiring new equipment. It is more than Navy SOCOM that is the champion of this weapon, it is SOCOM in general.

  • only1911

    Bah.
    They are buying.
    That says something.
    Sure M4s are good..good enough etc..
    SCAR looks great.. have not fired so I don’t know.. I guess the NAVY knows.
    SOCOM don’t need 5.56 when they got 7.62..
    At least the SCAR haters aren’t correct that it is “dead”.
    What I want is a civ Mk16 in 6.5…

  • AnointedSword

    lol I hear a birdie, it said…”if a SEAL uses it, it must function pretty damn good.” They put thousands of rounds through their weapons just during training, I think they know what they are talking about. With that said, grow the heck up and stop bashing everything new that comes out. I feel much better now…thank you!:)

  • 18D

    Look, I’m gonna say this and be done with it, at least until the next SCAR article.

    The reason I back the SCAR so heavily is because of my history with it. I was in the 3rd SFG when the SCAR came to us for Operational Testing. I saw it, handled it, and HATED IT. I didn’t want anything to do with it. I was a M4 guy.

    Fastforward to 2009 and I became a contractor at the Special Missions Center at Crane. My job was to work with the SCAR and SOPMOD programs for RDAT&E, product improvement (PIP), and training SOP development. As I ran the SCAR Weapons (MK16/17/20 & MK13), I started to realize that it wasn’t so bad. It was crazy accurate, nearly 100% reliable, and offered a capability that SOCOM had not yet seen in any other weapon system. I ran it through everything it could possibly go through and it just kept going like a champ! It was easy to use and efficient once you got used to the controls. As my shooting skills developed to a higher level, I started to love the SCAR even more.

    You don’t have to like the SCAR , but you should respect what its about. It was built from the ground up as a new weapon system not built on an existing design. FN also used operator feedback to develope the system into its current form. There arent too many guns in the inventory that can say that! It represents a step forward in the right direction.

    The SCAR is here to stay. SOCOM has gotten back to the roots of the SCAR, what they refer to as the “Objective SCAR System”, which has a common receiver for both 5.56 and 7.62. This conversion kit already has years of development under its belt and is the future of the SCAR. It will be here for many years to come. Whether or not it makes into the conventional units doesn’t matter.

  • mosinman

    only thing i like about the scar is how it looks, kinda has a funky look to it, idk

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