Evan

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IPSC is a game and the fact that participants use tap-rack drills is irrelevant to the topic of defensive shooting in general and second strike capable pistols like the P-11 in particular. Nevertheless, the fact that the vast majority of pistols used in gun games have no SS capability might have something to do with why competitors don’t try it.

As for my experience with light primer hits, the time frame spans over two decades of shooting. This was noted in my original article. There was only one firearm that had an ongoing light hit problem and was quickly discarded. Excluding that particular gun, the issues were always with the ammunition.

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I suggested that competitive shooters experience FTF’s just like anyone else who uses firearms. So it would be interesting to know what they consider the fastest way to get past the malfunction and continue shooting.

Because that is after all what someone in a defensive combat situation will be trying to do as well, right (getting past the malfunction and continue shooting)?

No other comparisons.

Also it would be interesting to know why your bad primers always fire on the second try. I’m no gunsmith but it seems like that could be your pistol not striking them with enough force. So maybe you could use a stiffer hammer spring or something…

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As stated a couple of times before, 1) Every single light primer strike I’ve personally experienced has ignited with a second hit. Unless you use poor quality reloads or fail to properly maintain your weapon, yours probably will too; 2) Tap-rack drills are fine if you have distance and cover on your side. Often if not most times one doesn’t have either advantage to count upon; 3) Tap-rack drills are easy with service-size pistols on a benign range. They’re not nearly as simple when you’re using a pistol that can fit in an outstretched palm. Then add in the likelihood you’re fighting for your life at arms length, you may be injured or wounded, and may be knocked to the ground or otherwise disoriented from the norm.

Sorry to see you equate shooting games with close range, lethal combat. You have my sincere hope that you’re never faced with the latter situation.

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How do we know that two attempted strikes is the optimal number?

Personally I think I’d rather move on to a fresh round immediately rather than keep trying with one that has proven defective.

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As I noted in my response, I can put all my shots into a “full size” B-27 silhouette at 50 yards. I say full size in quotes because I don’t know many adult males who aren’t bigger than a B-27. Nevertheless, if I can get to my local indoor range in the near future I’ll update this post with results shot at the maximum 10 yard distance.

Google “ArmaLaser.” They make a unit specifically for K-T’s that aren’t equipped with rails. It’s not an issue.

I’m glad you appreciate the value of second strike capability. Tapping the magazine does nothing for you if there’s a light primer hit. Racking the slide takes even more time and may well be more difficult to accomplish than many people realize when you’re under immediate threat, adrenaline is squirting out of your ears, your heart is pounding and manual dexterity has gone out the window. Add the possibility you could already be injured or wounded and the situation rapidly gets complicated. Far easier and faster to pull the trigger a second time if you experience a light primer strike. If the round doesn’t fire with that followup, then perform tap-rack and hope for the best. There really isn’t much alternative.

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I would have liked to have seen some tests at 10-20 yards. I don’t think it’s out of the realm of possibility that you would need to engage at this range if you’re outdoors. I’m not expecting absolute super-accuracy out of this thing, mind you, I just think it would have been nice for the review.

I’m noticing that this gun doesn’t have a light rail, though, and thus wouldn’t seem to be a candidate for a laser, either.

I do agree that second-strike is an important capability for a DAO pistol – tap-rack-bang works great at longer ranges, but if someone’s rushing you at 7 yards, a quick second trigger pull is better than getting knifed trying to tap-rack-bang.

-Erwos

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I’ve also experienced the “dirty dot syndrome.” Maybe it’s the paint K-T uses, but the dots do get funky rather quickly. Much faster than say the white outline on S&W rear sights I’ve carried over the years.

It’s funny you have that dream about facing banditos. I had the exact same dream back in the Dark Ages when I carried Charter Arms Bulldogs on a regular basis. As much as I liked the idea of an ~ 20 oz., highly concealable .44 Special, the three I owned just never instilled confidence largely due to their awful trigger pulls. Thankfully those Bulldogs are long gone and so are the nightmares. I’ve only had good dreams about my P-11.

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Yes, the P-11 is different from the two K-T’s you own. There has been some talk that a second generation P-11 may incorporate a PF-9-type trigger mechanism, in an effort to somewhat reduce length and pull weight. I personally hope it doesn’t happen. It’s good to have choices.

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Thanks for reading the article.

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Old Painless did a good job at explaining the drill and how to clear a double feed in pistol.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu2.htm

Tactical Response tap rack, and bang video.

http://rpginn.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=753&Itemid=39

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The proper way to handle a misfire is tap, rack, and bang. It is taught in every firearm training schools.

Second strike capability is for gun range.

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As I noted in the post, in my experience every stubborn primer has ignited on the second hit. I’ve yet to see compelling evidence that the next one won’t do the same. To me, racking the slide at distances found in most gunfights is a recipe for injury or death. Hence my personal requirement for second strike capability in an defensive handgun.

Joshua,

IMO tap-rack drills are fine if you have distance and cover on your side as well as a fairly large slide to grasp. The P-11 is a small weapon with a very stout mainspring. Neither feature is conducive to fast and sure manipulation under the stress of close personal combat. Please don’t get me wrong, if my P-11 doesn’t go BANG! with the second trigger stroke I assure you I’ll try to clear the problem and get back into the fight…if I live that long.

countertop,

I share your opinion of the P-11. They are a super little pistol.

Erwos,

What do consider adequate accuracy for a pocket-sized CCW? As shown in the photo above, five of seven rounds were essentially touching at the distance considered to cover the vast majority of documented shootings. Would you be satisfied if I told you I can keep an entire magazine in the scoring rings of a B-27 silhouette mounted at 50 yards?

As for night sights, no it doesn’t have them. None of my current defensive handguns have them. I’ve tried night sights in the past and not been impressed for a few reasons. IMO, if your handgun of choice can accommodate a laser you’re much better equipped with one than with tritium sights.

Stuart,

Thanks for the compliment. You are right about the trigger pull. It is fairly heavy and long compared to many other pistols. But no more so than revolvers used by women for personal defense over the past 100+ years. The slide could well be a problem for many gals, the infirmed or elderly. It’s one of the reasons why my wife prefers a S&W Model 65 3-inch.

If the manufacturer doesn’t develop a Kel-Tec compatible RSS-type unit soon, an original Armalaser is on the near horizon for this P-11. How do you like the one on your P3-AT?

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