What gun did Seal Team 6 use to kill Osama Bin Laden? HK416
Rumors have been flying around the interwebs about what gun was used to kill Osama bin Laden.
The first gun to have been reported as the weapon used to take down Bin Laden was the Sig Sauer P226 pistol. The mainstream media and Hollywood love the image of a Jack Bauer type super-commando using a pistol to take down a roomful of terrorists.
This infatuation with pistols has led many of the general public to believe pistols are far more deadly than rifles. So it was no surprise that the media began to report that Sig P226 was the gun used to takedown Bin Laden. Apparently sales of the Sig P226 have spiked ...
There is nothing wrong with the Sig P226. It is a very fine pistol, but it is hard to believe that the elite of the elite would assault a highly fortified compound armed with a pistol in a relatively weak cartridge (9mm or .40 S&W) that is unable to penetrate even Type II body armor. The SEAL team members were probably carrying SIG pistols, but I doubt any where used.
Solider Systems later reported that a Colt CM901 chambered in 7.62x51mm was used to gun down world's most notorious terrorist.
Soldier System retreated their report soon after. The Colt CM901 was a romantic choice. We all like to think of black operation teams using highly sophisticated weapons, like the Colt CM901, that are not available to the general public. In truth, there is no incentive for even the most well funded commandoes to use small arms that have not been thoroughly tested and proven in battle by conventional forces.
Kit Up blog then reported that SEAL Team 6 probably carried the H&K MP7 submachine gun. This sub-caliber machine gun is said to be popular with special forces types. It fires the 4.6x30mm cartridge, capable of cutting through body armor, and has a high rate of fire.
Soldier System updated their original report, saying instead that the H&K HK416 rifle was used by SEAL Team 6 to kill Osama. Kit Up and other milbloggers agreed that this was likely the gun used.
While not the most exotic gun, it is a highly regarded piston-operated version of the AR-15. It makes a lot more sense that the SEALs were using short-barreled carbines rather than a submachine guns or pistols. The HK416 is also notably used by the USMC as the M27 Infantry Automatic Rifle.
Unlike the Colt CM901 or MP7, civilians can purchase the HK416 as the civilian legal H&K MR556A1.
We will probably never know exactly what the SEALs used, but the HK416 is more feasible than most.
[Hat Tip: Sean, Ace of Spades, Lance, Traction Control, Boing Boing ]
But that’s all I could get him to spill.
im a member of team 5 its not 6 but its basically the same same family anyway what pisses me off is how people believe that one of our own would be stupid enough to burst into a room with just a sidearm drawn no and the fact that the top of his head was blow off a 9mm bullet does not leave a cavity that could do that the most likely weapons are the m4 hk4 16 mp7 or other weapons
@cc19,
But that’s all I could get him to spill.
I was talking to Chuck the other day and he admitted he HAS serial#1, and 49 silver bullets…
+1
[quote]In truth, there is no incentive for even the most well funded commandoes to use small arms that have not been thoroughly tested and proven in battle by conventional forces.[endquote]
To be fair-Delta and SEAL Team Six did adopt the MP-5 more or less on the advice of European SF units; it certainly hadn’t been used in battle by anybody in the US military prior to them. I doubt the SEALs were rocking CM901s either given that the thing isn’t available yet as far as I know, but the MP5 (and MP7; I know from personal experience that SOCOM bought at least a few of these) does set a precedent for SOCOM issuing relatively untested equipment.
TBH just about any of the variety of rounds for the M4/MK18/HK416 is going to be devastating at the typical ranges inside a building. We’re talking feet as a general rule of range, not yards, and definitely nothing over 50 meters or so.
Or the Mk318 SOST, which is better suited to the shorty 416s or Mk18s these guys probably had.
They would have been something like 77gr HPBT bullets, which are going to do pretty terrible damage at point blank range.
I’m late to the comment party, but here goes: who really cares? He’s dead, let’s make it a national holiday.
@cc19: Why ya hatin’ on the mall ninjas? They keep the tacticool gun makers in business.
Well considering it’s obvious Osama was executed then a pistol may very well have been used. I certainly wouldn’t trust tiny 5.56 bullets to do enough actual brain damage.
High-speed low-drag types don’t care about pistols. They’re only used when your primary is out and you need to keep someone’s head down instead of reloading, or if something goes wrong with the primary. Like someone grabbing the barrel of your primary. You draw the secondary and shoot them in the face.
Nobody uses the MP5 anymore. It doesn’t have a bolt hold open which fucks your reloads. Also the ergonomics are terrible. The Canadians we cross trained with hated them.
Hk-416 is heavy. Crane bought some but Crane buys everything and plays with it for a while, literally they buy everything and not all of it works out.
I think the H&K 416 is a logical choice. Other SEAL teams use the Mk 18 SBR, though the 416 seems to be getting popular with other units and supposedly thats what DEVGRU uses. Its all speculation of course. I know the 416 would make an excellent suppressed weapon as well.
I doubt they used M855 green tip ammunition. its not the best stuff available and many regular army units have access to Mk 262.
@Marc
I’m guessing a really high-end unit like DEVGRU would develop their own, custom 1911 pistol as Delta did. I don’t know of a reason why the fancy coatings that are applied to a P226 or HK45CT couldn’t be applied to a 1911. Hell, I’d actually buy one. I’m only mildy interested in paying thousands for a pistol that won’t shoot when a bit dirty (hand built 1911s). I’d rather have something with slightly looser tolerance, slightly looser groupings, and a whole lot more durability. That’s just me, though.
First, if Chuck Norris killed OBL, he didn’t need no stinkin’ gun. Second, according to the descriptions of the head wound in the actual photos, it was a large calibre (meaning at least 9mm and more likely .45) capable of tearing away the top front quadrant of the skull. Different velocities, masses, calibres, etc. can make similar wounds, but given the nature of the mission, the target, and the team, they were surely using large calibre carbines with hollow points or modified fmj’s.
I’m guessing Mk18. P226 makes no sense, I doubt a SEAL would rely on their secondary. I really doubt it was 7.62 or anything exotic. No need for armor piercing (especially since they were also focused on minimizing collateral damage)
@Alex
I don’t think SEALs have much use for the lump of rust a 1911 would turn into rather quickly in a salt water environment.
Maybe they shot him with some thing big like 7.62 so osama’s head resembeled a rotten tomato more than anything. but it seems highly unlikely a gun chambered for that would be used, considering that it was CQB. maybe they used something that fired 6.8SPC? they are special forces after all
Yeah the Mk18 mod 0, no doubt, they even a picture of the navy seals using them on it’s wikipedia page.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Close_Quarters_Battle_Receiver
The HK416 is I believe mainly being used in Afghanistan for it’s resistance to dirt. Remember also it has that condensation freezing problem, unlike the traditional AR-15.
Neal,
Almost every rifle caliber will defeat softbody armor which the 4.6 is design to do.
My money’s on the Mk18 mod 0.
The MP-7 never made much sense to anyone who knows much about the round it fires. The 4.6 is designed to defeat body armor. Against a group of bomb-makers and gunmen who don’t usually wear even closed-toe shoes? Lolwut?
But, whatever slammed a slug in Osama’s dome, that Belgian is good boy! Who’s a good boy? You are! Yes, you get a toy! Who’s a good boy? Who’s a good boy?!
Just for the record, even the the great and mighty.45 wont penetrate certain body armor. I believe they went in with either m4s, subs, or something new we do not know about. It also depended on what they were facing. These guys have shot enough to know there is no such thing has a magic bullet. It is all about getting bullets down range and accurate.
This is all random speculation… my speculation is on a suppressed custom-built 9″ AR variant in 300BLK, maybe with the AAC upper and suppressor on a Mk18 lower.
Alex: DEVGRU when it was founded in the late 70s rejected the .45; it’s in Rogue Warrior by Marcinko, and, I think, Delta Force by Beckwith that Col. Beckwith strongly suggested to Marcinko that DEVGRU should issue .45s and Marcinko said no.
But yeah, irrelevant topic really; me personally, I like to think it was really Ahnuld with his M202A1 from Commando that took the killing shot. :p
Hopefully it was indeed the Hk416. The steep $3,000 price tag of the MR556A1 makes it less accessible to all the Modern Warfare mall ninjas who want to pretend to be SEALs.
Sawed off double barrel shotgun obviously.
rootman,
You joking right? If not I suggest you go back and do more research on the subject.
Let use logic and brain power. Go pick up a 9mm bullet. Is it small? Yes it is. It’s .355 in diameter. Do you think that enough room to put explosive into it? I don’t think so.
Badabbom,
H&K MP5 isn’t in used anymore for SEAL.
i agree that it is possible that a 9mm or a 40s&w could have done the trick,i doubt that such a weapon would be used in this situation.
I’d bet that it was a M4 carbine that was used. It’s familiar and it works. Probably the only thing special/different about it was that it was a flattop version with a red dot sight or similar.
The other possibility was that it was a H&K MP5, again because it’s familiar and it works.
It was a SEAL dog named Dave (DevGru).
The picture can’t be released as the dog ate most of Bin Laden’s head after First biting his wife on the leg.
Larry Vickers on his facebook page says that his sources say it was a HK416.
I think you got it right in one of those pictures… Jack Bauer did kill Bin Laden.
Who cares what was used? Bin Laden is shark bait. It’s all about advertising for the companies that make these firearms. I can see a new wave of mall commandos and airsofters saying “this is the gun that killed Bin Laden.”
alright, I know the P226 is the weapon of choice for normal SEALs, but this is team six, not a normal SEAL team and its been said that its modeled after Delta force, so is it too much to assume that devgru adopted delta’s weapon of choice and used a highly modified m1911?
I was there – it was actually a Jiminez JA-25
Oh… I was so happy last night when this was first posted and I saw myself holding the HK556. Technically guess is was not a 416, thus the change.
Typo in the last paragraph about the Sig, “. . . but I doubt any where used.” should read, “but I doubt any [b]were[/b] used.”.
I must be the only person on the Interweb that thinks that this whole topic is completely silly. Who cares what gun killed OBL? Pfff.
It was the all-American M1911, serial number 1, using a single silver bullet, from the hands of Chuck Norris himself.
Here’s an analysis by a guy who would know: http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/guns/2011/05/gun-killed-osama-bin-laden
http://www.fsdip.com/website/VBRBelgiumHome/English/General9x19mm/The9x19AP63mmcartridge/tabid/337/Default.aspx
The new approach to develop bullets, which can satisfy the VBR-FBI-CRISAT demands, asking for a big permanent wound cavity and a high incapacitation effect. This has a direct influence on the sabot choice. To increase the likelihood of immediate incapacitation the sabot must also take part on the wounding mechanism. This means that the penetrator and the sabot must penetrate a soft bulletproof vest. Two projectiles increasing the content of the permanent wound cavity and double the chance to hit a vital organ. To achieve this, the penetrator point and the sabot point are provided with the same angle. This allows the sabot to also penetrate the body armor.
Nominally you can buy the MR556A1. The reality is a bit different. I was looking at getting one, but due to the absolute lack of availability I went with an LWRC M6A3 for my piston AR needs. Paid $700 less, got a better stock and grip, and that neat plated bolt and bolt carrier to boot.
mmm well on the 9mm those guys don’t use ball ammo..
They use ap. explosive and who knows what.
Multiple, accurate, ap 9s will do the job.
At that level caliber is not much of an issue.
Accuracy and penetration…
.. head shots..
http://www.fsdip.com/website/VBRBelgiumHome/English/General9x19mm/tabid/261/Default.aspx
solomon & tyler, it was a typo, but I did link to the correct gun
Also, when SEALS carry a compact carbine, it’s usually a Mk 18. Navy VBSS teams lost their Mk 18s when Crane recalled them for SEAL use. Maybe my old rifle took the shot.
And Human Soldiers were used – No, Klingons, no, Hobbits!
Obama, 72 versions of everything!