FBI Purchases 20mm Rifles with suppressors
Wyn Boniface was quick off the mark in spotting a pre-solicitation request from the Federal Bureau of Investigation for the purchase of two Anzio Ironworks 20mm magazine fed rifles (cannons) with suppressors.
The Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) intends to award a non-competitive, sole source purchase order to Anzio Ironworks Corporation, 1905 16th Street N, St. Petersburg, FL 33704 for two (2) Magfed 20mm Rifles and accessories in accordance with FAR 6.302-1, only one responsible source and no other supplies or services will satisfy agency requirements.
The FBI intends to procure the following items:
Magfed 20mm Rifle with Belgian Camo Overcoat finish. Includes bipod, brake, handguard, free floated barrel and case (Qty: 1 each)
Magfed 20mm Rifle with Navy NWV Camo Duracoat finish. Includes bipod, brake, handguard, free floated barrel and case (Qty: 1 each)
Non-firing bolt assemblies (Qty: 2 each)
Extra magazines (Qty: 4 each)
Suppressors in 20mm (Qty: 2 each)
The solicitation number is 10-Q-LDQ002768.
Anzio's rifles are chambered for the 20x102mm Vulcan cartridge. When loaded with a non-explosize 1543 grain projectile the round can achieve 3395 fps, generating 39500 ft/lbs of muzzle energy (compared to 14,000 ft/lbs of the .50 BMG).
At longer ranges the relatively poor ballistic coefficient of these large rounds will cause a significant decrease in energy but when used with high explosive ammunition this is not a problem as the on-target kinetic energy is less important than the chemical energy contained in the warhead.
It would be interesting to find out what these rifles will be used for. With just two rifles being purchased they might be destined to just training and / or evaluating the usefulness of this class of weapon.
Reminds me of an old joke … about ‘aving ze beeg guns!
Many years ago, when the FBI’s main job was protecting federal witnesses and such, they used to go out lightly armed.
That all changed on the courthouse steps one day when several agents were ambushed and out-guned by gangsters with automatic weapons.
The FBI made it plain then, and it has ever been so, that this will never happen again. All the agents are well trained, and well armed. to exactly that end. Its practicaly a mission statement.
Just argue with an agent and you could be face down in a second.
(yes sir, no sir, six bags full)
Pull a BAR, and they got a 50 caliber, pull a 50 Caliber and they got a tank. If they got some 20mm rifles, then thats undoubtly the reason.
Just be glad they are the good guys.
Wow, let me guess a Fed or a Fed koolaid dispenser, may be both? There are very few good guys left in the capacity of FBI, CID,COD,ABC123 or you local yocal. Now that is downright sinful and a major crime against “we the people” Bet I get thrown on a list for speaking my mind, what do you think? Take care of the real criminals and I bet the statistics change almost instantaneously. I only hope there are enough Americans left that can read and think independently or we are all doomed with this type of thinking.
Its not speaking your mind that gets you into trouble.
Its what you have your mind on that will.
But I can hear your rail against the Man.
And I howl with you.
I can smell you brother.
Can you smell me?
Peace.
I can’t wait for the mad scientist who is going to figure a way to send a 30mm round down range with a bolt action rifle and a scope…
Inspiring!
jdun1911- this is not classified as a “heavy weapon” as there is no such official designation.
What this IS classified as is a Destructive Device- since it has a rifled bore over one half inch in diameter. These items would need to be registered with the BATFE by a private citizen or corporation as such and the $200 tax would have to be paid.
@Mickey: one would assume the rifles come with firing bolt assemblies. the NF ones would presumably be used for practice.
-mm
Maybe they have another Waco or ruby ridge to jandle.
Non-firing bolt assemblies (Qty: 2 each)
You would figure they would buy firing bolt assemblies, this seems weird to me…
Part of the FBI’s mission takes agents assigned to SWAT and the national hostage rescue team (HRT) to garden spots such as Afghanistan, Iraq, Somalia etc. While deployed agents are embedded with Rangers, Seals, A-Teams etc. Having been deployed in this capacity I have seen the need for some very specialized weapons when the situation dictates.
The FBI probably wants a couple, so the government can work on getting them banned.
Actually I was being sarcastic. I couldn’t think of a more difficult weapon to buy, train with or transport.
But yeah, now that I think about it, having one of these babies is probably the cheapest low tech way to bring down an aeroplane from a kilometre away. After all, missile technology is very expensive and tightly controlled. Someone or some rogue state ‘making’ just a really big gun shouldn’t be too difficult.
And I agree that it looks rather heavy and impractical. An AT4 or LAW or something similar seems a lot better for taking out armored vehicles. I can’t see any reasons why the cops couldn’t have one of those in their trunk.
“One would be to strategically place it under concealment to take out a possible treat to the president.”
lol, watch your spelling there, unless you care for a visit from the G-men. I imagine they don’t much appreciate people “taking out treats” by means of a 20mm AT rifle to tha Prez.
Probably ‘investigating’ the destructive effect of such a weapon on everyday civilian vehicles such as cars, trains and airplanes.
subby, good point.
Big Daddy,
The war on drugs out in the water is usually fought by the Coast Guard, not the FBI. I’m not even sure how far the FBI’s jurisdiction extends into the seas. The Coast Guard’s Hitron teams are about the best shooters from a chopper. However, I don’t see them hoisting this thing out of the door of a sea king. All I can think of is a Waco style incident. Instead of entering the building and risk your men, Demo the dn place. But i don’t know FBI SOP so I wouldn’t know. Maybe they are just putting this information out there to make DHS jealous, who knows…..
Imagine the media frenzy if they killed someone with this weapon. “FBI employ light artillery in hostage situation, kill three”
I can think of a few uses for it. One would be to strategically place it under concealment to take out a possible treat to the president. Such as a lightly armored vehicle, like an SUV with armor plating getting to the president’s limo close enough to use a bomb or RPG. Even a 50 cal might not stop it quickly enough.
Also it might be used for interdiction. Since it says Navy cammo maybe it can be used in the drug war against boats. A few of those rounds would be much more effective than bursts from an M240. Better accuracy for instance and it would maybe destroy the engines without killing everyone on board and destroying the evidence. Using an AP round would get the job done better than a 50 cal. There is a sabot round with a tungsten core for the 20mmx102mm. I would think that would tear through anything.
As a former anti-tanker and later a tanker, this weapon is not for taking out tanks. It would do wonders vs. anything less than an IPV like a Bradley though. Sure, it will penetrate the back end of a tank, maybe the top armor, at very close range — but hanging a 4′ rifle out a window to engage a tank from above is risky — and also not part of the FBI’s mission! I don’t think this is a precision long-range anti-personnel sniper weapon, there are existing weapons in .338 & .50 that can outshoot their optics and all but the best shooters.
If I was interested in stopping a vehicle that ran my gate/roadblock/etc and a tripod-mounted weapon like a M2HB wasn’t an option, this would work. Or, at least at close range, maybe a M79 grenade launcher loaded with M433 HEDP — but those are “too old” for today’s high-speed FBI.
I’m guessing it’s just for shits and giggles.
It reminds me of the Harkonnen 30mm single-shot AT rifle from the anime Hellsing lol. But really why would you need such a rifle? I mean yeah anti-vehicle use but isnt that what a Barret M-82A1 “light fifty” is for? if anything shouldn’t the military have this? why police? Though the twenty mil anti-material concept isnt new. note the Lahiti anti tank rifle and a Japanese design both from WWII
By the way, I take back my previous comment about it not firing the full scale 20mm round. Pics on Anzio’s website indeed look like the 102mm version.
The FBI is in the apprehension business, so I doubt they’re inclined to destroy a truck full of bad guy like we would in the .mil world. Also, making a 1500 yard shot into a window isn’t an easy proposition and it’s pretty much a guarantee that the FBI will control the battlespace in any scenario requiring use of said weapon, so ELR shots are likely not part of their METL.
I can see with the HE round you could drop it right into a car and fix everyone in it. Same if it’s a truck. Need to get inside a van or U-haul? 20mm can do! And if they hijacked a armored car (Brinks, not Bradly) the 20mm should work.
As for the FBI use, ok, no biggie. Say a nuke armed terrorist was in a room and you needed to off them from a distance but not get everyone on the whole floor. The 20 mm, from say, 1500 yards, could put one through the window and get the terrorist and his buddies right next to him (or her.)
Well, there is a direct action wing of the FBI in the HRT. It’s not unreasonable for them to have a wide variety of precision shooting capabilities to deal with domestic scenarios. Now, big bore rifles tend to not be ideal anti-personnel platforms unless the engagement distances are extreme. In the case of HRT, like most LEO snipers, they’re probably not going to deal with any long range precision shooting. However, the other reason for big bore rifles is payload capabilities used in Hard Target Interdiction. Perhaps it’s the need to be able to knock out a generator in a precision manner (both in time and function) or to stop a vehicle. In most cases .50BMG will do the trick but perhaps they’ve identified a deficiency that a 20mm cannon would alleviate?
It’s only 2 rifles, guys. Maybe this isn’t even for fielding?
I don’t think any modern tank can survive getting hit from the rear or top from 20mm. That rifle won’t be easy to transport and move around. So you have to wonder if the FBI bought it for fun and giggles?
Well, you never know when a elephant entirely covered in Level IV armor might go on a rampage and take hostages.
i saw one of their .50 BMG’s for sale on JGsales.com
Clearly it is for the alien-robot revolt that is looming.
I also feel there is no need for the FBI to possess such a weapon. I can’t even fathom a situation where a heavy cannon would be essential in the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s mission, which is to investigate, not eviscerate. What do the expect the next wave of Terrorist attacks to be? Armored Bulldozers? Do they know something I don’t? This is ridiculous.
Actually, I’m pretty sure the Anzio fires a trimmed down 20mm vulcan round, not the full scale 102mm you find on aircraft cannons. There are quite a few flavors of the 20mm round and almost all that I’ve seen for shoulder fired weapons are reduced in length and overall velocity and even then still require some kind of recoil management system. These reduced rounds tend to top out around 2500fps but the size of their projectiles makes them superior payload cartridges over say .50BMG.
[...] Normalizing law enforcement militarization [...]
Yikes!
Bill – I think you might be surprised at the damage a 12ga. slug out of a rifled barrel can do to things like drive trains. Locally available and a lot cheaper than a 20mm.
I think that it’s probably more for just testing what the guns are capable of.
Notwithstanding the Granby bulldozer incident, which does not seem likely to be repeated, I cannot see any legitimate law enforcement purpose for this. It seems like yet more militarization of law enforcement. If there’s a threat that requires this type of firepower, it’s a military threat, for the military to handle.
War on Drugs.
Hmmm, let me see, this is a 20mm rifle that is available for purchase by the public. Yeah, if I was in the FBI, I’d want to give this puppy a try to see what it would do to the vehicle armor on the Presidential limousine and other high value targets.
Now where can I get a CCW and a holster for this bad boy?
Might they be worrying about the need to neutralize, say, a surplus APC or pillbox at a Scientology compound?
Memories are short.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8qOb3ISYN0
It may not have been able to fully penetrate the cab armor, but it may be able to disable parts of the drivetrain. A “mission kill” is still good. Since I imagine the muzzle blast and report are quite impressive, a suppressor would benefit the user’s hearing both during practice and deployment.
Sorry, I would like to add M4carbine.net is where I found the information.
Glad to know they can now take out WWI tanks that terrorist must be massing on our boarders . . . oh wait, that is not happening. Their is no LEO need for such a weapon.
This is most interesting indeed..lets wait and see. I feel it’s a good thing for the 20mm weapons out there..like the Neopup..smile
As a tax payer I would like the FBI to explain why they would need this type of weapon. I believe it is classify as a heavy weapon. At the very least an anti-tank rifle.
hide at 3 miles in the montain of afgha or in a village of Pakistan ,and with this gun i will put a nice smile on the face of a terroriste ..so we will not have the cost of sending 3 plane ..12 heli ..1 500 000 k missil to get the job done without the colateral damage .
this is what for this gun is build,save money and life on the battle field.