Comments on: New Glock 19 and 23 RTF2 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/ Firearms not Politics Thu, 18 Mar 2010 01:11:57 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Carl http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-24796 Carl Fri, 29 Jan 2010 12:59:57 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-24796 Don't be sorry Eagle, I'm just asking. And I agree with you. :) Don’t be sorry Eagle, I’m just asking. And I agree with you. :)

]]> By: Eagle21 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-24733 Eagle21 Thu, 28 Jan 2010 22:36:41 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-24733 Sorry for my error Carl. The point was that is should be common knowledge (for those of us living in the U.S.A.) that Federal Properties (except parks) are "Weapon-Free" zones. Of course no-gun zones are Good: If you are a murderer and don't want people shooting back in self-defense. Firm believer that Glocks are an excellent self-defense weapon. Proud owner/user of a G-21SF. Sorry for my error Carl.
The point was that is should be common knowledge (for those of us living in the U.S.A.) that Federal Properties (except parks) are “Weapon-Free” zones. Of course no-gun zones are Good: If you are a murderer and don’t want people shooting back in self-defense. Firm believer that Glocks are an excellent self-defense weapon. Proud owner/user of a G-21SF.

]]> By: Carl http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-22961 Carl Fri, 01 Jan 2010 20:18:32 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-22961 Eagle21, are you making the point that no-gun zones are a good idea, or just that it is common knowledge (in the U.S.)? I don't live in the United States, if you are wondering why I wasn't aware of these rules. Eagle21, are you making the point that no-gun zones are a good idea, or just that it is common knowledge (in the U.S.)?

I don’t live in the United States, if you are wondering why I wasn’t aware of these rules.

]]> By: Eagle21 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-22923 Eagle21 Thu, 31 Dec 2009 21:23:45 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-22923 I surprised at the comment made by Carl about falling off his chair when he "learned" that Ft.Hood was a No-Gun Zone. ALL US Military facilities are Federal property and therefor inherantly "No Personal Firearms Zones". You may store your personal weapons on a military base/post and use any on-base/post shooting facilities, but you are not allowed to carry your own firearms. Just like the Post Office or other Federal Property. No big deal and never has been, except those poor bastards had no way to shoot back. 27year Combat Disabled Veteran - USAF. I surprised at the comment made by Carl about falling off his chair when he “learned” that Ft.Hood was a No-Gun Zone. ALL US Military facilities are Federal property and therefor inherantly “No Personal Firearms Zones”. You may store your personal weapons on a military base/post and use any on-base/post shooting facilities, but you are not allowed to carry your own firearms. Just like the Post Office or other Federal Property. No big deal and never has been, except those poor bastards had no way to shoot back. 27year Combat Disabled Veteran – USAF.

]]> By: TN http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-20182 TN Wed, 02 Dec 2009 02:56:53 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-20182 The latest word leaking out is that Glock will soon unveil the 4th Gen frame in January 2010. The new frame is rumored to have interchangeable backstraps in addition to an ambidextrous slide stop lever, plus a new texture like Jason mentioned. The RTF frames have been apparently burning through some police uniform shirts due to its abrasiveness. I guess Glock learned what they needed to from the RTF release and now they want to catch up with Smith and Wesson with the newest features. Should be some exciting times ahead! The latest word leaking out is that Glock will soon unveil the 4th Gen frame in January 2010. The new frame is rumored to have interchangeable backstraps in addition to an ambidextrous slide stop lever, plus a new texture like Jason mentioned. The RTF frames have been apparently burning through some police uniform shirts due to its abrasiveness. I guess Glock learned what they needed to from the RTF release and now they want to catch up with Smith and Wesson with the newest features. Should be some exciting times ahead!

]]> By: anointedsword http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-18307 anointedsword Tue, 17 Nov 2009 04:39:28 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-18307 Aww man that dropped the crescent slide serrations for the 19? I agree, I prefer usability over looks. Aww man that dropped the crescent slide serrations for the 19? I agree, I prefer usability over looks.

]]> By: C http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-18257 C Mon, 16 Nov 2009 20:57:55 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-18257 Commentary on kill ratio from mass murderers is insensitive and shows that you are out-of-touch. This is not the time or place to calculate, speculate, or infer regarding two of the worst public shootings in American history. I took a shooting course on Saturday with a Glock 17 in RTF2, and it was magnificent. I had to borrow the gun because of my primary's failure, and the texture, handling and aesthetics of the pistol were beyond anything I could have catalog-commandoed, and are functional enough to recreate the image of 'tacticool'. Skate tape is dead, long live RTF2! Commentary on kill ratio from mass murderers is insensitive and shows that you are out-of-touch. This is not the time or place to calculate, speculate, or infer regarding two of the worst public shootings in American history.

I took a shooting course on Saturday with a Glock 17 in RTF2, and it was magnificent. I had to borrow the gun because of my primary’s failure, and the texture, handling and aesthetics of the pistol were beyond anything I could have catalog-commandoed, and are functional enough to recreate the image of ‘tacticool’. Skate tape is dead, long live RTF2!

]]> By: Julio http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17931 Julio Wed, 11 Nov 2009 14:47:02 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17931 Well, I'm in no rush to get a five seven pistol regardless. I'm definitely seeing a new RTF2 Glock 19 in my near future. I like the 17 RTF2 very much and had to pick one up as soon as I held one. I really like the texture and it does "grip" better in the hand.. or should I say feels like a more solid hand hold. Anyway, good introductions from Glock. I can't say I'd let go of either my 19 or 23 that I currently have, but I would consider the new 19 as a welcome addition to my Glock holdings. Well, I’m in no rush to get a five seven pistol regardless.

I’m definitely seeing a new RTF2 Glock 19 in my near future. I like the 17 RTF2 very much and had to pick one up as soon as I held one. I really like the texture and it does “grip” better in the hand.. or should I say feels like a more solid hand hold.

Anyway, good introductions from Glock. I can’t say I’d let go of either my 19 or 23 that I currently have, but I would consider the new 19 as a welcome addition to my Glock holdings.

]]> By: Don http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17927 Don Wed, 11 Nov 2009 14:09:56 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17927 Both anecdotal and inappropriate. I don't think that logic is sound. These events hardly qualify as a controlled test. And... I mean, these were domestic massacres of innocent people for christ's sake... not brochure material for calibers! -Don Both anecdotal and inappropriate. I don’t think that logic is sound. These events hardly qualify as a controlled test.

And… I mean, these were domestic massacres of innocent people for christ’s sake… not brochure material for calibers!

-Don

]]> By: jdun1911 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17900 jdun1911 Tue, 10 Nov 2009 23:48:27 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17900 The 5.7×28mm is such an awful caliber. It has the same ballistic as the .22 mag. The running joke is that it takes the entire magazine to actually kill your opponent. seven-six-two from AR15.com pointed out that the mortality rate was much lower. I bet that the majority of the killed would have been save if they were given medical treatment faster. "So the 5.7 shot 43 people and killed 12. A 28% mortality rate. At Virginia Tech (9mm and .22) ratio was 33 were killed and 18 wounded. A 65% mortality rate." http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=953175 The 5.7×28mm is such an awful caliber. It has the same ballistic as the .22 mag. The running joke is that it takes the entire magazine to actually kill your opponent.

seven-six-two from AR15.com pointed out that the mortality rate was much lower. I bet that the majority of the killed would have been save if they were given medical treatment faster.

“So the 5.7 shot 43 people and killed 12. A 28% mortality rate. At Virginia Tech (9mm and .22) ratio was 33 were killed and 18 wounded. A 65% mortality rate.”

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=953175

]]> By: Carl http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17860 Carl Tue, 10 Nov 2009 10:01:54 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17860 I fully agree with Jason. If you are worried about the looks of a Glock you are missing the point. I too think the old serrations could be improved upon. Having said that Glock should be careful when they change things or introduce new features that the change is actually a good thing and thoroughly tested and bug-free. For example I'm not entrely convinced about the utility of the ambidextrous mag release. It is quite stiff and difficult to operate and I would suggest that people buying Glocks stay away from it unless you shoot left-handed and cannot learn to operate a right-handed release. Regarding mass-murders I would suggest that they will always occur. Some people will occasionally go nuts for all sorts of reasons. Whether the underlying cause is some religious or political conviction or just plain insanity is not that interesting, and no amount of psychiatric screening or surveillance will stop it anyway. What is interesting is what you should do or not do to physically deter and stop such rampages. And a good start would be to not deny people the possibility to defend themselves. I almost fell off my chair when I read that an army base was a "gun free zone". The stupidity that comes out of an irrational fear of guns is truly mind-boggling. I fully agree with Jason. If you are worried about the looks of a Glock you are missing the point. I too think the old serrations could be improved upon.

Having said that Glock should be careful when they change things or introduce new features that the change is actually a good thing and thoroughly tested and bug-free. For example I’m not entrely convinced about the utility of the ambidextrous mag release. It is quite stiff and difficult to operate and I would suggest that people buying Glocks stay away from it unless you shoot left-handed and cannot learn to operate a right-handed release.

Regarding mass-murders I would suggest that they will always occur. Some people will occasionally go nuts for all sorts of reasons. Whether the underlying cause is some religious or political conviction or just plain insanity is not that interesting, and no amount of psychiatric screening or surveillance will stop it anyway.

What is interesting is what you should do or not do to physically deter and stop such rampages. And a good start would be to not deny people the possibility to defend themselves. I almost fell off my chair when I read that an army base was a “gun free zone”. The stupidity that comes out of an irrational fear of guns is truly mind-boggling.

]]> By: Don http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17836 Don Mon, 09 Nov 2009 17:27:11 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17836 The Fort Hood mass murderer used a 5.7x28mm pistol. Watch closely as this caliber is demonized as if the fact that it is slightly exotic makes it more dangerous or "evil" (whatever that means) than a .45 or 9mm. They'll probably call it a cop killer, as if cops are bulletproof except for this caliber. They'll cite it's potential armor penetrating variants even though the victims weren't wearing armor and even if he wasn't using those variants. How about for once when something like this happens we focus on WHY he did it and try to address those important underlying issues rather than WHAT he did, which can not be undone. Lets spend time thinking about how to identify and treat potentially crazy folks rather than debating on whether or not they have a favorite caliber or weapon preference. The former is an action which can prevent the killings, the latter just changes slightly how the killing will be done. -Don The Fort Hood mass murderer used a 5.7×28mm pistol. Watch closely as this caliber is demonized as if the fact that it is slightly exotic makes it more dangerous or “evil” (whatever that means) than a .45 or 9mm. They’ll probably call it a cop killer, as if cops are bulletproof except for this caliber. They’ll cite it’s potential armor penetrating variants even though the victims weren’t wearing armor and even if he wasn’t using those variants.

How about for once when something like this happens we focus on WHY he did it and try to address those important underlying issues rather than WHAT he did, which can not be undone. Lets spend time thinking about how to identify and treat potentially crazy folks rather than debating on whether or not they have a favorite caliber or weapon preference. The former is an action which can prevent the killings, the latter just changes slightly how the killing will be done.

-Don

]]> By: Jason Smith http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17746 Jason Smith Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:01:47 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17746 AP, As Jdun1911 says, the RTF2 is an option (for now). The forthcoming Gen 4 pistols will have a different texture than either the standard or the RTF2. Somewhere in between from what I've read. Like I said, the RTF2 works fantastic for what it was designed for, ie, open carry in duty and competition. I agree that the grip texture sucks for CCW. However, from my experience, the new slide serrations are an improvement in every way that matters to me. Jdun1911, My definition of technology is anything man-made to accomplish a task. Paperclips, pencils, forks, etc... Read something by Henry Petroski to understand my usage of the term. The Gen 2 without fingergrooves was nice, but I would have liked a light rail. AP,

As Jdun1911 says, the RTF2 is an option (for now). The forthcoming Gen 4 pistols will have a different texture than either the standard or the RTF2. Somewhere in between from what I’ve read. Like I said, the RTF2 works fantastic for what it was designed for, ie, open carry in duty and competition. I agree that the grip texture sucks for CCW. However, from my experience, the new slide serrations are an improvement in every way that matters to me.

Jdun1911,

My definition of technology is anything man-made to accomplish a task. Paperclips, pencils, forks, etc… Read something by Henry Petroski to understand my usage of the term.

The Gen 2 without fingergrooves was nice, but I would have liked a light rail.

]]> By: jdun1911 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17744 jdun1911 Fri, 06 Nov 2009 23:43:00 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17744 Glock sell them at the same price to dealers. That doesn't mean the dealers will price it the same. It different cuts not new technology. I still think the 2nd generation Glocks are the best. Glock sell them at the same price to dealers. That doesn’t mean the dealers will price it the same. It different cuts not new technology. I still think the 2nd generation Glocks are the best.

]]> By: B Woodman http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17733 B Woodman Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:29:12 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17733 Is that as an option-option (costs extra $$$)? Or as a standard-option (would you like it in THIS or THAT? No extra charge for either one) Is that as an option-option (costs extra $$$)?
Or as a standard-option (would you like it in THIS or THAT? No extra charge for either one)

]]> By: AP http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17729 AP Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:03:52 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17729 I just ordered a G26. I wanted to make sure I got one in case they all went to this t-shirt destroying RTF and banana-scoop slide gripper deal. Looks like they'll offer both, for now. The new embellishments are very un-Austrian, to me. I just ordered a G26. I wanted to make sure I got one in case they all went to this t-shirt destroying RTF and banana-scoop slide gripper deal. Looks like they’ll offer both, for now. The new embellishments are very un-Austrian, to me.

]]> By: Jason http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/07/new-glock-19-and-23-rtf2/#comment-17728 Jason Fri, 06 Nov 2009 15:45:09 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=9046#comment-17728 I was disappointed to see that they've dropped the crescent slide serrations on the Glock 19RTF2. Too many people whined about how they were "ugly" without even trying them. They work. They are superior to the current slide serrations. Now we will be denied superior technology due to people who value the appearance of a tool over it's functionality. I was disappointed to see that they’ve dropped the crescent slide serrations on the Glock 19RTF2. Too many people whined about how they were “ugly” without even trying them. They work. They are superior to the current slide serrations. Now we will be denied superior technology due to people who value the appearance of a tool over it’s functionality.

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