Comments on: Tavor rifle performing well http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/ Firearms not Politics Thu, 18 Mar 2010 01:11:57 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Dan http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-23494 Dan Sun, 10 Jan 2010 17:45:43 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-23494 Tavor and many others lack proper trigger guard presumably because it allows the gun to be operated with mittens on. That's the explanation an israeli soldier told me. When i asked him "does it get that cold in israel?", he said "sometimes, but we don't have military issue mittens." Another explanation I heard from a marine sniper (who is also an excellent gunsmith) is that because bullpup designs don't have a magazine in front of the handgrip, the shooters gripping fingers lack protection when you're shooting from a covered position with just barrel sticking out. And once you put a full hand guard, it's hard to sub-divide it and put in an extra trigger-finger guard. Difficulties in shooting a bullpup rifle from a covered position along with slower change of magazines, difficulties in implementing ambidextrous control cheaply, and need for a full review of tactics and re-training of 1m+ personnel are the reasons why US military won't adopt bullpup design for a very long time. Tavor and many others lack proper trigger guard presumably because it allows the gun to be operated with mittens on. That’s the explanation an israeli soldier told me. When i asked him “does it get that cold in israel?”, he said “sometimes, but we don’t have military issue mittens.”

Another explanation I heard from a marine sniper (who is also an excellent gunsmith) is that because bullpup designs don’t have a magazine in front of the handgrip, the shooters gripping fingers lack protection when you’re shooting from a covered position with just barrel sticking out. And once you put a full hand guard, it’s hard to sub-divide it and put in an extra trigger-finger guard. Difficulties in shooting a bullpup rifle from a covered position along with slower change of magazines, difficulties in implementing ambidextrous control cheaply, and need for a full review of tactics and re-training of 1m+ personnel are the reasons why US military won’t adopt bullpup design for a very long time.

]]> By: Allen http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-11174 Allen Mon, 22 Jun 2009 01:07:35 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-11174 Looks like an extremely well designed and efficient bull pup design, except for the knuckle/brush gaurd. I cannot for the life of me understand that design concept, especially when the weapon was designed for military applications. jd1911, I have to agree with you. That weaopn has accidental discharge written all over it. I would be paranoid taking it hunting in the woods by myself. Looks like an extremely well designed and efficient bull pup design, except for the knuckle/brush gaurd. I cannot for the life of me understand that design concept, especially when the weapon was designed for military applications. jd1911, I have to agree with you. That weaopn has accidental discharge written all over it. I would be paranoid taking it hunting in the woods by myself.

]]> By: CS http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8413 CS Mon, 06 Apr 2009 04:18:03 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8413 I own a semi-auto Tavor here in Canada and like it... got a good deal on it, was barely used by some mall ninja. Maybe 40 rounds were put through it before I bought it. I got it last fall. I own a semi-auto Tavor here in Canada and like it… got a good deal on it, was barely used by some mall ninja. Maybe 40 rounds were put through it before I bought it. I got it last fall.

]]> By: Overload in CO http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8342 Overload in CO Fri, 03 Apr 2009 06:50:44 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8342 I remember some talk about a company out of Florida importing a semi auto Tavor, but nothing has come of it yet. I remember some talk about a company out of Florida importing a semi auto Tavor, but nothing has come of it yet.

]]> By: Dave http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8339 Dave Fri, 03 Apr 2009 04:07:18 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8339 Anyone know what kind of Chest rig/ plate carrier is standard issue in the IDF? Or the Marine corps for that matter? Anyone know what kind of Chest rig/ plate carrier is standard issue in the IDF?

Or the Marine corps for that matter?

]]> By: jdun1911 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8329 jdun1911 Fri, 03 Apr 2009 01:37:19 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8329 75+% of the rifle is made out of plastic? 75+% of the rifle is made out of plastic?

]]> By: Sean Nack http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8321 Sean Nack Thu, 02 Apr 2009 23:49:05 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8321 maybe they think the big funky plastic thing is sufficient? i'm not a "fan" of bullpups per se, but i'm also not ready to hate on the concept. i think there's a good bullpup idea out there, we just haven't gotten to it yet; i would almost vote for the FN2000, but i don't like the mag release (picky, i know). maybe the tavor is the one. though, with a trigger guard, obviously. maybe they think the big funky plastic thing is sufficient?

i’m not a “fan” of bullpups per se, but i’m also not ready to hate on the concept. i think there’s a good bullpup idea out there, we just haven’t gotten to it yet; i would almost vote for the FN2000, but i don’t like the mag release (picky, i know). maybe the tavor is the one. though, with a trigger guard, obviously.

]]> By: jdun1911 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8314 jdun1911 Thu, 02 Apr 2009 17:12:10 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8314 FAMAS doesn't have a trigger guard. The report is full of BS. They are saying that conscripted soldiers have nothing to bitch about. I find that hard to believe. Do another survey in a year and I bet you it will be the opposite of this report. FAMAS doesn’t have a trigger guard.

The report is full of BS. They are saying that conscripted soldiers have nothing to bitch about. I find that hard to believe.

Do another survey in a year and I bet you it will be the opposite of this report.

]]> By: Carl http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8311 Carl Thu, 02 Apr 2009 16:18:11 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8311 More bullpups without trigger guards: http://world.guns.ru/assault/as81-e.htm http://world.guns.ru/assault/as72-e.htm http://world.guns.ru/assault/as26-e.htm So that makes eight at least. A quick unscientific estimate based on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Bullpup_firearms that comes to something like 20-25% of the lot. How many non-bullpup rifles lack trigger guards? Ergo many bullpup rifles lack trigger guards. It is possible that there hasn´t been many accidents due to this. But it is still a stupid way to build a gun, IMHO. What is the benefit of deleting the trigger guard? Any ideas? More bullpups without trigger guards:
http://world.guns.ru/assault/as81-e.htm
http://world.guns.ru/assault/as72-e.htm
http://world.guns.ru/assault/as26-e.htm

So that makes eight at least.

A quick unscientific estimate based on
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Bullpup_firearms
that comes to something like 20-25% of the lot.

How many non-bullpup rifles lack trigger guards?

Ergo many bullpup rifles lack trigger guards.

It is possible that there hasn´t been many accidents due to this. But it is still a stupid way to build a gun, IMHO. What is the benefit of deleting the trigger guard? Any ideas?

]]> By: Steve http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8306 Steve Thu, 02 Apr 2009 14:08:14 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8306 sure, they don't all, but it is still weird that some do not have a trigger guard. Others that do not have a trigger guard are the XM25, ACR and SAR 21. The early prototype for the VHS did not but they added it later, a very good move in my opinion. sure, they don’t all, but it is still weird that some do not have a trigger guard. Others that do not have a trigger guard are the XM25, ACR and SAR 21. The early prototype for the VHS did not but they added it later, a very good move in my opinion.

]]> By: Brandon http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8305 Brandon Thu, 02 Apr 2009 13:55:28 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8305 f2000, p90, rfb, vhs, sa80, m17s, g11 and a dozen other bullpup designs all have "proper" trigger guards. so your statement is false, there are really only two bullpup designs that don't: steyr aug and the tavor i agree though it is an accident that has probably happened a couple times and no one has gotten hurt, yet. f2000, p90, rfb, vhs, sa80, m17s, g11 and a dozen other bullpup designs all have “proper” trigger guards. so your statement is false, there are really only two bullpup designs that don’t: steyr aug and the tavor

i agree though it is an accident that has probably happened a couple times and no one has gotten hurt, yet.

]]> By: Linoge http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8301 Linoge Thu, 02 Apr 2009 10:33:50 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8301 *sigh* No fair teasing us with firearms we are likely to never have over here ;). *sigh* No fair teasing us with firearms we are likely to never have over here ;) .

]]> By: Steve http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8300 Steve Thu, 02 Apr 2009 08:55:06 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8300 Carl, I agree. I have often wondered why they resist adding a trigger guard. Carl, I agree. I have often wondered why they resist adding a trigger guard.

]]> By: Carl http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/04/02/tavor-rifle-performing-well/#comment-8299 Carl Thu, 02 Apr 2009 08:53:23 +0000 http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/?p=5830#comment-8299 Why do so many bullpup rifles lack proper trigger guards? It looks like an accident waiting to happen to me. Why do so many bullpup rifles lack proper trigger guards? It looks like an accident waiting to happen to me.

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