Magpul 7.62x51mm PMAG 20-LR

magpul_pmag_762x_51mm_20_lr-tfb-tm

The long-awaited 7.62x51mm PMAG has finally been given a name and is now in production. At $19.95, Magpul are going to be selling truck loads of these mags.

The PMAG-LR holds 20 rounds of 7.62x51mm or .308 Winchester rounds and is compatible with the following rifles …

  • Mk11 / M110
  • KAC SR25
  • DPMS LR308
  • LMT 7.62 MRP
  • LaRue Tactical OBR
  • LWRC REPR
  • POF P-308

It is not compatible with the AR-10, M14/M1A or SCAR-H.

Interesting, SCAR-H compatibility (or incompatibility) is not mentioned. I am not sure what to make of this omission.

Many thanks to optimus.prime for sending me the information.

UPDATE: Thanks to R.A.W and Rex for SCAR-H info.

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Steve Johnson

Founder and Dictator-In-Chief of TFB. A passionate gun owner, a shooting enthusiast and totally tacti-uncool. Favorite first date location: any gun range. Steve can be contacted here.



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  • http://rexopolis.blogspot.com Rex

    The SCAR-H being left off the list is no surprise…I am quite certain it doesn’t use a DPMS/SR-25 pattern magazine. It instead uses what looks for all the world like a FAL mag with the “nose” chopped off and a mag catch slot cut into the side.

    If I were FN, that’s how I’d do it, developing a good mag is hard work and if I already had one that worked pretty well, I’d just use that one.

    There was alot of speculation that the “notch” in the new DSA Metric FAL magazines was there to accommodate the SCAR-H.

    There’s a great picture of a SCAR-H magazine out there, but now when I google “SCAR-H Magazine” I get a bunch of MW2 nerds talking about how it’s too small… and also complaints about magazine capacity.

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      Rex, ah, thanks for the info.

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      Rex, thats because in MW2 it is full-auto only. Very unrealistic.

  • War Wolf

    I will buy them as soon as they hit the shelves. I don’t have a .308 yet but Spikes Tactical is bringing a billet milled .308 lower to market that will be compatible with these mags. Let the buying orgy begin!

  • R.A.W.

    The PMAG 20-LR will not function in the SCAR-H:

    http://m4carbine.net/showpost.php?p=505024&postcount=40

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      R.A.W., thanks.

  • Matt Groom

    It is also not compatible with the H&K G3/CETME, FAL, or RFB. I thought it somewhat ironic that they chose to use the least common .308 magazine for their first .308 mag. I suppose they wanted the Massoud to use the SR-25/M110 magazines, so that’s what they designed it for.

    Personally, I wish they’d come out with a new M1 Carbine magazine, but I’m a dreamer.

  • Lyle Savant

    Hello,

    Where can I purchase a PMAG 20-LR for my DPMS Panther .308?

    Thanks,

    Lyle

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      Lyle, Magpul website.

  • Taisto Takkumaki

    Hi
    You say that the magazine is not compatible with the AR-10.
    That is only half of the truth. It will fit early models of AR-10 rifles.
    Those which were made on 60′s at Netherlands. ;)
    Early model of AR-10 rifle uses same magazines as SR-25 rifle and DPMS 308 versions and new model of Oberland Arms OA-10

    Cheers
    Taisto

  • http://www.predatorwild.com Heath

    Fantastic news! I may buy a few of these for my brother for his LR308. Any idea when they’ll be available?

  • Lance

    Yeah Steve but will they make one for a M-14? I like to get one for that.

    The FN dosnt take a AR-10/M-110 mag so there not interchangeable.

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      Lance, no word on any M14 mags.

  • Jim

    The 20 LR? Is that the younger cousin of the 22 LR?

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      Jim, thats what I thought. Pretty confusing.

  • jdun1911

    The SR25 magazine are now the standard of all AR 7.62 rifles. Magpul understand this and that’s why they made the PMAG 20-LR. So don’t buy an AR 7.62 that isn’t compatible with SR25 magazines.

    It will probably the standard magazine for all new 7.62 rifles in the future.

  • Carl

    So, this dust cover thing, is that really a useful addition or just a way to stop the magazines from expanding while stored? Keeping in mind that even the quintessential tupperware gun maker Glock uses steel magazines… I wonder whether the possible drawbacks vs metal magaziness is worth the savings. How many magazines do people actually need, and how often do they wear out or get lost?

    Here is a FAL on full auto:

  • jdun1911

    I wondering if they reduce the powder on the cartridge to get that control. Clearly they did something if not reduce the powder charge, maybe a very good muzzle break or maybe he is just very good/experience at controlling it. Firing full auto is pretty much useless in 7.62 battle rifle like the FAL.

    This is what a typical off hand full auto looks like.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbL648HSVO0&feature=related

    The dust cover is just marketing. It doesn’t really do nothing other then sell more magazines. If the magazine is like the Pmag 30 round M version then the dust cover can be converted into a magpul using paracords.

    The standard US GI carried six magazine on vest and one in the rifle. Israelis carries four total from what I understand.

    My rule of thumbs is 5 magazines for each handguns. 3 to carries 2 for backup. For competition at least 10 handgun magazine because they will get heavily used and damage. It suck to no spare magazine in hand when that happen.

    Ten for each rifles. 6 to 7 in use the rest for backup. For competitions at least 10 maybe 15.

    Most people will never damage their magazines because of the simple fact that most people don’t train like they are fighting. Also they shoot once a year. Those small majority that train and complete hard will understand that dropping a full loaded magazine on the ground is bad. Stepping over them is also bad. Spring corrosion is also bad. Spring elasticity limits have been reached due to heavy use is bad. etc.

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      jdun1911, I agree. That is some amazing full auto control.

  • d

    SCAR-H said it uses a proprietary magazine I believe

  • Matt Groom

    I don’t think that dust cover is mere marketing, jdun1911. The problem with plastic magazines is that the feed lips have to be made thicker in order to be strong enough to last for many years of uses. The down side is that if the lips are made thick enough to withstand constant use and abuse, they tend to change the feed angle of the rounds as they come out of the magazine, which can lead to bolt-over-round jams. The way Magpul got around this was to make the feed lips just thick enough to withstand a fair amount of abuse, then they molded in a small ramp in the front of the magazine to keep the bullets from hitting and to correct the feed angle. Then, with the use of the dust cover for storage, they can make the magazine resist abuse better and keep the feed lips on the Pmag from stretching over time when a loaded mag is stored. It’s really a feed lip protector, keeping dust out is just a bonus.

  • http://www.thegunzone.com/556dw.html Daniel E. Watters

    FWIW: NSWC-Crane has put out a sources sought notice for lightweight SCAR-L and SCAR-H magazines.

    http://www.crane.navy.mil/acquisition/Synop/10RJN79.htm

    • http://www.thefirearmblog.com Steve

      Daniel, have they posted the specs somewhere?

  • Redchrome

    Can someone please explain to me the difference between AR10 and SR25 magazines?

    I’ve seen AR10 mags made from M14 mags; AFAIK Armalite used to offer a trade-in deal: send 2 M14 mags and get one AR10 mag free. Obviously there needed to be an accomodation on the back of the magwell for the remnant of the M14 locking lug; but I don’t see how that would affect putting in a magazine that didn’t have the lug.

    Not having an SR25 mag to compare with my M14 mags, I humbly beg an explanation from those more versed than myself. :)

    As for the FAL on full auto… the shooter’s stance in each of the videos does give a substantial hint that the guy who controlled it well had a bit more practice. I’ve shot a Thompson and found it a miserable thing to control; but I’ve heard of people who could keep it on a target the size of your hand at some substantial number of paces I can’t remember clearly and wouldn’t expect people to believe without proof anyway. :) Jeff Cooper said that you pretty much have to balance the gun on its recoil; other people have said that you put forward pressure on the forward grip, which also makes sense (would tend to make the gun want to rotate around your forward hand, rather than your shoulder). I don’t have enough experience with such things to really know tho.

  • jdun1911

    There is no feed lip creeping in Pmag. It been independently tested. You can do a google search on if you like.

  • jdun1911

    Here what the Mapul said about the dust cover. Basic marketing.

    1. The protect the feed lips from external impact damage.
    2. Seal the top from dust and debris.
    3. Unload the rounds from the feed lips for long term storage.

    http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=17&t=399192

  • d

    I read it on gun wiki:
    http://guns.wikia.com/wiki/FN_SCAR-H

    if you type “SCAR-H proprietary magazine” theres many results. The mag the SCAR-H uses doesnt look like any of the AR10/SR25 type mags

  • Lance

    FN pice of junk. The SCAR H uses modefied FN FAL mags. Look at them the mags even look like FAL mags. And since th “L” dont seem to reccomend GI 5.56 mags it looks like another delecate plastic gun.

    As for P-mags I know there good in some situations but dont the fact they break from a shot 8ft fall make them less durable than steel mags?

  • Matt Groom

    Jdun1911,

    It happens in any magazine where the lips are thicker than the original material used. Glass reinforced polymers are very tough because they stretch and flex and eventually the material will become brittle as if by work hardening and break. Granted, this may take 20 years, but it will happen. What Magpul said and what I’ve said are practically identical. I think Pmags are superior to nearly everything out there, but I’m not gonna get rid of all my Aluminum GI mags any time soon.

  • http://www.thegunzone.com/556dw.html Daniel E. Watters

    I have not seen any detailed specifications on the SCAR-H magazine. This is just a market survey to determine what is commercially available.

    As for the current AR-10 magazine, you have to remember that Mark Westrom designed the rifle during the high capacity magazine ban. He went for the modified M14 magazine as these were more available than the original AR-10 magazines.

  • Carl

    So on 10 mags you save what, $300 vs steel mags? Not really a fortune compared to the rest of your kit and ammo it seems like. But if they’re just as good it’s obviously a no-brainer.

    I wasn’t suggesting that full auto 7.62 nato is actually a practical option in general. I’ve tried it with the G3 with less than stellar results.
    But I bet you could learn to do it reasonably well with a lot of training. And being big and strong probably helps. But then there is the limited magazine capacity of course… so probably not very useful even if you could hit what you were aiming at.

  • Carl

    By the way, what is the reason for using 20 rounds? It seems like you could probably get like 25 or so without ending up with an overly long magazine, and I think there are 30 rounders for the FAL. Not sure if they’re reliable though.

  • http://www.predatorwild.com Heath
  • jdun1911

    Carl,

    I would assume it would be the spring elastic limit. A 30 round 7.62 x 51 NATO magazine will reach its elastic limit much much faster then a 20 round magazine.

    Everytime you compress and decompress the spring elasticity degrade a little bit. The spring strength must be able to keep up with fire rate of the firearm. If it couldn’t, failure to feed happen.

    Some of you probably wonder if you keep it the magazine loaded will it degrade the spring elasticity. Unless the elasticity limit have been already reached the answer is no. It will not degrade the spring. Only compressing and decompressing does the spring eventually wear out.

    Heath,

    Looks like it.

  • Aurélien

    “I wondering if they reduce the powder on the cartridge to get that control. Clearly they did something if not reduce the powder charge, maybe a very good muzzle break or maybe he is just very good/experience at controlling it. Firing full auto is pretty much useless in 7.62 battle rifle like the FAL.”

    Well with an awful lot of live fire drills and training you can get to that result. Keep in mind that the guy balances himself forward too, and its something you dont have to do when tou shoot weaker calibres in full auto.

    Anyhow, battle rifles are not made for full-auto combat use. Then are semi-auto rifle that are able to fire full-auto in case of emergency. In the late 40s the 20rds mag was pretty much double or quadruple what a standard rifle could store, and in semi-auto fire you can pretty much drop 15 to 20 people with that when trained.
    On the other hand, the russian went the other (german) way : they developped weak munitions and rifle made for full-auto fire with a 30 to 40rds mag, made to be used by untrained people. The semi auto mode was not to be used unless you were really out of ammo. And that’s the assault rifle concept.
    Efficiency vs volume of fire.

    And the SCAR Mag is a FAL mag modified. Got my hands and both. They are the same, the only difference is how they lock in the gun.

  • Carl

    jdun1911, spring elasticity… so effectively in the end it depends on the spring being able to handle the weight and/or the inertia of the cartridges?

    I guess you also can’t have too much spring force or it’ll overcome the feed lips.

    I’ve been by told an engineer though that as long as you run springs within their design limits they should last more or less forever. And that it is only when you exceed the limits they lose strength. I don’t know if that’s true or not though.

    I think a wider magwell probably could help a lot with designing new high-capacity polymer magazine systems. That’ll give you room to make thicker and stiffer feed lips and sides on the magazine, thus enabling a higher spring force and more rounds.

  • Carl

    Also, someone should look into four-column magazines, like in the 9×19 Spectre M4:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectre_M4

  • http://www.thegunzone.com/556dw.html Daniel E. Watters

    FWIW: There was a 25rd magazine for the 7.62x51mm Galil variant, and I understand that ArmaLite is now offering one for their current AR-10. Eventually, you’ll run into the issue of the magazine becoming too long to comfortably go prone. For example, some users of the Stg44 complained of the same issue with their 30rd magazines. Note that the 7.92x33mm round has the same case head diameter as the 7.62mm NATO.

    Very few four-column magazines have been successful. The most prolific was the 50rd “coffin mag” for the Soumi SMG.

  • http://762x51mm.blogspot.com/ TJL

    Check Mate Industries *(CMI)* who are the current USGI M14 mag manufacturer makes a 25 round M14 mag also.

  • http://www.predatorwild.com Heath

    I ordered one of these as a gift for my brother. I’ll make it over to his house to play with it eventually.

  • destroyer

    OMG! my hopes got raised too high! i thought somebody would actually produce good polymer magazines for the M1A!!!!

  • Jesse

    I assume they are working on a 7.62 x 54 emag

  • Steve

    20 round in my DPMS, Hooray!

  • Steve

    Thank God, where have these been? Never had a problem with my DPMS factory mags or my C-Products but these are awesome! hehe yippee!

  • http://www.predatorwild.com Heath

    Hey, does anyone know if they will offer this PMag in something a little smaller? I am limited here in my state to magazines which hold fewer than 11 rounds for hunting deer.

  • charles222

    I’ve seen a SCAR-H be shot on full-auto before, in 5-round bursts; it’s very controllable.

  • Chrontius

    I know the Kel-Tec RFB is supposed to be FAL compatible, but can anybody say definitively if these work with it?

  • Ty

    Does anyone know if Magpul is going to create a 7.62x51mm (.308 Winchester) mag that holds 30 rounds? This is for a Masada/Bushmaster ACR. Thanks, Ty